pluto

I did some dyno tuning and baseline pull today on Jonathan (j8635621) Rx8 with different maps loaded on his AP. You can follow the link for the results.
https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-engine-tuning-forum-63/need-rx8-w-access-port-dfw-area-141360/


I will scan the dyno charts tomorrow for reference.

devildog1679

MT or AT?

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

Ah, heard you were getting the license when you were in the La Crescenta area at J&G a few months ago..

Has to be 6mt, no way a 6at is throwing 184 on a mustang...

Would you say this was a relatively conservative (aka SAFE) tune?

J8635621

iTrader: (10)

Its an MT. Mazdaspeed intake and JIC exhaust.

pluto

I wouldn't consider it being a conservative tune. However, this is the first Rx8 tune with the accessport so I still have alot to learn myself.

pluto

here're the dyno charts for each map

Please note the following:

black line is the a/f ratio
Red line is the horsepower curve
blue line is the torque curve

devildog1679

Pluto,

You should close one of the threads your just double posting. Good job with the tuneing.

r0tor

iTrader: (1)

if j8635621 want to use MM's maps, it looks like he needs to be running MM's stage "1b" maps for cars that run unexplainably lean (like mine)... he also shouldn't be using cobb's maps as he has an aftermarket intake and they advise against that


but nice data nevertheless

pluto

This thread was made to compare the difference between each map and to see how safe they are in respect to each other based on the mod he has(intake and exhaust). One thing to note is that it doesn't matter how lean or rich you run below 7.5krpm, you will not see any gain or lost in hp (maybe 1-2hp). Well, maybe if I start playing with the timing in midrange, it might see some gain. however, the gain will be insignficant to really spend too much time tuning the area. all of the maps were rich from 7.5krpm to 9krpm with the exception on the map I created. This is where the hp gain comes in and the area I spend the most time on.

I think if Jonathan have some spare time, I would like to try his car using the stock air filter. I needed to create a map with exhaust ONLY anyways.

J8635621

iTrader: (10)

I haven't been running the Cobb stage 1. It was just used for dyno purposes. The MM map that was run was 1_2b I believe. I had just switched maps a day before heading to Gotham Racing, and I may have switched to the incorrect map (damn medicine I've been taking has been screwing with me). I'll do my best to make another trip to Gotham Racing soon and we can get more comprehensive testing done. MM has already sent me some revised maps to try. Sorry about my mistake.

mysql

were these maps switched while on the dyno? I recall reading that the car performs better if you on the map for a while on the street first.

J8635621

iTrader: (10)

I was running the MM map for a little more than a day (165ish miles), and the others were run consecutively on the dyno. There was usually some time spent idling on each map , but I don't remember which ones or if that would really matter.

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

I remember hearing the same thing. Regardless, if all maps were dyno'd back to back to back to back all of them would be effected equally by not being driven on for a while (each of them should change X amount).

Steve, have you tried raising the redline?

"...most changes were above 8000 RPM. This is where the stock mixture goes substantially rich, wasting fuel and power." -racing beat

So, they make their changes from 8000 - 9300 (roughly 1300 play area) while you're making your changes 7500 - 9000 (1500). Perhaps something along the lines of 7500-9300 would be optimal? (1800 of play)

You're making my decision between accessport ($700) and racing beat ($300) harder!

pluto

the redllne was set to 9300rpm. I might gain another 1-2rwhp at most? Either way, no matter what map you are running (stock, Cobb, mine, or MM and I assuming Racing beat also), you will not notice any difference in mid range until all ports are open.... I spent a little time in mid range changing a/f ratio and didn't see any gains. I even overlay each chart and didn't notice any difference until after 7.5krpm. The stock map is rich enough to run almost any mods you want (intake, exhaust, midpipe) so if you're not considering AP, why bother getting Racing beat? At least AP gives you more option to change different maps.

Just my .02

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

Its not the peak gain Im talking about, moreso the overall higher hp when compared to stock (even if this is only 7500-9300)

I know this is hub so when converted only means so much but
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?k...wcd2tPD3yASFWA
there's a consistant few more hp higher than oe then ~7500 the difference grows
Though his peak is only 9.8 crank higher, the curve seems like it smoothed out making more consistent power at a better rate - I was saying an increased rpm range to play with not for higher hp but a better curve.

But yeah - Well, racing beat's 35 years of history and relatively conservative nature as well as the $400 price difference is swaying me. Sure accessport reads and clears CEL's but thats nothing little OBDII for $30 can't take care of. So, is $370 worth swapping maps when NA the gains are only so much?

Gah, discussing na hp gains feels so silly with this motor lol Thanks for the input btw :D

devildog1679

I have a question to pose, many people with aftermarket mods (CAI, Catback ec...) have had issues with Cobbs stage 1 map, running dangerously lean (I'm one of them). How would you know what your AFR's are with the raceing beat flash? Sure you can get a scantool but that will cost you. If you are lean, now what? They only have two flashes.

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

Well, I was going on the impression that racing beat's tune was somewhat conservative and thus avoided these problems (while lowering the potential) (just like their quiet intake, quiet exhaust, hardly lowering springs, etc - all prove to have been developed very well and offer gains but all are somewhat conservative. My thoughts are they did the same with the flash trying to improve drivability rather than max out dyno numbers). Also, racing beat's flash was done with their intake/exhaust.

Hey, stop distracting me. I should be reading Gandhi for my 2pm class today!

edit: Also, what about those without Jeff's AP subscription or who do not want to pay for a pro tune (simply want to use AP with given tunes). These problems would effect them as well, Im just thinking RB did a bit more development than AP

05rx8mazda

iTrader: (4)

i have a msp CAI and i didnt have any issues with my intake
running on cobb stage 1

tiltmode43

iTrader: (15)

This has gotten way off topic, lets try not to refrain from OP's original subject, I'm starting to feel bad hah

pluto

Did you ever check your a/f ratio to see how lean you are? The dyno chart shows that the mid range ran as lean as 14.8:1 on Cobb map. This is dangerous for any street WOT at high load. I had my load on the dyno set to a 10 sec sweep to minimize any major load to the engine (kinda like running it in 2nd gear).

Also, there were no benefits running the Cobb AP map and stock map. They both made the same amount of hp.

r0tor

iTrader: (1)

There should be a disclaimer that states they made the same power because the Cobb map was not made to have an intake and obviously was not running where it would have ran otherwise...

J8635621

iTrader: (10)

Went back for some more tuning and Steve got 5-6 more hp. Also, all the charts and everything were third gear pulls so the power numbers are a little below what people that make pulls in higher gears would be. I uninstalled the AP while I was taking it to the dealer a few days ago, and the car felt much less responsive and sluggish. Everyone should buy an AP. More power, more mpg, and check/block CELs. With the difference in mpg, atleast in my case, the AP will pay for itself after ~30k miles if gas stays at $4.00/gal lol.

shadycrew31

iTrader: (6)

I didnt save any MPGs, but I did get a bit of power also its handy to see A/F on the cobb. My car was running lean as **** when I got it on the dyno, Jeff tuned it down quite a bit and kept having to add more fuel. That's the nice thing about the Cobb is it can be custom tuned. the RB flash cannot, you get what you get, also if you ever go FI your kinda screwed.

In any event, Jon you might want to look into getting a BHR ignition or equivalent that can help out with power gains quite a bit.

P.S. running cobbs stage1 maps will fry your engine quickly, there's been a few threads on it...

ManyRX

iTrader: (5)

J8635621

iTrader: (10)

Shady this was 3 years ago. I've had the BHR ignition for a while now and never ran the stage 1 tune except for on the dyno that 1 pull. There is another thread where Steve Kan tuned a catless car with a flywheel and ignition upgrade and got 205ish whp on that same dyno.