2004 S2000 on AutoWeek
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2004 S2000 on AutoWeek
200 extra cc, 10 extra lb-ft of torque. Is it worth it?
http://autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=reviews &loc_code=index&content_code=06842145
http://autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=reviews &loc_code=index&content_code=06842145
#2
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If all you care about is peak numbers, the change seems a bit small. What Honda is claiming is that power is up around 10% across the powerband. Combined with a slightly (4%) taller gearing in the lower gears and a lower engagment point for the vtec, Honda claims acceleration is improved and that it comes on strong from 3k rpm.
This was obviously meant to address the most common complaint about slow launching and poor off-peak acceleration. Some call it softer, but can you really call a faster version softer?
Source - Temple VTEC
This was obviously meant to address the most common complaint about slow launching and poor off-peak acceleration. Some call it softer, but can you really call a faster version softer?
Source - Temple VTEC
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Originally posted by Keshav
can you really call a faster version softer?
can you really call a faster version softer?
...i'm of two minds about this displacement increase... Honda's gone and stroked it, lowering the redline (as piston speeds have increased at any rpm with the longer stroke), but probably broadening the powerband.
in essence, they knew that if they had to make the car more driveable (to make it more marketable to low-rpm horsepower fans: aka Americans), they couldn't make it slower, so they upped the potential of the engine (displacement increase), and comprimised a potentially more powerful motor back down to the previous model's peak output, changed the VTEC response (i'd be interested to see the cam, valve, and head changes too... i'm sure you'll find it reletively less aggressive than the F20C's configuration, considering displacement)...
so, they have a stronger, more drivable engine, but it's at a higher level of comprimise than the old one... hmmm... it's quicker but is less of a purist's machine... hmmm...
one thing's for damned sure though: it sure got uglier; leave it to Honda, embracer of Ricer Nation, to go and ricify one of their halo cars too.
#7
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Originally posted by wakeech
one thing's for damned sure though: it sure got uglier; leave it to Honda, embracer of Ricer Nation, to go and ricify one of their halo cars too.
one thing's for damned sure though: it sure got uglier; leave it to Honda, embracer of Ricer Nation, to go and ricify one of their halo cars too.
#9
I don't see the rice either. You even really gotta pay attention to notice most of the changes. I still think the RX8's taillamps are much ricier. I wish Mazda would get rid of those.
#10
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Originally posted by wakeech
one thing's for damned sure though: it sure got uglier; leave it to Honda, embracer of Ricer Nation, to go and ricify one of their halo cars too.
one thing's for damned sure though: it sure got uglier; leave it to Honda, embracer of Ricer Nation, to go and ricify one of their halo cars too.
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Originally posted by moogle
Just because its Honda doesn't mean it embraces rice.
Just because its Honda doesn't mean it embraces rice.
Originally posted by moogle
Its people who make it rice. ricify??? Making up new words? It looks almost like an rx-8.
Its people who make it rice. ricify??? Making up new words? It looks almost like an rx-8.
i SERIOUSLY dont' see where any lines of both these cars line up... what, they're both japanese, and have big hoods?? the grill shapes, placements, structure about the wheels, rake and shape of the windshield, side treatment, the WHOLE rear end... i could go on forever. just 'cause they're japanese sports cars doesn't mean they look like one another.
how does it look more rice?? well, it isn't rice now, but it emulates the terribly ugly look so sought after by dumbasses with Civics the continent over. look at the new main duct treatment: see those "civic inspired" vanes now at the sides, directing air to no-where-in-particular?? say that they did take air and route it through ducts to the brakes or something: there are better (and less ugly) ways of doing it. the now further recessed lights and BULGING ("more muscular" *rolleyes*) front treadment, along with the "Arnold's Arm" treatment along the sides really really gives it that freshly installed ugly-and-doesn't-quite-fit-bodykit look.
needless to say, i like the old, sleeker, square-ducted, tapered, and more modest front treatment. i can't really tell if the back is any different.
FWIW, i like the RX-8's tail lamps. if they're too much chrome for you, fine... they layout and design are still something special (s'pecially the turn signals... no one can disagree with that).
#14
i love rice, too :D
but i don't like this subtle facelift. i think the tail lights are ruined; the original tail lights were real good-looking. as good-looking as rx-8's. don't really like the front grille, either. also annoyed by the displacement jump, which kinda takes away the mystique of the engine. is the redline lowered, too? sigh. it's unfortunate. i'm a honda fan, but...
but i don't like this subtle facelift. i think the tail lights are ruined; the original tail lights were real good-looking. as good-looking as rx-8's. don't really like the front grille, either. also annoyed by the displacement jump, which kinda takes away the mystique of the engine. is the redline lowered, too? sigh. it's unfortunate. i'm a honda fan, but...
#16
Originally posted by wakeech
FWIW, i like the RX-8's tail lamps. if they're too much chrome for you, fine... they layout and design are still something special (s'pecially the turn signals... no one can disagree with that).
FWIW, i like the RX-8's tail lamps. if they're too much chrome for you, fine... they layout and design are still something special (s'pecially the turn signals... no one can disagree with that).
#18
Originally posted by mikeb
your wife doesn't know much about cars does she
your wife doesn't know much about cars does she
Last edited by nk_Rx8; 10-04-2003 at 08:47 PM.
#19
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Originally posted by nk_Rx8
Both of us know Altezza look alikes when we see them. It's the same style as on the Evo.
Both of us know Altezza look alikes when we see them. It's the same style as on the Evo.
![Confused](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/confused.gif)
i'm really missing the commonality here... regardless, the RX-8's tail lamps do have a lot of mirror-finished plastic, but i still don't see how they look anything at all like a crappy APC tail lamp. they're sturdy, quality units, not made with cheesey reflector lenses, and the turn signals simply set them apart from everything else... i mean, look at BMW's Chris Bangle's best idea for turnsignals, trying to come up with something "fresh and different"... *shrug* you don't have to like it, and you don't, but don't lump them in with tasteless "Euro" style rice.
#20
Originally posted by wakeech
not to argue a completely pointless point, but you're making less and less sense... they look like those POS APC tails, which are also like the Evo's, AND IS300's??![Confused](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/confused.gif)
i'm really missing the commonality here... regardless, the RX-8's tail lamps do have a lot of mirror-finished plastic, but i still don't see how they look anything at all like a crappy APC tail lamp. they're sturdy, quality units, not made with cheesey reflector lenses, and the turn signals simply set them apart from everything else... i mean, look at BMW's Chris Bangle's best idea for turnsignals, trying to come up with something "fresh and different"... *shrug* you don't have to like it, and you don't, but don't lump them in with tasteless "Euro" style rice.
not to argue a completely pointless point, but you're making less and less sense... they look like those POS APC tails, which are also like the Evo's, AND IS300's??
![Confused](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/confused.gif)
i'm really missing the commonality here... regardless, the RX-8's tail lamps do have a lot of mirror-finished plastic, but i still don't see how they look anything at all like a crappy APC tail lamp. they're sturdy, quality units, not made with cheesey reflector lenses, and the turn signals simply set them apart from everything else... i mean, look at BMW's Chris Bangle's best idea for turnsignals, trying to come up with something "fresh and different"... *shrug* you don't have to like it, and you don't, but don't lump them in with tasteless "Euro" style rice.
It is useless to argue this, since aesthetics are all a personal perference. But I know many people that have commented on the same thing - that the APC lights are what pops to mind when they see those style of lights on any car. I read threads on the Evo board about switching out their tail lamps for the Evo 7 lamps just because people hated the 'altezza' style look now.
We going to have to agree to disagree on this because this is one of those things that are totally inidividual choice and like you said there is no point in arguing. It's would be like arguing about which color is best.
you don't have to like it, and you don't, but don't lump them in with tasteless "Euro" style rice.
#21
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Originally posted by nk_Rx8
Isn't that what you were doing also with your comments on the new S2K styling - lumping styling that you don't like with rice?
Isn't that what you were doing also with your comments on the new S2K styling - lumping styling that you don't like with rice?
yeah, but i don't care. the vanes in the grill are 100% a step backwards, look ricey and ugly. Honda chooses to associate itself with the silliness that is the ricer 'import scene' *rolleyes*, and thus i will blast them appropriately
![Wink](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/wink.gif)
just 'cause it's ugly don't mean i dislike it: still a helluva car, like ALL the new BMW's so far.
#22
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I can't believe all you guys talk about is the appearance. If you read the article you'll find out the rear suspension geometry has been revised for more stability in corning and the bump in 8lb torque changes the power banned to suit more for street (low rev driving).
BTW S2000 doesn't look like the RX8, if anything it is the other way around. S2000 looks like this since it came out, the only new aero parts are the front, rear bumper and side skirts.
This is sad. All you care about is looks.
BTW S2000 doesn't look like the RX8, if anything it is the other way around. S2000 looks like this since it came out, the only new aero parts are the front, rear bumper and side skirts.
This is sad. All you care about is looks.
![Frown](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/frown.gif)
Last edited by Hanzo; 10-06-2003 at 06:58 AM.
#23
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I don't think it looks "ricy" at all. It looks like classic Honda understated styling to me. There is no huge, useless airdam. No gargantuan pointless wing. No black, fake carbon fiber hood with a for-looks-only hood scoop. Where's the rice?
#24
Originally posted by Hanzo
I can't believe all you guys talk about is the appearance. ...This is sad. All you care about is looks.
I can't believe all you guys talk about is the appearance. ...This is sad. All you care about is looks.
![Frown](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/frown.gif)
#25
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I don't think increasing the torque means softened it up. The gear ratio for the first 4 gears has also been shorten to give it a punchier feel. I would say they improve the car not soften it.