New Lexus LS
#26
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Calgary, AB Canada
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Rhawb
Er, I never noticed carmakers chasing anything Mercedes, they always seem to be playing catchup with BMW. Maybe I'm wrong and I've missed a whole other side of the industry, but I very rarely hear of Mercedes leading its class, it's nearly always BMW.
Depends on the carmaker and the segment. In the sport sedan segment (30-40k), the BMW 3 series is the holy grail. Many have gotten close, but its formula still remains unbeaten. Its closest competitor in terms of driving dynamics has been the G35. In the mid/high 40 - 60k segment, the 5 series is the "driver's car" benchmark.
The 70k+ sedan shopper typically wants luxury above anything else. That's MBZ. The BMW brand has always put sport ahead of luxury. That works well in other price segments, not so much in this one. This is the one segment they don't wholly own. Just look at the conspicuous absence of an M car in the 7 series.
The Lexus LS started as an S class clone. It's always been one. Lexus as a whole - with the notable exception of the IS to an extent - has been chasing MBZ since day 1. Infiniti on the other hand has BMW square in its sights.
Last edited by Christianv; 12-31-2005 at 04:01 PM.
#28
Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
The ls is rwd v8 with the best interior Toyota/lexus can offer. Go sit inside and drive the current ls430 and tell me that it looks like a 25-30k car.
#29
Originally Posted by therm8
Ah but Acuras no longer look anything like their non luxury counterparts. This wasn't true a few years ago, but now they actually differ quite a bit.
![](http://www.canadiandriver.com/photos/2006/acura/csx/06csx_3-1.jpg)
![](http://www.canadiandriver.com/photos/2006/honda/civic/06civic_sdn_1-1.jpg)
There's no logical reason for Lexus to be more popular.
#30
"Call me Darkman"
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto/Florida
Posts: 2,034
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Christianv
The 70k+ sedan shopper typically wants luxury above anything else. That's MBZ. The BMW brand has always put sport ahead of luxury. That works well in other price segments, not so much in this one. This is the one segment they don't wholly own. Just look at the conspicuous absence of an M car in the 7 series.
The Lexus LS started as an S class clone. It's always been one. Lexus as a whole - with the notable exception of the IS to an extent - has been chasing MBZ since day 1. Infiniti on the other hand has BMW square in its sights.
#31
"Call me Darkman"
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto/Florida
Posts: 2,034
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by RX8-79
I sit inside and drive one all the time, unfortunately. The car is about as overrated as they come. It feels about $30k too much for what they ask, and lacks the heft and presence of even b-segment German sedans, let alone the big, high-dollar ones.
![Hahano](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/hahano.gif)
#32
Int'l Man of Mystery
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 3,651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
Lexus may have copied the two tone exterior but looking at the sales #'s for the initial ls400s and you'll see who is really chasing who. MBZ is a glorified chrysler my friend. MBZs quality has been **** lately and is wayyyy overpriced for what you get these days. Also, You are crazy to think that infinity is closing in on BMW. Infinitys truck like interior is a far cry from bmw. Not even gonna mention performance.
#33
"Call me Darkman"
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto/Florida
Posts: 2,034
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Problem is that anyone that wants a bmw will not settle for an infinity. Infinity is lower then lexus and acura. Also, Infinity is far behind the pack where hybrid technology is concerned. You also get what you pay for.
#34
Int'l Man of Mystery
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 3,651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
Problem is that anyone that wants a bmw will not settle for an infinity. Infinity is lower then lexus and acura. Also, Infinity is far behind the pack where hybrid technology is concerned. You also get what you pay for.
![Jerkit](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/jerkit.gif)
Acura... FWD HONDA wannabe luxury cars...
![Thumbsdown](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/thumbsdown.gif)
I like BMW, but would rather buy an Infiniti. You are wrong.
The only people who buy BMW and wouldn't "settle" for an Infiniti are posers that only care about the blue and white propellor on the dash. In that case there is no convincing them otherwise.
You get what you pay for only applies when talking about getting Hyundai instead of a Mazda or Honda. In this case... you get worse service than Lexus, lower reliability and a slower car for MORE money?! yeah... tell me another one.
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
#35
"Call me Darkman"
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto/Florida
Posts: 2,034
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Japan8
Hybrid technology... ![Jerkit](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/jerkit.gif)
![Jerkit](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/jerkit.gif)
Originally Posted by Japan8
Acura... FWD HONDA wannabe luxury cars... ![Thumbsdown](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/thumbsdown.gif)
![Thumbsdown](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/thumbsdown.gif)
![Freak Anim](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/Freak_anim.gif)
Originally Posted by Japan8
I like BMW, but would rather buy an Infiniti. You are wrong.
![Spank](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/spank.gif)
Originally Posted by Japan8
The only people who buy BMW and wouldn't "settle" for an Infiniti are posers that only care about the blue and white propellor on the dash. In that case there is no convincing them otherwise.
You get what you pay for only applies when talking about getting Hyundai instead of a Mazda or Honda. In this case... you get worse service than Lexus, lower reliability and a slower car for MORE money?! yeah... tell me another one.![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
You get what you pay for only applies when talking about getting Hyundai instead of a Mazda or Honda. In this case... you get worse service than Lexus, lower reliability and a slower car for MORE money?! yeah... tell me another one.
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
![Uhh](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/uhh.gif)
#36
Int'l Man of Mystery
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 3,651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
We'll see what happens when oil reaches $100 a barrel.
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
And how many people were crying like that in the 1970's?
![Hahano](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/hahano.gif)
I have been and still do pay more for gas than you do. Europeans pay even more. Cry me a river.
RL is awd...
![Freak Anim](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/Freak_anim.gif)
Yeah...you like bmw. I said "if you wanted a bmw".... not liked.
![Spank](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/spank.gif)
![Scratchhead](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/scratchhead.gif)
WTH is this nonesense? You're basically saying that all bmw drivers are posers because they didn't settle for an infinity.
![Uhh](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/uhh.gif)
#37
Bummed, but bring on OU!
Originally Posted by RX8-79
Clearly youve never seen the csx next to a civic.
#38
"Call me Darkman"
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto/Florida
Posts: 2,034
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Japan8
Whatever. ![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
And how many people were crying like that in the 1970's?![Hahano](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/hahano.gif)
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
And how many people were crying like that in the 1970's?
![Hahano](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/hahano.gif)
Originally Posted by Japan8
I have been and still do pay more for gas than you do. Europeans pay even more. Cry me a river.
Ignorance is bliss my friend
Originally Posted by Japan8
The RL isn't all their cars.;.. just the top of the line showboat. It took them how long to FINALLy release something with AWD? And they still don't have any other AWD cars or RWD cars (that aren't 2 seater sports cars).
Nissan/infinity has how many awd cars?(trucks don't count)
![Spank](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/spank.gif)
what's with all this Nissan/Infinity superiority? Just admit it, Nissan is the biggest Toyota wannabee.
Originally Posted by Japan8
If you wanted a BMW you'd buy a BMW. IF you wanted an Infiniti, you'd buy an Infiniti. WTF is the point of your statement? ![Scratchhead](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/scratchhead.gif)
![Scratchhead](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/scratchhead.gif)
![Bootyshake](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/bootyshake.gif)
Originally Posted by Japan8
Where did I say that? Maybe I wasn't clear enough. Anyone who buys a BMW because it's a BMW... not because it's a nice enthusiasts luxury sport sedan, etc. Pretty much the average person who does buy a BMW... they buy it because they are posers. Nothing to do with settling and everything to do with buying something just because of the name on it. I think most people can understand that concept. Why can't you?
#39
Int'l Man of Mystery
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 3,651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
Keep living in the 70's then. Just like nissan.
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
You trash Nissan, but what the hell is BMW doing? Where are their hybrid models? I don't see a 530h model like Lexus has with the GS350h. Keep trying.
![Hahano](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/hahano.gif)
Want a cracker?
Ignorance is bliss my friend
Ignorance is bliss my friend
![Confused](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/confused.gif)
So what point are you trying to make here?
Nissan/infinity has how many awd cars?(trucks don't count)
Nissan/infinity has how many awd cars?(trucks don't count)
![Spank](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/spank.gif)
what's with all this Nissan/Infinity superiority? Just admit it, Nissan is the biggest Toyota wannabee.
No Nissan/Infiniti superiority. Nissan offers cars that match market expectations better than Honda does for this segment. I'd buy a Lexus IS before I'd get a TSX or TL. The Japanese hardly give Honda any respect. Only the few sports cars... NSX, S2000, Civic Type R, Integra Type R... that's it. Honda is a motorcycle company. I respect their bikes... well-built and reliable. Their cars is another story.
Yeah, but don't you think that most infinity owners would have bought the bmw if they were priced the same? I do....
![Bootyshake](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/bootyshake.gif)
I LIKE the styling of the G35 coupe a lot. I'm betting the next one in 2007 will be even more sexy. My mother loves the G35 coupe and sedan. She could care less about BMWs. My aunt has a e36 BMW. Her husband has a hard on for BMWs. My aunt would rather not buy an e90. She likes the new IS better. She also thinks the e90 is overpriced. The e90 BMW is O K. We'll see how the coupe comes out. The 5 series looks like ***... which leads to the M5 looking like *** too. The 6 series and the M6... they are sexy... I'll give BMW that. But the price... ouch. People will buy them, but to not only me (even mentioned in the magazines)... BMW seems to be getting to the point of pricing themselves out of the market.
Why can't you understand that bmw has this persona for a reason. I'm sure that a bag of infinity owners are in this category as well.
Why can't you understand the concept of "hype"? Current BMWs aren't all hype, but they're not the best thing since sliced bread either.
#41
"Call me Darkman"
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto/Florida
Posts: 2,034
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Japan8
How is Nissan living in the 70's? What? You think hybrids are the future?
They're a stop gap measure. Like the oil crisis in the 70's, when the political wind changes again, so will gas prices. We'll see what happens at that point in time. Emissions concerns will play a bigger role in forcing changes than gas prices.
You trash Nissan, but what the hell is BMW doing? Where are their hybrid models? I don't see a 530h model like Lexus has with the GS350h. Keep trying.
This doesn't even make any sense...![Confused](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/confused.gif)
Point? You were the one trying to make a point. You were the one that brought AWD into this. I said that Acura sucks because more than 90% of their offerings are FWD only. BMW is all RWD or AWD. MB is all RWD or AWD. Infiniti is now all RWD or AWD. Lexus is almost entirely RWD or AWD (particularly with their current remake). It looks like everyone else is with the program as to what this market segment is about. Bitching about Honda/Acura on these grounds is more than reasonable.
Uh... left field. Succintly explain how and why Nissan is a Toyota wannabee? You just said that they suck because they don't offer any hybrids. Making hybrids and introducing them across your line of cars would be acting like a "Toyota wannabe".
No Nissan/Infiniti superiority. Nissan offers cars that match market expectations better than Honda does for this segment. I'd buy a Lexus IS before I'd get a TSX or TL. The Japanese hardly give Honda any respect. Only the few sports cars... NSX, S2000, Civic Type R, Integra Type R... that's it. Honda is a motorcycle company. I respect their bikes... well-built and reliable. Their cars is another story.
Uh, no. You seem to assume a lot.
I LIKE the styling of the G35 coupe a lot. I'm betting the next one in 2007 will be even more sexy. My mother loves the G35 coupe and sedan. She could care less about BMWs. My aunt has a e36 BMW. Her husband has a hard on for BMWs. My aunt would rather not buy an e90. She likes the new IS better. She also thinks the e90 is overpriced. The e90 BMW is O K. We'll see how the coupe comes out. The 5 series looks like ***... which leads to the M5 looking like *** too. The 6 series and the M6... they are sexy... I'll give BMW that. But the price... ouch. People will buy them, but to not only me (even mentioned in the magazines)... BMW seems to be getting to the point of pricing themselves out of the market.
It takes all types.
Why can't you understand the concept of "hype"? Current BMWs aren't all hype, but they're not the best thing since sliced bread either.
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
You trash Nissan, but what the hell is BMW doing? Where are their hybrid models? I don't see a 530h model like Lexus has with the GS350h. Keep trying.
![Hahano](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/hahano.gif)
This doesn't even make any sense...
![Confused](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/confused.gif)
Point? You were the one trying to make a point. You were the one that brought AWD into this. I said that Acura sucks because more than 90% of their offerings are FWD only. BMW is all RWD or AWD. MB is all RWD or AWD. Infiniti is now all RWD or AWD. Lexus is almost entirely RWD or AWD (particularly with their current remake). It looks like everyone else is with the program as to what this market segment is about. Bitching about Honda/Acura on these grounds is more than reasonable.
Uh... left field. Succintly explain how and why Nissan is a Toyota wannabee? You just said that they suck because they don't offer any hybrids. Making hybrids and introducing them across your line of cars would be acting like a "Toyota wannabe".
No Nissan/Infiniti superiority. Nissan offers cars that match market expectations better than Honda does for this segment. I'd buy a Lexus IS before I'd get a TSX or TL. The Japanese hardly give Honda any respect. Only the few sports cars... NSX, S2000, Civic Type R, Integra Type R... that's it. Honda is a motorcycle company. I respect their bikes... well-built and reliable. Their cars is another story.
Uh, no. You seem to assume a lot.
I LIKE the styling of the G35 coupe a lot. I'm betting the next one in 2007 will be even more sexy. My mother loves the G35 coupe and sedan. She could care less about BMWs. My aunt has a e36 BMW. Her husband has a hard on for BMWs. My aunt would rather not buy an e90. She likes the new IS better. She also thinks the e90 is overpriced. The e90 BMW is O K. We'll see how the coupe comes out. The 5 series looks like ***... which leads to the M5 looking like *** too. The 6 series and the M6... they are sexy... I'll give BMW that. But the price... ouch. People will buy them, but to not only me (even mentioned in the magazines)... BMW seems to be getting to the point of pricing themselves out of the market.
It takes all types.
Why can't you understand the concept of "hype"? Current BMWs aren't all hype, but they're not the best thing since sliced bread either.
I have no interest in your "jdm magazine" degree. Your love for nissan is taking over this thread.
Fact is, Toyota/Lexus is the better car company end of story. I love mazdas myself but I'm not going to pretend something is better based on my biased views.
#42
Int'l Man of Mystery
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 3,651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Don Vito... right... ![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
G35
http://www.caranddriver.com/article....ticle_id=10389
http://www.caranddriver.com/article....&page_number=8
M45
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....&page_number=4
http://www.automotivearticles.com/Fi...finiti_M.shtml
http://www.caranddriver.com/article....rticle_id=9024
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
G35
http://www.caranddriver.com/article....ticle_id=10389
http://www.caranddriver.com/article....&page_number=8
M45
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....&page_number=4
http://www.automotivearticles.com/Fi...finiti_M.shtml
http://www.caranddriver.com/article....rticle_id=9024
Last edited by Japan8; 01-01-2006 at 11:36 AM.
#43
Int'l Man of Mystery
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 3,651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
Bmw has been working on hydrogen power for some time now.
I have no interest in your "jdm magazine" degree. Your love for nissan is taking over this thread.
Fact is, Toyota/Lexus is the better car company end of story. I love mazdas myself but I'm not going to pretend something is better based on my biased views.
I have no interest in your "jdm magazine" degree. Your love for nissan is taking over this thread.
Fact is, Toyota/Lexus is the better car company end of story. I love mazdas myself but I'm not going to pretend something is better based on my biased views.
![Confused](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/confused.gif)
![Confused](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/confused.gif)
![Scratchhead](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/scratchhead.gif)
Last edited by Japan8; 01-01-2006 at 11:47 AM.
#44
Originally Posted by Japan8
#45
The new Infinity M, in either 6 or 8 cyclinder version, positively gives Lexus the official geriatric viewer's choice award.
The Infiniti M, which I haven driven, is light years more exciting in the way it looks (especially the interior) and drives, than any Lexus - especially the LS.
The Infiniti M, which I haven driven, is light years more exciting in the way it looks (especially the interior) and drives, than any Lexus - especially the LS.
#46
"Call me Darkman"
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto/Florida
Posts: 2,034
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by RotoRocket
The new Infinity M, in either 6 or 8 cyclinder version, positively gives Lexus the official geriatric viewer's choice award.
The Infiniti M, which I haven driven, is light years more exciting in the way it looks (especially the interior) and drives, than any Lexus - especially the LS.
The Infiniti M, which I haven driven, is light years more exciting in the way it looks (especially the interior) and drives, than any Lexus - especially the LS.
#47
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Calgary, AB Canada
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
Looks and "feel" are not always related. The Infinity looks nice and all, but this is a simple case of quantity over quality.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post