Marketplace Competitor for RX8
01-02-2006, 08:09 PM
#51
trust me..this wont hurt
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I'm gonna be looking (shopping) for a boxter S soon. The 5 is getting abit old for a daily driver. The 8 is and will stay as the family car ( aint got the family yet though, they weigh too much)
01-02-2006, 11:48 PM
#52
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Just came across a short review of the VW R32 in the Dec issue of Wheels.
Interestingly enough, the 130i is considered its natural rival, so nothing new there.
I was surprised at its weight - 1541kgs - (252 kgs heavier than the GTi
) - hardly the stuff lithe handling is made of. 
I also noted that it will not be a limited production run this time, which will no doubt hurt resale when compared to the previous model's exclusivity.
At $60K (estimated) plus onroads and options like the Recaro seats and DSG gearbox (so in other words the wrong side of $65K) they can keep it
. Imagine the damage they could do if it sold for WRX money!
Interestingly enough, the 130i is considered its natural rival, so nothing new there.
I was surprised at its weight - 1541kgs - (252 kgs heavier than the GTi
) - hardly the stuff lithe handling is made of. I also noted that it will not be a limited production run this time, which will no doubt hurt resale when compared to the previous model's exclusivity.
At $60K (estimated) plus onroads and options like the Recaro seats and DSG gearbox (so in other words the wrong side of $65K) they can keep it
. Imagine the damage they could do if it sold for WRX money!
01-03-2006, 12:58 AM
#53
trust me..this wont hurt
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talking about weight and nimble, did anyone see top gear on SBS yesterday. had the aston martin vanquish db9 and a ferrari. Round the bendy bits the ferrari was smooth and effortless, where as the AM was not coping very well. Weight is not a friend of handling.
01-03-2006, 07:31 AM
#54
cry me a river...
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Originally Posted by Revolver
Just came across a short review of the VW R32 in the Dec issue of Wheels.
Interestingly enough, the 130i is considered its natural rival, so nothing new there.
Interestingly enough, the 130i is considered its natural rival, so nothing new there.
(unless they are referring to size/market price 
)
01-03-2006, 05:38 PM
#55
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Originally Posted by AMG
talking about weight and nimble, did anyone see top gear on SBS yesterday. had the aston martin vanquish db9 and a ferrari. Round the bendy bits the ferrari was smooth and effortless, where as the AM was not coping very well. Weight is not a friend of handling.
Gotta say the Pagani Zonda roadster got most of my attention - how much fun did that little bloke look like he was having.
Also loved the caravan conkers game - damn I hate caravans - bloody useless things they are. Haven't grey nomads heard of motels???
Still love the way the Vanquish looks though. The Ferrari ain't anywhere near as pretty.
01-03-2006, 05:40 PM
#56
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Originally Posted by EZZY
how the hell is 130i the natural rival to the R32? one is FR and the other is 4motion/4WD (unless they are referring to size/market price )
(unless they are referring to size/market price )Well, both are hatches, both have similar power, both are German and both sell for about the same money.
Adds up to rivalry to me.
01-03-2006, 06:41 PM
#58
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Originally Posted by takahashi
I am in for a test drive this Saturday Dave.
I will let you know HOW I feel about the car. OK?
I will let you know HOW I feel about the car. OK?
Made you look, made you look!
01-03-2006, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by takahashi
It is a saleslady too 
01-03-2006, 08:05 PM
#61
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Originally Posted by Revolver
WTF???
Well, both are hatches, both have similar power, both are German and both sell for about the same money.
Adds up to rivalry to me.
Well, both are hatches, both have similar power, both are German and both sell for about the same money.
Adds up to rivalry to me.
how can you compare a rear wheel drive to a constant four wheel drive system?
otherwise i'd agree with you.
01-03-2006, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by EZZY
was referring to the drivebility part.
how can you compare a rear wheel drive to a constant four wheel drive system?
otherwise i'd agree with you.
how can you compare a rear wheel drive to a constant four wheel drive system?
otherwise i'd agree with you.
Anyway, I think we've flogged this dead horse into the ground. I thought the Bimmer was interesting as a conversation starter but I'm a tad bored talking about it now.
01-04-2006, 01:06 AM
#63
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Originally Posted by Revolver
Anyway, I think we've flogged this dead horse into the ground. I thought the Bimmer was interesting as a conversation starter but I'm a tad bored talking about it now.
01-04-2006, 03:48 AM
#64
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Originally Posted by Revolver
Come on, everyone knows BMW salesgirls never put out
That Lexus Encore Program has to be the best 
01-04-2006, 04:09 PM
#65
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Originally Posted by timbo
ha ha...I have it on good authority that Lexus salesgirls do That Lexus Encore Program has to be the best
That Lexus Encore Program has to be the best Just think of all the middleaged bankers at risk of heart attack though.
01-05-2006, 06:19 AM
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I guess I'm coming in real LATE to this thread. Interesting subject though Revolver. I love my 8 to bits, but gotta admit I'll be keeping an eye on other stuff down the track like:
- the mooted, but still unconfirmed M1 BMW
- the new 3.0 coupe version of the 3 series ( 4 series will that be?)
I've already owned a V6 Golf, and even though the new R32 is light years ahead of my old 2.8 VR6, it's hard for me to drop the notion that the R32 has essentially the same build quality/finish etc VW has to allow for in their baseline 1.6 litre poverty model in Europe. Essentially it's a decent, cheap car, jigged up with greatly improved suspension, AWD, and a proper engine. Same basic formula as a WRX then, only more refined and a bit better finished ( as it should be for the extra $20-$25k!).
Can't get excited about Audis either. Beautiful build, exquisite interiors but somehow most of their models have never quite nailed the handling/ride compromise, nor have they provided fluid, informative steering, nor brakes with proper pedal feel and progressive retardation. Jeez - it was only a few years back that large FWD Audi's had a crude DEAD AXLE doing the job at the back! How's that for Euro sophistication?
AWD grip isn't everything either. Audi need RWD and they know it - it's just that VW have never seen fit to finance the huge costs involved in re-engineering the current Audi FWD/AWD platforms. And have you seen where Audi chooses to position the engine on any of its non-transverse models? Huge chunks of it are way,way ahead of the front axle. Audi stylists have had to perform miracles for decades trying to hide the resultant massive frontal overhang. Open the bonnet of any 6 cylinder Beemer and the difference in engine location is immediately apparent. BMW understands the influence of engine location on vehicle dynamics - and so too does Mazda - yet Audi have kept perpetuating the same fundamental engineering flaw since way back in the 1960's.
Ironically it seems the latest Golf platform may finally give Audi the best chance it's had in over a decade to build a seriously entertaining car ( leaving aside a few worthwhile RS variants). Even then, it's hard to believe it took VW 5 model generations and around 25 years+ to put a proper IRS setup on the back of its multi million selling FWD Golf ( IRS came with the AWD versions, but none of the volume selling FWD variants). And this only because the cheap, nasty and ancient "pseudo independent" transverse torsion axle the Mk4 inherited from every prior model was so utterly decimated in the handling stakes by - of all things - a freakin' Ford ( last generation Euro Focus). I've nothing against Fords but to VW - which has spent decades trying to cultivate a "prestige" image in the volume car market - this must have been quite a blow.
The other diverse RX8 alternatives - Scoobie Liberties GT's, Alfa GT, new Lexus IS etc all have their pluses and minuses but IMHO lack either the 8's engineering depth/purity, or character, or both. Interesting sideways steps, perhaps, but hardly an advance. That's one reason why I'm still happy with my 8. ...at least for the time being.
Now just give me an 8 with a bit more power, 25% better fuel economy, and finish quality that actually succeeds in looking a couple of notches above that of a Mazda 2 Neo, and they'll have me hooked for a decade.....
- the mooted, but still unconfirmed M1 BMW
- the new 3.0 coupe version of the 3 series ( 4 series will that be?)
I've already owned a V6 Golf, and even though the new R32 is light years ahead of my old 2.8 VR6, it's hard for me to drop the notion that the R32 has essentially the same build quality/finish etc VW has to allow for in their baseline 1.6 litre poverty model in Europe. Essentially it's a decent, cheap car, jigged up with greatly improved suspension, AWD, and a proper engine. Same basic formula as a WRX then, only more refined and a bit better finished ( as it should be for the extra $20-$25k!).
Can't get excited about Audis either. Beautiful build, exquisite interiors but somehow most of their models have never quite nailed the handling/ride compromise, nor have they provided fluid, informative steering, nor brakes with proper pedal feel and progressive retardation. Jeez - it was only a few years back that large FWD Audi's had a crude DEAD AXLE doing the job at the back! How's that for Euro sophistication?
AWD grip isn't everything either. Audi need RWD and they know it - it's just that VW have never seen fit to finance the huge costs involved in re-engineering the current Audi FWD/AWD platforms. And have you seen where Audi chooses to position the engine on any of its non-transverse models? Huge chunks of it are way,way ahead of the front axle. Audi stylists have had to perform miracles for decades trying to hide the resultant massive frontal overhang. Open the bonnet of any 6 cylinder Beemer and the difference in engine location is immediately apparent. BMW understands the influence of engine location on vehicle dynamics - and so too does Mazda - yet Audi have kept perpetuating the same fundamental engineering flaw since way back in the 1960's.
Ironically it seems the latest Golf platform may finally give Audi the best chance it's had in over a decade to build a seriously entertaining car ( leaving aside a few worthwhile RS variants). Even then, it's hard to believe it took VW 5 model generations and around 25 years+ to put a proper IRS setup on the back of its multi million selling FWD Golf ( IRS came with the AWD versions, but none of the volume selling FWD variants). And this only because the cheap, nasty and ancient "pseudo independent" transverse torsion axle the Mk4 inherited from every prior model was so utterly decimated in the handling stakes by - of all things - a freakin' Ford ( last generation Euro Focus). I've nothing against Fords but to VW - which has spent decades trying to cultivate a "prestige" image in the volume car market - this must have been quite a blow.
The other diverse RX8 alternatives - Scoobie Liberties GT's, Alfa GT, new Lexus IS etc all have their pluses and minuses but IMHO lack either the 8's engineering depth/purity, or character, or both. Interesting sideways steps, perhaps, but hardly an advance. That's one reason why I'm still happy with my 8. ...at least for the time being.
Now just give me an 8 with a bit more power, 25% better fuel economy, and finish quality that actually succeeds in looking a couple of notches above that of a Mazda 2 Neo, and they'll have me hooked for a decade.....
01-05-2006, 09:54 PM
#69
i need a new photo
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Nick,
Nice work.
I have to say that intellectually you got to love the Audi but face to face these days it's like meeting a whale coming at you at speed. It's not a face i could love!
Soon to be 8'less, I've been looking around, I just don't like beemers, my brother's 540 and then 330ci were both brilliant in their own ways, but i just couldn't get passionate about owning one. Got the chance to belt around while in Dubai in an M5 and that was huge fun, but out of my league in Aus.
Living in Kiwi land I have redeveloped an interest in nicely riced Japanese piston power, with Skylines, Supra's et al (check our the cover story in Fast fours on the MR2.....that little bugger lives around where i live)......not to mention Batty's......at least one a day on my 15 minute commute!
Evo / Sti, well they are what they are, lotsa performance, shy on style.
But at the end of it all, for under $100k......I still reckon it's hard to go past the 8' .....so maybe we will get trashed by an M1...maybe......but it's still going to be a nana car ....... !
So another 8 for me all i need to do now is pick a colour.......unless of course a new 7 magically appears in the next couple of months!!
M
Nice work.
I have to say that intellectually you got to love the Audi but face to face these days it's like meeting a whale coming at you at speed. It's not a face i could love!
Soon to be 8'less, I've been looking around, I just don't like beemers, my brother's 540 and then 330ci were both brilliant in their own ways, but i just couldn't get passionate about owning one. Got the chance to belt around while in Dubai in an M5 and that was huge fun, but out of my league in Aus.
Living in Kiwi land I have redeveloped an interest in nicely riced Japanese piston power, with Skylines, Supra's et al (check our the cover story in Fast fours on the MR2.....that little bugger lives around where i live)......not to mention Batty's......at least one a day on my 15 minute commute!
Evo / Sti, well they are what they are, lotsa performance, shy on style.
But at the end of it all, for under $100k......I still reckon it's hard to go past the 8' .....so maybe we will get trashed by an M1...maybe......but it's still going to be a nana car ....... !
So another 8 for me all i need to do now is pick a colour.......unless of course a new 7 magically appears in the next couple of months!!
M
01-05-2006, 10:37 PM
#72
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I'll bowl a flipper and ask what would people think if BMW released a 3 series coupé with the alloy block diesel that's in the 530d in Australia? (leaving aside all the ^^^ tribalism)
480Nm of torque, low 6s 0-100, fuel consumption 7.5L/100k...at prices below 98RON...and you meet a different crowd at the pump
The thing that ***** me about BMWs is the way they rob you blind for accessories, and you rarely find one at a dealer that doesn't have $5-7k worth of options on top of the base price...strange gear, like a CD stacker for $1.5k or armrests, or slightly different dash trim accents.....
The 8 still looks tops to me but I wish Mazda would make a few slight improvements/upgrades
480Nm of torque, low 6s 0-100, fuel consumption 7.5L/100k...at prices below 98RON...and you meet a different crowd at the pump
The thing that ***** me about BMWs is the way they rob you blind for accessories, and you rarely find one at a dealer that doesn't have $5-7k worth of options on top of the base price...strange gear, like a CD stacker for $1.5k or armrests, or slightly different dash trim accents.....
The 8 still looks tops to me but I wish Mazda would make a few slight improvements/upgrades
01-05-2006, 10:47 PM
#73
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More of a googlie.....reckon would be good if you had a boat, but with our and your dodgy diesel? I wonder??
And lil bro's 330 looked like a bargain until someone explained to him that you wheels are extra (kidding) but acc's cost a bomb. Nearly 20k in bits i think!
And lil bro's 330 looked like a bargain until someone explained to him that you wheels are extra (kidding) but acc's cost a bomb. Nearly 20k in bits i think!
01-06-2006, 08:47 PM
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MkeyR - you're right about Beemers - they tend to engender respect and admiration for their sheer engineering depth/overall competence , but not love....
Timbo everything I've ever read about the 3 litre Beemer diesel suggests this may well be the pick of the whole darn range, with serious torque to exploit the chassis to the absolute max . Will BMW Aust bring it out as a 330CD? - doubtful IMHO. Now just imagine us RX8 drivers getting used to a 4500rpm rev limit eh?!
Here's another hardcore RX8 alternative for those who want more of what the 8 does best, and don't mind sacrificing a little (!) comfort: How about a Lotus Elise/Exige?
A mate of mine - who also owns an Esprit Turbo ( crazy twit!) has just bought himself an Exige. I'm promised a spin next week. Will report further!
BTW do you know what Lotus stands for:
Lots of Trouble, Usually Serious.
FIAT? Fix It Again Tony.
Honda? Horrendously Overpriced Nippon Driving Apparatus.
Timbo everything I've ever read about the 3 litre Beemer diesel suggests this may well be the pick of the whole darn range, with serious torque to exploit the chassis to the absolute max . Will BMW Aust bring it out as a 330CD? - doubtful IMHO. Now just imagine us RX8 drivers getting used to a 4500rpm rev limit eh?!
Here's another hardcore RX8 alternative for those who want more of what the 8 does best, and don't mind sacrificing a little (!) comfort: How about a Lotus Elise/Exige?
A mate of mine - who also owns an Esprit Turbo ( crazy twit!) has just bought himself an Exige. I'm promised a spin next week. Will report further!
BTW do you know what Lotus stands for:
Lots of Trouble, Usually Serious.
FIAT? Fix It Again Tony.
Honda? Horrendously Overpriced Nippon Driving Apparatus.