2016 Mazda CX-9 Revealed...
#152
Administrator
iTrader: (7)
thanks VW.
this is why we can't have nice things.
this is why we can't have nice things.
![Frown](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/frown.gif)
#154
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
Hate to bust your bubble, but the Diesels were not going to America anyway until next generation (if at all now), this VW fraud was yet another good 'excuse' for Mazda in US.
You will not see them until they are engine reliable, full stop end of story.
I have this funny feeling that Mazda may not even go with another diesel generation because emissions on diesels will be so scrutinised thanks to VW that it will be too hard and too costly to be compliant.
You will not see them until they are engine reliable, full stop end of story.
I have this funny feeling that Mazda may not even go with another diesel generation because emissions on diesels will be so scrutinised thanks to VW that it will be too hard and too costly to be compliant.
#156
You shut your ***** mouth!
Best car I ever owned, 1991 Mercedes-Benz 300D Turbodiesel. Got it just over a 100k miles and it lasted until 240k when the head cracked down an injector port. Never had a problem with it, except that time one of the vacuum hoses fell off the turbo, and that other time one of the vacuum hoses fell off the turbo and again... vacuum... hose... turbo.
So many trips to see bands in that car, back and forth to college, driving through blizzards.
Best car I ever owned, 1991 Mercedes-Benz 300D Turbodiesel. Got it just over a 100k miles and it lasted until 240k when the head cracked down an injector port. Never had a problem with it, except that time one of the vacuum hoses fell off the turbo, and that other time one of the vacuum hoses fell off the turbo and again... vacuum... hose... turbo.
So many trips to see bands in that car, back and forth to college, driving through blizzards.
#158
You shut your ***** mouth!
Best car I ever owned, 1991 Mercedes-Benz 300D Turbodiesel. Got it just over a 100k miles and it lasted until 240k when the head cracked down an injector port. Never had a problem with it, except that time one of the vacuum hoses fell off the turbo, and that other time one of the vacuum hoses fell off the turbo and again... vacuum... hose... turbo.
So many trips to see bands in that car, back and forth to college, driving through blizzards.
Best car I ever owned, 1991 Mercedes-Benz 300D Turbodiesel. Got it just over a 100k miles and it lasted until 240k when the head cracked down an injector port. Never had a problem with it, except that time one of the vacuum hoses fell off the turbo, and that other time one of the vacuum hoses fell off the turbo and again... vacuum... hose... turbo.
So many trips to see bands in that car, back and forth to college, driving through blizzards.
todays diesels (Benz included) are not so reliable , performances and fuel consumption are great, but they have plenty of problems from DPF, to VGT Turbo, to injection system and so on...
and necessitate of complicated systems to pass emissions tests.
*i don't know the exact technical term in english ,so I've translated plain from italian, i hope you can understand.
#159
nowadays diesel are totally different from those ones.( not common rail, with *"pre-chamber").
todays diesels (Benz included) are not so reliable , performances and fuel consumption are great, but they have plenty of problems from DPF, to VGT Turbo, to injection system and so on...
and necessitate of complicated systems to pass emissions tests.
*i don't know the exact technical term in english ,so I've translated plain from italian, i hope you can understand.
todays diesels (Benz included) are not so reliable , performances and fuel consumption are great, but they have plenty of problems from DPF, to VGT Turbo, to injection system and so on...
and necessitate of complicated systems to pass emissions tests.
*i don't know the exact technical term in english ,so I've translated plain from italian, i hope you can understand.
#160
today's diesels are simply an EU political affair, and VWgate explains clearly the wrong choices operated in pasts decades by EU.
Last edited by MattMPS; 11-03-2015 at 05:51 AM.
#161
Also, hydrogen would be way more involved, any modern diesel can run what I was talking about, just pour it in the tank. Hydrogen on the other hand, you need to make the engine(or modify a current otto cycle engine) and make a tank to hold the fuel in both the vehicle and all of the stations.
#162
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I don't see what the problem is with a turbocharged SkyActiv gasoline engine.
The current V-6 in the CX-9 makes 273 hp, and gets 16 - 24 mpg.
The turbo 4 will make 2 extra hp, but will most likely have epa range of 20 - 28, knowing how Mazda likes to improve their fuel economy numbers.
Most likely, the torque numbers will be much higher than the 270 lb-ft that the V-6 makes, AND the engine will be more reliable than the Ford built V-6.
I remember someone mentioning that the Ford V-6 sucks for reliability.
I believe the SkyActiv 4 cylinder engines have been doing much much better up to this point in time (with the noted exception of the diesel, that is).
Just about every other manufacturer has been switching to turbocharged 4 cylinder engines to replace their lineup of V-6 engines. VW, Audi, Mercedes, Ford, heck, even GM is getting is getting into the act. Hell, Porsche is replacing the 2.7 and 3.4 liter Flat 6 engines in the Boxster and Cayman next year with a pair of turbocharged Flat 4 engines (2.0 and 2.5). Yes, Porsche.
All because of emissions.
Turbocharged 4 cylinder engines can cheat their way past emissions standards (har har) way easier than V-6 engines can, and every company that wants to sell vehicles in Europe is doing it.
Since Mazda wants to make things simple in their lineup, the reduced number of engine variants they have to make, the more reliable their overall fleet is going to be, and the more cost savings they get to pocket in the long term.
I don't see that as a bad thing, at all.
And ultimately, a turbocharged 4 cylinder engine is way easier to work on than a V-6 engine that has been crammed into a tight engine bay, and requires serious work to access the rear bank for spark plugs, or replacing valve cover gaskets. Less weight for the same amount of power is almost always a great thing too, I've heard.
BC.
The current V-6 in the CX-9 makes 273 hp, and gets 16 - 24 mpg.
The turbo 4 will make 2 extra hp, but will most likely have epa range of 20 - 28, knowing how Mazda likes to improve their fuel economy numbers.
Most likely, the torque numbers will be much higher than the 270 lb-ft that the V-6 makes, AND the engine will be more reliable than the Ford built V-6.
I remember someone mentioning that the Ford V-6 sucks for reliability.
I believe the SkyActiv 4 cylinder engines have been doing much much better up to this point in time (with the noted exception of the diesel, that is).
Just about every other manufacturer has been switching to turbocharged 4 cylinder engines to replace their lineup of V-6 engines. VW, Audi, Mercedes, Ford, heck, even GM is getting is getting into the act. Hell, Porsche is replacing the 2.7 and 3.4 liter Flat 6 engines in the Boxster and Cayman next year with a pair of turbocharged Flat 4 engines (2.0 and 2.5). Yes, Porsche.
All because of emissions.
Turbocharged 4 cylinder engines can cheat their way past emissions standards (har har) way easier than V-6 engines can, and every company that wants to sell vehicles in Europe is doing it.
Since Mazda wants to make things simple in their lineup, the reduced number of engine variants they have to make, the more reliable their overall fleet is going to be, and the more cost savings they get to pocket in the long term.
I don't see that as a bad thing, at all.
And ultimately, a turbocharged 4 cylinder engine is way easier to work on than a V-6 engine that has been crammed into a tight engine bay, and requires serious work to access the rear bank for spark plugs, or replacing valve cover gaskets. Less weight for the same amount of power is almost always a great thing too, I've heard.
BC.
the cx9 ford engine is actually the most reliable one mazda has at the moment.
#163
Rockie Mountain Newbie
Also, they sell very few CX-9's per year (2014 18,496, 15,644 2015 YTD), in comparison to all their other vehicles that have been equipped with their SkyActiv-G engines over the past several years (267,158 vehicle sales YTD, almost all with SkyActiv engines at this point - You do the math). If there were mass failures with the 2.0 and 2.5 engines, we would be hearing about it.
Instead, for a completely new engine design, it's come out of the gates fairly strong for reliability.
Black eye for SkyActiv-D, however, but since we don't get that here in the US, I choose to ignore that it exists.
BC.
#164
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With the turbo 4s that are coming from Mazda, I just hope they have taken notes from other manufacturers that have had issues with carbon buildup so it does not become an issue with the Mazda engines.
#165
become an issue? it's already and issue... mazdaspeed3's and 6's have had this problem since day1
#167
one of the design features of skyactiv DI is keeping the intake valves above a certain "self-cleaning" temperature to prevent or reduce deposits. how that works out in the long term is anyone's guess...
#168
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
This will make Charlie happy..
A little birdie told me the US will finally get the Mazda i-stop in their new cars next year.
Rest of the world has had it since inception and there are some complaints with this system, particularly by journalists and some owners.
That being, currently the default at ignition start (engine on, running) is that i-stop is always ON.
To turn it OFF the driver has to press a dash switch to do so, but will reset on at next engine off/on/restart.
Many complain that they want the default to be the reverse, always off and on when the driver wants to use it.
At the very lease one would think MMC would permit the Dealers to set the default in IDS parameters, but the current IDS system does not permit this.
Lets hope common sense prevails, but then again, who knows, part of the reason the US did not see the Mazda i-stop system was because the fuel savings were not calculated/included by the US MPG calculations for new cars.
And it is an extra cost.
A little birdie told me the US will finally get the Mazda i-stop in their new cars next year.
Rest of the world has had it since inception and there are some complaints with this system, particularly by journalists and some owners.
That being, currently the default at ignition start (engine on, running) is that i-stop is always ON.
To turn it OFF the driver has to press a dash switch to do so, but will reset on at next engine off/on/restart.
Many complain that they want the default to be the reverse, always off and on when the driver wants to use it.
At the very lease one would think MMC would permit the Dealers to set the default in IDS parameters, but the current IDS system does not permit this.
Lets hope common sense prevails, but then again, who knows, part of the reason the US did not see the Mazda i-stop system was because the fuel savings were not calculated/included by the US MPG calculations for new cars.
And it is an extra cost.
#169
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
#170
From MotorTrend:
"It was designed with the real world in mind, and in the real world, Mazda says, drivers of three-row SUVs like low-end torque. To that end, the engine uses a relatively small turbocharger for quick spool-up. With 17.4 psi of maximum boost blown into the high-compression engine (10.5:1) maximum torque is a robust 310 lb-ft, available at 2,000 rpm.
The peak horsepower number, however, isn’t so high. On 93-octane (East-Coast premium) fuel, the engine produces 250 hp at 5,000 rpm. On regular 87-octane, that number drops to just 227 hp.
And guess what? That’s probably a smart move. If three-row SUV drivers aren’t regularly banging off their rev limiters, they’re not using all of their big engine’s power. Having a lower peak output allows Mazda to use a smaller turbo for faster spool-up — and that’s far more important."
"It was designed with the real world in mind, and in the real world, Mazda says, drivers of three-row SUVs like low-end torque. To that end, the engine uses a relatively small turbocharger for quick spool-up. With 17.4 psi of maximum boost blown into the high-compression engine (10.5:1) maximum torque is a robust 310 lb-ft, available at 2,000 rpm.
The peak horsepower number, however, isn’t so high. On 93-octane (East-Coast premium) fuel, the engine produces 250 hp at 5,000 rpm. On regular 87-octane, that number drops to just 227 hp.
And guess what? That’s probably a smart move. If three-row SUV drivers aren’t regularly banging off their rev limiters, they’re not using all of their big engine’s power. Having a lower peak output allows Mazda to use a smaller turbo for faster spool-up — and that’s far more important."
Last edited by djgiron; 11-19-2015 at 01:32 PM.
#171
40th anniversary Edition
Sounds like Mazda has hit the sweet spot, without any need for a V6 like some have advocated. But of course the buying public will be the ultimate judge if their strategy was sound or not. I can see the premium gas being a negative for many buyers.
Last edited by gwilliams6; 11-20-2015 at 08:49 AM.
#172
Administrator
did you all read about the turbo setup they are using?
One piece of technology is Mazda's Dynamic Pressure Turbo, the world's first turbocharger with the ability to vary the degree of exhaust pulsation depending on engine speed. The system routes engine exhaust to the turbocharger's turbine through smaller ports at low rpm. It works similarly to when one might place his or her thumb on a garden hose, creating a strong amount of pressure through a smaller outlet. This allows the turbocharger to spool up quickly, creating instant boost—up to 1.2 bar (17.4 psi) of pressure. When the engine is in the heart of its rev range, it opens up secondary valves, allowing for greater amounts of exhaust gas to pass through the turbocharger. The system is complemented by the 2.5-liter engine that already benefits from more torque at atmospheric pressure than a comparable 2.0-liter by virtue of its size.
Further assisting CX-9 to maximize turbocharger efficiency is a 4-3-1 exhaust. With this setup, the exhaust from the middle two cylinders (2 and 3) is joined into a single port, while the exhausts from the outer cylinders (1 and 4) each have their own ports. These three ports come together at the entrance to the turbocharger's exhaust side, where there is always one exhaust pulse arriving every 180 degrees of crankshaft rotation. Not only does this very compact manifold keeps the exhaust pulses separate for maximum energy extraction, it also harnesses each exhaust pulse to suck the residual exhaust from the adjacent ports.
That only tells so much of the story. In order to increase fuel-efficiency, SKYACTIV-G 2.5T employs the efficient combustion of Mazda's SKYACTIV-G 2.5-liter engine and marries it to a cooled exhaust gas recirculation (EGR) system, which helps prevent burning excessive amounts of fuel when the engine is running at higher temperatures. In many turbocharged cars, heat is controlled through adding more fuel to the combustion chamber; Mazda's cooled EGR reduces the need for that.
While Mazda sees no discernible benefits on regulated test cycles from this technology, it benefits the consumer through real-world gains.
The cooled EGR helps bring engine temperatures down from approximately 500 degrees C (932 F) to just over 100 degrees C (212 F), allowing SKYACTIV-G 2.5T to operate with a compression ratio of 10.5:1—one of the highest numbers of any gasoline-powered, turbocharged engine.
The net result: 310 lb-ft (420 N-m) of torque at a low 2,000 rpm and 250 horsepower at 5,000 rpm on 93-octane gasoline (227 horsepower on 87-octane gasoline). At 55 mph (88 km/h), a driver needs just 18 horsepower to maintain speed on flat roads with a front- wheel-drive model—a four-horsepower reduction versus the outgoing model, illustrating reduced friction in all parts of the driveline and enhanced aerodynamics.
Additionally, as an example of CX-9's readily available power, in the outgoing CX-9, when a driver needed 90 horsepower at highway speeds, the vehicle would have to downshift from sixth to fourth gear. However, the new CX-9 can more quickly draw upon that power with faster, better-controlled throttle response and stay in sixth gear, allowing for a smoother operation and a greater sense of confidence.
When coupled with a weight reduction of over approximately 198 lbs. (90 kg) versus the outgoing model, CX-9 boasts improvements in driver control, chassis dynamics and performance—all leading to a greater sense of confidence from behind the wheel.
Further assisting CX-9 to maximize turbocharger efficiency is a 4-3-1 exhaust. With this setup, the exhaust from the middle two cylinders (2 and 3) is joined into a single port, while the exhausts from the outer cylinders (1 and 4) each have their own ports. These three ports come together at the entrance to the turbocharger's exhaust side, where there is always one exhaust pulse arriving every 180 degrees of crankshaft rotation. Not only does this very compact manifold keeps the exhaust pulses separate for maximum energy extraction, it also harnesses each exhaust pulse to suck the residual exhaust from the adjacent ports.
That only tells so much of the story. In order to increase fuel-efficiency, SKYACTIV-G 2.5T employs the efficient combustion of Mazda's SKYACTIV-G 2.5-liter engine and marries it to a cooled exhaust gas recirculation (EGR) system, which helps prevent burning excessive amounts of fuel when the engine is running at higher temperatures. In many turbocharged cars, heat is controlled through adding more fuel to the combustion chamber; Mazda's cooled EGR reduces the need for that.
While Mazda sees no discernible benefits on regulated test cycles from this technology, it benefits the consumer through real-world gains.
The cooled EGR helps bring engine temperatures down from approximately 500 degrees C (932 F) to just over 100 degrees C (212 F), allowing SKYACTIV-G 2.5T to operate with a compression ratio of 10.5:1—one of the highest numbers of any gasoline-powered, turbocharged engine.
The net result: 310 lb-ft (420 N-m) of torque at a low 2,000 rpm and 250 horsepower at 5,000 rpm on 93-octane gasoline (227 horsepower on 87-octane gasoline). At 55 mph (88 km/h), a driver needs just 18 horsepower to maintain speed on flat roads with a front- wheel-drive model—a four-horsepower reduction versus the outgoing model, illustrating reduced friction in all parts of the driveline and enhanced aerodynamics.
Additionally, as an example of CX-9's readily available power, in the outgoing CX-9, when a driver needed 90 horsepower at highway speeds, the vehicle would have to downshift from sixth to fourth gear. However, the new CX-9 can more quickly draw upon that power with faster, better-controlled throttle response and stay in sixth gear, allowing for a smoother operation and a greater sense of confidence.
When coupled with a weight reduction of over approximately 198 lbs. (90 kg) versus the outgoing model, CX-9 boasts improvements in driver control, chassis dynamics and performance—all leading to a greater sense of confidence from behind the wheel.
#174
Administrator
iTrader: (7)
ZOOM: yup, sounds like some neat engineering Mazda is working on there.
#175
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
''The redesigned Mazda2 won’t make it to U.S. dealerships''
Just to clear up the Fact that the new DJ Mazda 2 was never sold officially in North America US mainland.
Including Canada and it won't be.
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...us-market.html
Mazda2 Also Axed in Canada
1.5 is sold in Mexico (where LHD model is made) and Puerto Rico.
Just to clear up the Fact that the new DJ Mazda 2 was never sold officially in North America US mainland.
Including Canada and it won't be.
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...us-market.html
Mazda2 Also Axed in Canada
1.5 is sold in Mexico (where LHD model is made) and Puerto Rico.