Saint_Spinner

I've had a rotary before. I owned a '93 Rx-7. I worked on it alot just to keep it running. I did all the reliability mods. I had an aluminum Koyo radiator, silicone hoses, aluminum AST, dp, larger intercooler, fan mod, rebuilt motor & turbos just to make sure, vacuum pils inserted to keep the stock boost patterns. Still, the car would have a tough time passing smog, very, very tempramental (sp?). I've also owned a 1st. gen Miata...still want to call me a "non-mazda enthusiast"? My daily driver is a '98 Mazda 626.

It was my favorite car...more so than my current NSX and previous S2000, but worrying about whether the car was going to stall out on me or not, not to mention the amount of time and money I put into it just so it will remain drivable (my daily driver) just became too much for me.

What's wrong folks? I can't state an opinion? I know its an Rx-8 website, but I was hoping you were a little bit more mature. I like the rx-8, but the rotary doesn't excite me. I would have probably purchased an Rx-8 if it had a piston engine. Its not just about the motor to everyone. For me, it was the looks, the interior, the drive and etc. Can you really blame me? If you guys like the rotary engine, good for you. I can see its uniqueness, and as mentioned, the one thing I enjoy is the smoothness.

Until they can sort out the torque, MPG and flooding, I'm going to stick with what I'm more comfortable with at this point (piston engines). I'm not saying I'll never own a rotary car, I'm just saying I've been there done that. I don't want to go through the headache anymore. Once they sort those problems (well, to me they are considered problems, to you guys, maybe its "quirks" or "soul" or whatever), I'm staying with pistons.

If this thing is anything like a miata coupe, then I'm all over it. Maybe I'm more of a mazda enthusiast than you folks are.

ASH8

Your points are noted, as I said I would not normally question ones views, but, you did leave yourself open a little.

The RX-8 is a very different beast to a 93 RX-7...
Flooding is not a major issue, its usually owner/ starting procedure related when flooding does occur..

MPG, I can not see improvement of fuel use in future rotaries. Many owners achieve 20-22MPG, for a performance car is OK, I doubt that your NSX would do much better, maybe 10%.
Sure, if you want to wring the neck of a rotary (High RPM) with every gear change then MPG will suffer.... again if you gear changed in your NSX at 8000 rpm your milage would suffer too.
The Tourqe thing is what a rotary is about, apart from installing a turbo, you put up with it.
Still glad to see that your rotary was your favourite car, even up against your current NSX?
I wonder how the retail car price to MPG would be in a comparison between an RX-8 and NSX, I would suggest that the running/purchasing cost of an RX-8 would be at least 60% cheaper over say a 5 year period...including resale value.

Saint_Spinner

Yeah, my Rx-7 has always been my favorite car. I like it more than the NSX. The only thing I like more about the NSX is the peace of mind, MPG and etc. The Rx-7 handled better, had better ergonomics, had better feedback (to me) and IMO is still better looking (not as exotic looking, but IMO still better looking). But I just couldn't trust the damn thing!

But regarding the MPG issue...I don't mind gas guzzlers...I just wished it had the performance to justify the gas consumption. I believe the Rx-8 has similar EPAs as the current Z06? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

The NSX is actually pretty good on gas too. For a while, it was my daily driver. In terms of ownership...actually owning an NSX is cheaper than owning an FD or an Rx-8. I bought a '91 with 125K on it...it now has 163K and not a single problem. (knock on wood). All I've done is the regular maintenance (fluids, spark plugs and waterpump/timing belt). If I were to sell it now, I probably won't lose too much on it considering its age and mileage....but a new NSX...well, that's a different story. Its often a misconception that owning an NSX is expensive.

therm8

I'll give you that the NSX is cheaper to own than the FD, but no way in hell it's cheaper to own than the 8. Insurance and scheduled maintenance alone tilts the scales. FDs were known to have reliability problems. Treating every other rotary like the FD is naive.

52000 trouble free miles.


As far as torque goes, the Renesis makes more n/a torque than any 2-rotor ever. It also has a very flat torque curve. There's no torque issue. That's all it makes by its nature. The only way to add more is to add more air or more displacement(rotors), the same for any engine.

The NSX wasn't exactly kidney splitting in the torque department. And I get equal city and better highway mileage than it's EPA ratings.

Summary: The 8 is not the FD. Flooding is caused by stupidity 90% of the time. Rotaries burn oil by nature, mine uses less than my coworker's S2000, most of the time. And everyone is entitled to their opinion, but it should at least be partially based on fact.

Saint_Spinner

I dunno man....atleast for me, owning my NSX is way cheaper than buying an Rx-8. I bought my NSX for $21K. At the time I bought it, Rx-8s were alot more expensive. Ofcourse buying a used Rx-8 now might be more feasable. Living in L.A., car prices are higher than anywhere else in the U.S. (including used cars). The savings alone in purchasing the NSX over an Rx-8 at that time were more than enough. And in terms of maintenance, its no more expensive than an 8...probably even cheaper. The only expensive part of the maintenance is the timing belt/waterpump, but thats only done at 90K or 10 years. That was all done before I purchased the car, so in owning the car for 2 years, so far its cost me nothing other than oil changes (which is probably less than an 8...it doesn't burn oil.)

Regarding torque, I agree its no monster. But one of the reasons I sold the S2k was because of the lack of torque (atleast for a daily driver, driving through L.A. traffic kinda suck). I'm not saying that the lack of torque in the renesis or S2k is a bad thing, its just not for me (hence I was hoping the Kabura would have a conventional piston, perhaps a supercharged Miata motor or something). After dumping the S2k and getting into the NSX, it was like night and day. It felt like it had more torque (not lots of torque, mind you, but you can def. feel the difference) which was more suitable for my daily driving (stop n go) habits. Compared to the FD, well....the rush of turbos were pretty sweet.

And gas....for some reason I my MPG is much better in my NSX than the S2k. I don't exactly know why. Maybe because I don't have to rev as high to get moving.

Again, I never flamed the rotary motor. I just pointed out facts about it that I (me personaly) didn't like or things that I didn't want to deal with. Ie flooding (happened to my FD numerous times...had to remove spark plugs, dry out..etc. in various parking lots), mpg, torque or hp output.

If you like it, more power to you. I like it too, just not enough for me to want to buy another one anytime soon.

rotary crazy

not everyone has the same luck with cars, I owned and nsx for almost a year, very trouble free car but parts are EXPENSIVE like hell and really hard to find, the air conditioner give me a couple of troubles and I whent thru 2 sets of cluthces ($1500 us dollars a set) and the car is really slow compared to and fd, one piece of advise dont hit a curve very expensive repair $11,000

I have an fd and the car has never flooded once in 8 years and it has the same engine, I did change the seals once because I was portin the engine.

Saint_Spinner

Damn, I wish I had the same luck as you had with my FD. If the FD was reliable, I'd sell my NSX in a heartbeat for one.

rotary crazy

I know, when I tell people about the luck I have with the fd I get a lot of envy, maybe is me I do have a lot of rotary cars and I dont have much trouble with any of them, and my car is very modify, last time at the dyno I got 347 rwhp

Japan8

I probably should have bought the magazine, but... in either "Car Top" or "Best Car" (JDM mags) they had another sketch of the Kabura. The blurb said that it is supposed to be MX-5 platform based. They were saying basically a MX-5 coupe. The I4 looks like a done deal... at least as the base engine. A rotary option looks like it is still underconsideration. These guys said why not just call this the new RX-7... (not that I agree)

CERAMICSEAL

My dear Japan (Pleading politely), why on earth did you not pick it up? You're torturing us here . Get it if you can. Please, pretty please.

zoom44

japan if there is anothher sketch OFFICIALLY out maybe you can make a call?

zoom44

merry christmas ceramic seal and japan 8

CERAMICSEAL

Zoom,
Judging rom the fact that Japan8 is no longer on line, maybe he ran out to buy the mag (Wishful thinking). Merry Christmas to you too my friend. I hope your family is doing well. Be blessed and I hope you have a great 2006. Thanks for all that you do.
PT.

Japan8

Sorry guys... the "little" woman had me a bit tied up over the weekend, so I didn't get a chance to get online (or go get the magazine). I'll see if I can get it tonight. I am wondering if this sketch is official... these mags seem to get the best spy pics and sketches.

Merry Christmas to you guys and all the rest of RX-8 Club.

djgiron

"Tied up" eh, wish the little woman would do that to me more often . . . Merry Christmas

Japan8

Don't I wish "that" was what it was...

More like...

T-von

Well here is a new render of the Kabura Concept. Notice the words RX7 in the text? Hmmmmmmmm

T.T.

That looks more like a coupe. I don't see any room for two more seats. The production model of that could look nice though if they changed the headlights a little bit.

Japan8

^^ uh... no pic is showing. Where is it from? A scan from a JDm magazine?

T-von

I got the pic from this thread here:

http://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=494044

Japan8

The rendering from a magazine pic doesn't come up for me on that site. Oh well... that was the other "sketch" that I mentioned earlier. These guys are pretty good though... their sources and all usually hit pretty close to the mark.

rx8gurl

also, the rotary accent on the bottom lip, hmmmm

ZoomZoomH

iTrader: (1)

so there's 'more' news at NAIAS 2006 than just the Kabura eh???? silly mazda likes to keep everyone guessing... lol

Sephiroth

man i hope thats it. my patience might actually be rewarded.

brillo

Man, thats aggressive. Me likey

that triangle at the bottom of the fornt lip is interesting. Those headlights are way to complicated for real life, but the overall design is nice. Wish I could see the back of the car.