REsuperD

agree. but is the same true for 400 grand?

YaXMaNGTO

You got it. Amen.

Oh, and just to pour gasoline on the flame, for a bit over a thousand dollars, you could pulley it, tune it, and get some drag radials. So instead of trapping 131mph, you might see 140mph in a nicely appointed street legal car that can handle a hairpin as well as it can blow the doors off just about anything in a straight line.

You guys even ridden in a car that traps 140mph in the quarter? You would absolutely pee your pants it accelerates so fast... that's Veyron territory.

digitalSniperX1

GM is making < 2000 of these. They will sell for a premium, that's the reality of it. I can't say that 400 grand is worth it quite simply because I don't have the 400 grand to buy one.

Supposing I was Jay Leno who earns 15 million annually, I'd probably have another opinion.

digitalSniperX1

I'm pleasantly surprised, but than again, you own a GTO

I can't say that I've been in a car that'll do those numbers, but I have driven an '07 Z06 and it was exhilarating. I have owned a plain jane C5 convertible too and it was a blast.

In fact, one might classify me as a joe six pack too simply because I owned a 2002 Camaro SS and I thought it was pretty awesome for the price.

Both LS1's I owned achieved better fuel economy than my RX-8.
LS1's and it's follow ons pretty much rock and I don't give a $hit about hp/liter, it means virtually nothing.

I must say though, I really enjoy the RX-8 and the rip of a 9k rpm engine, which is why I own one.

mysql

The enzo's used price tag has little to do with its actual performance. Ferarri knew the limited production would result in people selling it for high prices. So no one could just buy one. Ferarri instead invited people it hand picked based on previous ferarri purchase in order to minimize flippers.

digitalSniperX1

Ok, 650,000 if you will. Nevertheless, it was Ferrari's flagship "production" car (no, I'm not sure they termed it that, but they built around 350 of them). Some say the best Ferrari ever.

So while it doesn't say Ferrari on it, it's US made, and its MSRP is nowhere near the likes of any Ferrari, a lowly Chevrolet competes with what one could argue as the "best" Ferrari ever.

A genuine high performance car enthusiast should put the technical merits of a vechicle first. Putting such frivolous and non-technical, almost emotional items like panache, perceived status and image at the top of the list should be reserved for those of a more feminine persuasion. No offense ladies.

It's reasonable to assume at this point that GM did this right.

BMonkey

As an engineering fan I have to ask...what engineering? Huge motor with a supercharger that produces a "whopping" 103 hp/liter and is still using 2 valves/cylinder...wow what amazing engineering . The 2.0L S2000 produced 120 hp/liter and numerous other engines produce more hp/liter. The rear suspension is still using leaf springs...ya know like they had on wagons in the pioneer days? More amazing engineering. Look at the bodywork... they used more extensive carbon fiber pieces but they did almost nothing to alter the aerodynamics to handle the higher speeds except add a bigger spoiler and splitter... years of wind tunnel research I'm sure.

I understand why this car appeals to the blue collar guy so much. The numbers don't lie and if you're out driving at the ragged edge you won't get dusted by a ferrari, but it still costs so much less than the ferrari and it's american made. That's all great and good but the problem is, when you have a 400+hp car, laying all of that power down on the road and using it, is extremely difficult. Guys with Z06s and F430s don't go blasting around at 150+mph all the time. Usually you only partially tap into the power of the car because WOT requires a clear road and controlled conditions or you end up on wrecked exotics dot com. So most of this time when you aren't blasting at full throttle, what merits whether a car is good or not? A cheapo plastic interior, cheapo leather, cheapo electronics, budget ergonomics, harsh leaf spring ride and the typical american car "refinement"? These sound more like sacrifices than merits for a car.

Which one would you want to drive in?

Or


In the end, I haven't talked to anyone who wouldn't take an exotic over an american car like a ZR1 if price was taken out of the equation... Which is a lame reason to live in delusion.

Ok, I'm done flaming

CyberPitz

So, because a car out performs in every aspect another car, it's instantly better? That's an opinionated response. The price is what is making this car ****. Sure, it's a powerful beast, but for the love of god, FOUR HUNDRED GRAND?

*slaps forhead* But sorry sir, you are so right, this car is worth every penny, and everybody should sell everything they have worked for so far in order to afford this car.

BMonkey

Almost every aspect. I bet if he took a brand new ZR1 and I took an Enzo down to the University of Texas campus here, I'll pick up more girls than him....alot more.

To be named later

Dang.........$413,000 in San Antonio will buy a pair of his & hers 2009 RX8's, a nice 4 week cruise, college tuition for a year, and a nice new 4 bedroom house with pool and spa and 48" flatscreens in every room, with enough left over to pay for gas for a year.

YaXMaNGTO

No. You're missing it.

You need to comprehend that the guy who buys a ZR1 at $400,000 probably makes $2000 an hour... not a month... not a week... not a day... $2000 an hour.

He has his investments and his children's children's college tuition is paid off. He doesn't think twice about buying a $400 bottle of wine at a restaurant. It's just a different world. Take everything you buy, and divide the price by a factor of 10. You and I buy a $40 bottles of wine. You and I buy $40,000 cars.

BMonkey

Most people making that kind of money aren't hourly....

To be named later

I agree, but I think I am putting it into terms of the common man's lifestyle and income......maybe the guy that will pay $413,000 for a Corvette can afford it easy, but it still is foolish.

And although I do okay, no way in hell will I pay $40 for a bottle of wine.
I have paid $40 a bottle many times but what I have learned is that all my favorites are in the $10 and under range.

YaXMaNGTO

HAH well no ****. When you hear "$4,000,000 a year", can you relate to that as well as "$2000 an hour"? I haven't been paid hourly in 10 years, but I still know what I make in an average hour's work, and it's not $2000 dollars...

Just trying to make a point.

YaXMaNGTO

HEHE but i said "at a restaurant". You could buy the $40 bottle of wine for $12.99 at the grocery store. Otherwise, I get it... gobs of $10-$15 wines that work for me.

I guess the $400,000 ZR1 is "restaurant pricing".

XlYesterdaYlX

I'd rather get a F430 with that type of money.

YaXMaNGTO

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQiZAlYeohQ

Short video... ZR1 throwing a rev


Start the list for "I would pay $400,000 for a car that..."
1. Sounds like that. Check.

To be named later

Yeah..............on the side of the menu I only glance at.

Mikeluvs8

damn they must be smokin that good good!!!!

knicks1984

That price is ridiculous. There's no way I would pay 5x over msrp. I can understand like $20k over sticker but not 5x's the msrp.

digitalSniperX1

Ok, at risk coming off as juvenile, I'll have to respond.

4 valves per cylinder, now that's high technology at its finest. Nevermind it was developed in 1912.

No longer should you marvel at the fact that the rotary has no valve train.

You're flames suck *** quite honestly, and your're definately no engineer.
HP/liter as a so called figures of merit, are virtually meaningless unless used to limit the output of an engine.

Means nothing to me driving a car on the street.

A better figure of merit would be Power Out/Energy In...and in that regard, a rotary engine sucks ***, and everyone that owns one knows it.

The fact that GM gets this kind of power out of a design with limitations (in some areas) is in fact good engineering. I don't expect you to understand that as a concept, so I'll not bother explaining it. One thing that is plainly obvious that it would take you the rest of your natural life to have a clue about the FE analysis that went into the intake/combustion/exhaust flow of that engine.

Try a new figure of merit if you're into that kind of thing. That engine in the Z06 probably weighs less than any engine of similar size and it's center of gravity is much lower. And probably less than many engines producing much less power. This would mean much more than hp/liter.

Oh, and even with the big whopping engine, the Z06 weighs in at roughly equal to an RX-8.

I don't know about the weight in the ZR-1 simply because I don't know about the weight of the addons.

As per the usage of leafsprings in the suspension, that's way over your head, so we won't go there. However, you could call one of the design engineers and tell him you think they should use coil springs because they are high tech. Now that would be funny.

You may think you have graduated from being the dumb kid driving a civic with coffee can sized muffler who thinks they have a race car, but here you've shown you may've failed even at that.

digitalSniperX1

Is that actually a Ferrari interior. I thought it was the friggin batmobile. My RX-8 is more tasteful than that.

Finally, I'm betting the 413 grand some guys are forking over for these things would disqualify them from being a member of the blue collar crowd. Jay Leno may not be the most sophisticated guy on the planet, but I'm guessing his 15 mil a year earns a little respect beyond what joe six pack receives unless of course while driving his ZR-1 he happens upon a pimple faced kid in civic avec fart car, or you. I doubt he'd bother taking the time to figure out which of the two were funnier, he'd just laugh and use both as material in his monologue.

digitalSniperX1

Oh man, an epiphany.

I'm calling GM's Corvette engineers right now to tell them Ferrari engineers think in blue and they are thinking in magenta.

The genius who told me how engineers think summed it up so succinctly in a very similar comment. I hope I got it right.

Ya think they hire wannabe's?

digitalSniperX1

Some sucky engineering over at MB/AMG. 6.3 liters V8 and only 503hp with all the "high tech" goodies. WHAT???????, no 100HP/Liter, what kind of substandard engineering is going on over there at AMG?

BMonkey, give them a call and tell em how your RX8 has 200hp/liter. Then tell them how to fix theirs. Tell em to think in blue.

YaXMaNGTO

^^^ you're on a roll...