Lock & Load

Question.

MP5:
Is the kit still $500 U.S.? It would be awesome if you could offer it for 500 including shipping so we could use our Mazda rewards cards. Maybe as a Christmas special? Also, when do you think you'll have the site up with dynos, etc? Do we just send you an email to order? Thanks...

Answer.
Canzoomer:
Actually, we are basically sold out for all we can make until January 15th.

As of that date it looks like we will be raising the price.

We were a bit optimistic about our costs when we set the price.

We will still honour the price on orders placed until December 31st, and confirmed with payment before Jan. 15th.

The site should be up on Friday.


Question.
akrx8:
zoomer,are you going to post the results from your testing from either dyno or g-tech and with or without a catback?i hope you take no offense and i know you have worked really really hard on this but i would love to see the results before i buy your product.again please take no offense,just like to see the results.


Answer.
Canzoomer:
I have an appointment on Thursday evening at a local shop with a Dynojet.
As that is the dyno that the majority of people are familar with, and as it is what was used by virtually every person who posted previously, it seemed like the best way to do it.

I tried to do some GTech Pro runs on Sunday.

Reason I say"tried" is that it is just too slippery on the roads here now.
If I held full throttle in 1st or 2nd all I could do is spin the tires. And risk spinning out. Even in 4th it set off the DSC light if I left the DSC turned on.

Todays high temperature in Edmonton:
-5 C (24F)

Tonights low:
-10C (14F)

"http://www.theweathernetwork.com/weather/cities/can/pages/CAAB0103.htm"

As you can see theres going to be a price increase on stage 1 , so if you are thinking of getting stage 1 order between now and the 31st of december 2003.and save some hard earned dollars .
Michael

AMG

With a strengthening Aussie dollar, will it make a difference?

Lock & Load

The strengthening Aussie dollar certainly helps , but a price increase of say onehundred dollars , also adds cost to your custom duties etc .

michael

Lock & Load

Maurice (canzoomer)

In the Good news /Bad news posts maurice has revised the costing of his stage 1 kit from $500 U.S. TO $ 750 U.S. making the stage1 kit worth just over $1017.00 Australian dollars not including cost of postage / handling or custom charges if any.

The price of $500 U.S . WILL BE HONOURED for those that have already ordered and to those that order before the 1st of january 2004 and pay by no later than the 15th of january 2004.

As my avatar says "Who dares scores"

Michael

Wildcard

Customs duty is 15%. GST is another 10%, but GST is calculated last, so you pay GST on the cost of the item, plus the postage, plus the duty, plus the $50 customs processing fee if it's over $1000. Something to ponder...

Still, it's probably the best power increase you will get short of installing a turbo or supercharger, which is a significantly more expensive proposition.

Maestro

What is this stage 1 kit ????

More power ???

Lock & Load

After reading the next 30+ pages all will be revealed and you'll be a true Maestro.

Click Here: Official word from Mazda on dyno'ing RX-8https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...threadid=11614

Wildcard

LOL, you'll need to take a day off work to get through that thread. Good thing it's the holidays!

NT Rotor Head

Well guys, I've taken the plunge and ordered the stage 1 kit. The discussion on Canzoomer's Stage 1 kit in the Vendors forum is extremely interesting and I'm satisfied that the kit is worthwile and a great price (until dec 31!)

I'll post some feedback on how it feels installed in the Aussie spec RX8 after I have done a bit of driving with it.

Lock & Load

NT rotor Head

WELL DONE YOU WONT BE DISSAPOINTED , WHEN DO YOU EXCPECT TO GET STAGE 1?

NT Rotor Head

L&L, I'm at the email stage thus far. So as soon as canzoomer gets back to me I'll fork out the cash! I'm not sure when he will be able to get me one, after reading all the discussion on the Stage 1 etc, I think there will be a reasonable wait, there is alot of interest as I'm sure you know!

Lock & Load

NT ROTOR HEAD

I am led to believe jax8 has ordered and has been told around the 15th of january 2004 so your wait may not be so long.

As you may be aware i was the second order in Australia so my wait has been nealy 2 months but maurice is a perfectionist and will only shipp stage1 when he is 110% happy with it .

He is a rare individual in a world full of con men and snake oil merchants.


ps: It will be great to share our before and after dynoson stage1.

Michael

NT Rotor Head

That's good news L & L, and yes you are right about Canzoomer (Maurice). He does seem to be someone you would trust with your new car.

There is only one dyno in Darwin... I bet his eyes will pop out when he sees an RX8 for the first time! hehe I'm sure they wouldn't know about the RX8's limitation on the dyno, so I might have to get a G-tech for a before and after Stage 1 comparison.

Wildcard

Yep, unless you know how to trick the ECU, you are in some ways wasting your time getting a dyno run done. If you don't somehow trick the ABS into thinking that all 4 wheels are turning at the same speed, the ECU will go into limp mode at some stage during the run and hence your results will be hard to quanitfy. Plenty of knowledge out there on the forum on how do do this as I sure you are aware.

Better off doing on street testing IMO. Find a nice flat, quiet, straight patch of road (got any of them in the NT? ) grab a stopwatch and a notepad and away you go.

Kenco

I'm interested in a 'stage 1 Canzoomer' for my UK high power car!

Does anyone know if the standard fuel maps for European (UK) and Aussie are the same?

NT Rotor Head

Kenco, Aussie 6MT RX8's were originally supposed to get the Jap spec ECU with 184kw @ 8500rpm, and 216nm of torque @ 5500 rpm. At the last moment it was changed to the Euro ECU with 177kw @ 8200 rpm, and 211nm of torque @ 5500 rpm. I have glossy brochures from before and after the decision was made.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure your ECU will be the same as ours so should respond similarly to the Canzoomer Stage 1 upgrade.

Have you contacted Canzoomer to be put on the waiting list? It might be a good idea as the price goes up on Dec 31!

druck

NT Rotor Head you are on the Euro3 maps if you are getting 177kw (237hp, 240ps), where as we are on next years Euro4 regulation maps giving only 170kw (228hp, 232ps) at 8200rpm

Cheers
---Dave

Hymee

iTrader: (1)

The question y'all need to be carefull about is if there is any difference in the fuel maps used in the North American cars that Maurice has speced the unit for compared to our cars.

The way I understand it, the piggyback unit used in such a mod is altering some of the inputs to the PCM by a percentage. It is not taking the AFR's to an absolute optimum, but "optimum" for one specific mapping.

I am NOT saying Maurice's kit is no good. I just urge caution. I would recommend having the mod tested by someone with professional equipment that can tell what is going on inside your engine. The sorts of equipment needed will be a wideband O2 sensor, and a knock sensor.

Some people believe the US and the AUS cars have the same fuel maps anyway, as the US cars were downgraded to 177kW. If they are exactly the same, then my argument is moot.

Let me try and give an imaginary example... Say our cars are already 3% leaner than the US ones. You use a mail-order tune (done on someone else's car) that make it 5% leaner again. Are you sure it is going to now be a safe AFR? Is it about to detonate? It is running too hot in the cats?

So say your motor blows up cause it has been running too lean. Then you just take your mod off and go down to the dealer and claim a new motor. Nice and easy. Sorry - you just attempted fraud. The dealer replaces you motor for free (Mazda pay's him), and you accept the outcome. You just went from attempting fraud to committing fraud.

Now let me put this back into perspective:

• Canzoomer has put a lot into this, and has probably tried to make sure his tune is not to near "the edge".
• He has a lot of potential customers with identical fuel maps, so the "mail-order" bit is probably be OK.
• Since he has "Stage 1", "Stage 2" etc... I suppose the stage 1 is not too radical.
• I have had an PCM "re-mapped" in the past - with excellent results. But is was custom tuned by a very experienced engine EFI performance tuner. All the checks were done (as much as practical) to make sure it wasn't going to detonate itself, using some advanced data logging equipment.

I just wanted to make sure you are informed, and if you do the mod, you have it checked. And be prepared to wear the risks involved.

Cheers,
Hymee.

Wildcard

JAP ECU = 184kW
AUS + US ECU's = 177 kW, Euro 3 compliant.
UK ECU = 170 kW, Euro 4 compliant.

That's my understanding of it (just re-affirming what's above).

Actually, here in Australia, the Euro 3 standards don't become law until next year. We are aleady on the Euro 3 ECU however because it would be suicide for Mazda Aust to bring out the RX-8 in 2003 with 184 kW and then bring out an updated 2004 model with only 177 kW.

Evidence from Hymee's dyno run suggests that we may be running a bit leaner than some US dyno results. I tend to think that the ECU's are exactly the same though, given that our cars seem to be producing the same performance results as the US cars. Hymee even drove a US spec car and said it felt the same.

Lock & Load

Hymee

You are 100% correct and we have to test stage 1 for the australian cars especially if they are being driven in hot and humid conditions which increase the possibilities of knocking a no no for the engine .

I have already e-mailed maurice about the same concern that you have stated in your previous thread , and about the heat and humidity issues .

Here's Maurice's reply:
quoting maurice:
"Causes for knock can be particles of soot in the combustion chamber, a bad tank of gas, or extremely high humidity."


Maurice in reading and quoting this part of your answer i am quite concerned as we have up to the high 80s and 90s in the humidity stakes here on the goldcoast and have noticed my rx8 does not favour these conditions .???

MAURICES ANSWER:
Engines do not generally like high temps and high humidity. The temperatures cause lower power, as the air is less dense. OTOH, we are tuning at 3,000' ( about 1,000m) altitude, so that more than makes up for that.

Humidity is also not good, as air can only contain so many gases in a gas/gas solution, which also reduces efficiency.

Big problem with these is that while the engine uses a barometric sensor to determine altitude, and to adjust richness of mixture to suit, it has no way of knowing about the humidity.

In general what I was saying is that while we could be shipping our kit with a 13.5 to 13.7 mix ratio for WOT, we are playing it conservative and shipping with a slightly richer 13.2 to 13.4, just to be safe.

my question to maurice:
What if anything could be done to minimise the knock other than not driving the car , could a cold dense air dispenser of some type be placed in front of engine to fool or trick car into believing or changing the humidity reading level.??


No, we just need to make sure that the setting we use allow a margin of safety.

You may recall that earlier I said we could get as much as 40hp, JUST with fuel/air mix.
However we are then getting into much more critical tolerance levels.
By tuning for 20-25, and playing it conservative the setup is much less sensitive to environmental conditions, fuel quality, etc.

If you push much harder, such as with a blower or turbo, then it becomes more desirable to l=play with things like intercoolers, and as it is a positive pressure feed, there is no big issue with a long intake tract needed to use intercoolers.

Hymee having you as our race steward i feel confident that you and other knowledgable rotary gurus will carry out the correct test on the AUSSIE CARS making sure that we are safe in using stage 1 should we choose to do so.

As u said using the correct equipment by way of wideband 02 sensor and the knock sensors we can test the oz engine to make sure we DONT come into any grief with our motors.

Apparantly TOULENE a fuel variant / additive has anti - knocking qualities according to maurice.???

Hymee

iTrader: (1)

L&L,

Thanks for the vote of confidence. :D

While I am happy to help out anyone getting their state of tune checked by people with the correct equipment etc, I won't personally be able to give any assurances! Ultimately that will be a decision each of you will have to make, based on the advice you choose to listen to. I have also seen so called "tunes" from so called professional tuning shops that should have known better.

Cheers,
Hymee.

DALE A BREDE

Hi guys i am awaitng a new Rx8, should be here late jan. I am very interested in performance increase, as although i am very impressed overall with the car i find it does lack a certain amount of power. I would like to look at the option of ECU and exhuast etc. I read with interest the stage 1 option from the states can someone point me in the right direction here and give me some details to contact carzoomer re this, or is there a local alternative.

Ta guys.

Hymee

iTrader: (1)

Look in the Vendors forum for Canzoomers "site"

Ric Shaw is working on a similar project, and I am also looking into alternatives.

Cheers,
Hymee.

DALE A BREDE

Ta Hymee, I might just wait to see what happens first. Probably just do exhuast. Then see what might be around.

DALE A BREDE

Hi Hymee,


How far away are you from doing something with ECU mod for this car i have tried to contact canzoomer, and have not had a response at all. I noticed that there are quite afew people with the same problem. I do think that this is poor and i think that there should be a response of some sort when you are selling a product. Anyway if you could let me know if you are close to doing anything that would help.

Regards
Dale