skc

Last Sunday was the last track day at the Lakeside Raceway. There where over 100 cars participating which would have been a great success for the organizers.

This track is challenging and if you are overconfident then it can be very unforgiving. Two cars where badly damaged and several cars had minor damage. I did bot get a chance to break the 62 second a lap barrier however I came close.

A lot of the fellow competitors and spectators where amazed at the capability of the RX8 especially once they learnt that it only had a 1.3L naturally aspirated engine. Cars have come a long way over the last few years when you consider that Jack Brabham used of lap the same circuit in 61seconds in his F1 car.

I hope to break the elusive 62 second barrier next year.

skc

moonkid

iTrader: (2)

Good job

rotalution

congrats

takahashi

well done.

The RX-8 is very deceptively quick. I nearly wet the pants of a youngster who sat in my passenger laps.

matt13b

Well done mate, a solid effort..

skc

Thanks guys. Yes, this car continues to amaze me each time I take it out. At the moment it is just a matter of experimenting with different suspension settings. However, there is one aspect that may require some modification and that is lightness in the rear end at high speed (150kmph) when going around a high speed corner or through dips.

I was talking to a guy at the track and he has a very fast car and he has solved this issue by installing a large wing. He also said the alternative to a big wing is to install under body panels to smooth out the airflow and a diffuser.

What are your thoughts.

skc

takahashi

It is likely the suspension set up rather than the aerodynamics. I have to admit I had the car in the MS wing for a long time and cannot tell the difference (if there is). I was thinking there must be something done good upon braking @ Sandown (doing 180kmh).

I conclude that rear wing is useless unless you have a wing that go above the roof of the car. In that the wing is hardly legal in any state.

I will tune the suspension set up and perhaps balance it and drop the rear height a touch. Soften the damper of the rear sometimes helps.

skc

Yea, this guy has a big wing in the boot. You can tell that it works because the down force has caused a dent in his boot lid. The benefit he found was that he can now take the high speed corner without the rear end wanting to give way.

Last season a Porsche GT3 lost it on the same bend and ended up scraping the side of his car along the guard rail.

For those that have been to the track you will know that as you come out of carousel in 3rd and point yourself towards the bridge there is a slight bend that seems to get most people backing off. I take this bend at full throttle however as I get past the bridge the track dips and the rear end feels light and you can feel the car shifting. Soon after you have to brake hard to take the climb up Hungry corner.

I may look into the mazda speed rear diffuser to see if it helps.

skc

takahashi

Don't waste your money on diffusers.

The car underneath is very bare and undulated to make rear diffuser functioning property next to nothing.

As I said wing is only worthwhile when you know how to use it. Fujita engineering sells one of the extender to bring the MazdaSpeed thing higher. It is ugly but I guess they will work well.

Seriously if you are only doing 150kmh it is hardly worth it. I don't see that problem doing 200kmh down Philip island. Look at your suspension first.

skc

I am running with tein flex coil overs with the damper set to 12 on the front and 2 at the rear. I will go even lower next time to see if there is a change.

I do not have this problem on the straight where I hit the kink at around 180kmph and top out at around 198kmph before entering the right hander at carousel....through all this the car sits flat to the ground. Others will lift off at the kink on the straight however, with the tires warmed up its pedal to the metal and rev limiter in the background in 4th gear. I could not be bothered changing gears as the end of the straight is seconds away.

The problem persists on the slightly off camber corner on the back straight.

skc

takahashi

The difference between damper rate front and rear is kind of unusual. Why is that?

I was told by something of know how to make it as high as possible for setting up a track ... then decrease 1 by 1 to find the maximal grip. At Winton, it end up to be 3 front and 2 rear.

I have read something about damper rate set up on the net. But I cannot find it atm.

takahashi

BTW skc,

Suspension, tyre pressure and alignment are the most complex area of driving. There are a lot of people having different school of thoughts. I think it is because there are just too many combinations and one has to simplify it.

For me, I want the tyre temp to be around 50 degree when I get back to the pits, as I know my semi will perform the best at it. So I decrease tyre pressure to increase the temp, increase to when it gets too hot.

I will harden the suspension when I want more grip, but decrease it when I feel like the car hops (or feel floaty).

It is for me, coz I have kept the ride height and alignment constant. So if your setting is on my car and I have that sort of problem. I will increase rear number to soften the rear and decrease front damper number to increase front stiffness. I will also drop tyre pressure too.

As I said, that is me on my car. May not work on yours. Lets experiment.

skc

Hey Taka
From what I under stand the tein dampers allow me to adjust the damping force from 1 to 16 with 1 being the softest setting. When I first had them on the installer had the front and rear set at around 8 and the rear end kept wanting to slide out at every turn. I ran them at the softest setting and it did not seem to make and difference from the stock set up.

From there I went to the hardest setting to the front and about 4 at the rear and the car felt very direct and still a bit skittish. At the current setting the car feels fairly neutral. However, next time I will soften the rear end even further.

I run Toyo R888 tires and it appears a cold temp of 28 and hot temp of 32 are best for these tyres.

I will need to look at dialing in more negative camber to the front. The last time I did my wheel alignment the most they could get was negative 2.25, how can we get more negative camber?

It is all a learning process and best of all I am enjoying the process as I learn to master the craft through experimentation.

skc

takahashi

Unless your EDFC is different from any body's. Page 13 point 3 of this file
http://www.tein.com/tech_info/inst/edfc.pdf

0 is the firmest setting.

The tyre temp is ok. It is expensive but I use a infrared temperature probe to measure tyre temp.


After I put on the +32 offset wheel for track I have no problem with camber. Even I am on -1.75 now. I measure the temperature across the tyre (centre, outside and inside). And outside less than 6 degree C more than inside - means there is enough negative camber. I had -2.5 b4 but I had the car too low.


That is it!

Experiment is the key. What I said may not apply to you since the way we drive and use the brake and throttle is different.

Revolver

Firstly, well done. Sounds like you're making good gains.

As for the discussion, from everything I've read about downforce and the RX8, I'd agree with Taka. It's only if you're prepared to fit a roof height wing that you're going to notice much difference (whilst looking totally gay and ricer in the process, lol). The MS wing is more for looks than function.

From memory, that section under and past the bridge is a bit of a goat track. I remember my car getting unsettled as I experimented with more speed through there. I'd suggest it's going to be a tradeoff between settings that are compliant enough to cope with the bumpy section through there but stiff enough to keep you flat and fast through the tighter corners on the course...

Having fun whilst doing it is the important bit.

takahashi

If it is a goat track, definitely soften the rear and even drop the rear height.

skc

It is not a goat track anymore as they put down a new surface after the Nats last year.

skc

skc

Thanks for the link Taka. I do not have EFDC as yet therefore for me I measure the stiffness by the number of turns I make to tighten and hence stiffen the suspension. Therefore my numbering is the exact opposite of yours.

skc

Revolver

Has that made the track faster?

Are they still feral about noise restrictions? I wouldn't go back if they're the same as last time. Not worth it.

skc

Most people are saying the new surface is worth one second. They seem to have changed the way they monitor the sound as there are some really loud cars out there and they seem to get by. Although some cars have been given the black flag for excessive noise.

While I was pulled up at the last Nats here they have not said anything since.

The reason why they are so protective is that their license to operate depends on keeping under the 95db noise limit. They have permanent data loggers posted around the track and if they are deemed to be in breach then the council can take away the license.

skc

Revolver

I understand the reason but when stock cars are getting black flagged there's a big problem.

Some of us came a long way to attend those Nats and it definitely left a bad taste in the mouth when you knew you couldn't push the car into a faster laptime without getting flagged.

Hopefully the track is viable for all except the noisiest race exhausts because otherwise it's a gamble as to whether you're going to be able to run your car at full noise (pun intended) or not.

Btw, it ***** me no end when people move near an existing facility (presumably on the basis that land is cheaper) and then campaign to have it shut down. Lucas Heights is another good example. *********.

privatepang

So whats the relationship with damper settings with coiloveres then?

I got cusco zero 2 e but havent played around witht he settings so much as yet

got it on the softest atm and i havent changed it at the track

do you just go full stiff settings and soften the rear up if you tend to oversteer or is it the opposite?

takahashi

Understood.

takahashi

Try to softest on the track first. Better still get the middle setting.

Then soften rear and stiffen front if you understeer
Stiffen rear and soften front if you oversteer.

A combination or change alone ... you have to experiment. Understand?