klegg

I finally get it...you have a G35, and you call it a skyline....Only took me what, 9 months...

klegg

Actually, I started this thread about Z trolls, and made a point of saying that I thought the Z was a fine car...

SDFLY

Speaking of trolls that we enjoy, what happened to IKE here?

RotorManiac

1 -> Now I'm confused! Which car is the G35?! Does it have anything in common with the awesome GT-R34 Skyline? Can someone post a pic please?

2 -> The fact the Z is so heavy is a tragic problem of this car, and a DAMN GOOD REASON for NOT buying it! Calling the Z a 'sports' car is like calling an obese man 'athlete'. I believe some categories have limitations and Nissan has exceeded them.
Having 280hp and amazing torque means much better performance numbers, which the Z simlpy can't get. Take an EvoVIII for instance, it kills the Z for fun! :o

mysql101

Anyone else think the fatal flaw with the RX-8 was making a car so cool that the owners can't stand to leave it in parking lots?

I never had this problem with any of my other cars. I wonder if I'd have this problem with the 350Z.

Rotarian_SC

The G35 is the new generation of skylines. Eventually they will make a GTR-35 skyline off of it.

Actually I think that in America baseball players and football linesmen are still considered "athletes"

RotorManiac

Wow, the GTR-34 was one hell of a car. Can't wait to see its replacement!
What do yo mean with your second note? Sorry, (know nothing about baseball) but I didn't get it...

Skyline Maniac

1) V35 Skyline = 11th generation Skyline = Infiniti G35 sedan.
CPV35 Skyline = Infiniti G35 Coupe = replacement for R34 GT
2007 GT-R (Infiniti?) = R34 GT-R replacement = No longer called a Skyline.

Skyline comes in many trims, 2 doors, 4 doors, turbo, S, and then the famous GT-R. The CPV35 (G35C) is not meant to be a replacement for the R34 GT-R but rather a replacement for the 'normal' R34 GT Coupes. In that sense, the G35C surpasses its predecessor in all luxury + performance category.

obsidian02

Isn't this the Z forum of the rx8club ? Never read a very long Z discussion before, and the "https://www.rx8club.com/newreply.php?s=&action=newreply&postid=377931" is a powerful magnet (like an invitation ). Very interesting. But there is one problem here. I am speaking about the money management. Folks here think a million dollar is a lot of money just for stupid fun. Huh! Folks, learn how to invest right. Just don't put money down for car before you learn how to invest. If you think a million dollar is a lot, just wait and see how much you need for your kids, wife , family and retirement.

Ike

Huh?

Rotarian_SC

Baseball players and football linesmen can be fat. Some football linesmen weigh over 400 lbs. I think that the 350Z is somewhat of a modern day americanized sports car. Like how the general American views a Charger as true sports car, while the general European view is something lighter, with great handling. To Europeans soccer players are athletes, football linesmen are athletes for america.

zyran

I shall end this all here.

On Top Gear's Lap Times, both the RX-8 and the 350Z got the exact same time - 1:31.8. The Z costs £2000 more. In other words, the Z compromises handling over power whereas vice versa in the RX-8. It's all up to self-preference.

Many say the 350Z is a big muscular car where as the 8 may seem more feminine (no offense) to some. If you ask me, these cars were built for different purposes and both have delivered very well.

All of you have to remember. Different car, different purpose, different market. You don't sell an SUV to a bunch of drag racers. And you don't sell a sports car to my grandma. The Z IMO was built for real racing enthusiasts - big engine, wicked looks. The 8 was build for people who wanted a sports car without compromising practicallity. I call it a family sports car Amen.

Shiri

Hi,

I'm an avid forumer from my350z.com and a number of other Nissan forums.

I've been anticipating the RX8 for as long as anybody else. I also live in Japan so I see a lot of going-ons between the major car companies.

i have also seen this kind of thread many times, resulting in losers on both sides.

Firstly, TOP GEAR tested a 350Z on a slightly wet track. They tested the RX8 on a dry track. If tested under the same conditions, the results would be far different from what people are led to believe.

People, use common sense, the Z is a sports car with more power. Its bound to perform better than the RX8 on the track, drag and twisties.

Jeremy Clarkson from TOP GEAR liked the RX8, but was severely put off by it when he drove it in the wet.
This can only conclude one thing, the RX8 could not perform the STIG test on a damp or wet track. It could only perform anywhere near its potentials on the dry track.

Japan's Best Motoring has tested both Z and RX8 and it is clear that the Z is a runaway winner on the track. Its main competitor is the S2000 and M3. Given the Z's mid range performance characteristics, it is the kind of car that generally does well on any track. The S2000 is great for the smaller ones, and the M3 strive on the larger more open tracks.

People need to use common sense here and really stop trying to compare the 2. The RX8 is not in the same league as the Z. Mazda tries to fulfil a niche of its own, which I think it has been successful. Not quite a fullfledge sports car like the Z, not quite a luxury cruiser like the G35c. Its a kind of an in between.

As for the comment of what is cool and what isn't. Some cars don't need to shout to everybody "hey I'm cool", they just are.
People turn heads because they are looking at a cool car that is visually gorgeous going fast. I wonder if I could get that in an RX8.

And as for the original OP :

"I have never understood why we get so many nasty Z trolls, but I had a revelation today."


NASTY Z TROLLS, show me. How do you know they are Z owners, or some other people trying to boost the page count for the advertising companies on these pages?

"The Z is good, real good, using current existing tech...nothing new or innovative, just the brute force approach...but it works."


The Z is not just good, it is excellent. It is using a combination of technology and true and tried methods of Nissan engineering to build perhaps the world's best 6 cylinder car, in a package that is a delight to the everyday sports car fans.

The 350z is an NA vehicle, relying on neither turbos or superchargers. Yet, its performance actually matches the previous Z model, the Z32 300TT, a twin turbo 3.0 litre sports car released in 1989 (and was the car responsible for forcing Toyota to push back its Supra release by another 3 years).

Judging by which car has progressed the most, technologically wise, the 350z has matched and even surpasses its predecessors. The RX8 has not.

"And without the serious problems that the Z has...(I do not consider the mpg or the HP a serious problem in a sports car, and the flash's have improved it quit a bit. Plus, mazda did more to make it right then any other car company does in this situation....Just look at how long it took nissan to fix the radio issue, not to mention the front end issue that is still not fixed!)"


I think from the word go, you set out the put Nissan and the owners into a bad light. Yet later, you deny it.


"The 8 is elegant in a design sense....any fool can put a huge engine in a car and have it go fast....it takes genius to do what Mazda did with the 8...perhaps the most unique mass produced car on the road. And that it what sets the troll off about our car."


Again, I think the fool you may be referring to is "Dodge" and their Vipers.... hang on, maybe you are actually bagging the Z once again.

Well, actually I don't know what is so innovative about an engine that is only 1.3 litre in capacity and weighs less than a typical family car, yet uses more petrol than a 4WD vehicle and is smaller than a typical family car.

If it is a "sports" car, it has POOR performance. No petrolhead in their right mind would buy this car to go fast. It doesn't make sense.

So perhaps its not really a "sports" car.

It is what I've always thought it would be, a compromise that only Mazda (with Ford's help) could pull off.

I actually like the RX8 and have defended it when I was on the S2ki forum, but to call it what it isn't is what causes threads like this to constantly pop up and beat the same dead horse all over again.

Its also a shame that some owners on this forum has to be jerks.

PaulieWalnuts

Welcome! You make some good points about how the 8 and Z are in a different category. I agree. However, the above statement shows you are knowledgeable about the Z but clearly know very little technology wise about the 8.

Shiri

So from a performance point of view, how has the RX8 advanced over the RX7?

No point stating a problem if you have no solution.

PaulieWalnuts

You said technology, not performance. Correct?

Shiri

Yes but technology evolves for a reason, to improve performance.

Shiri

Well I'm waiting PaulieWalnuts.

mysql101

Not a flame, but I am interested in hearing how you think the 350Z, a heavier car without as good a job with internal balancing would perform better than then RX-8 due to weather conditions. It is a given that the 350Z has a higher output engine, but to say that water makes the RX-8 unusable?

It sounds like you're rating the cars strictly based on what tires they came with.

PaulieWalnuts

Sorry, but that's not the arguement you first proposed - technology. Also, now that you have decided to switch the argument to performance, you are contradicting yourself. The 350Z is the same type of car as the orginal (?) 240Z. You so nicely pointed out that the 8 is in a different category than the Z which also applies to the 7. The 8 is no RX-7 and wasn't meant to be its replacement or "successor" nor was created to beat a Z. If you're going to create an argument, make relevant points and stop being shifty.

Now regarding technology, the Z has a sedan/coupe platform with a motor that's also used in their trucks if I'm not mistaken. A 280 hp 6 cylinder? Chevy SUVs have those. Technology wise, the Z is a (high performance and nice looking) parts bin sports car. The only thing I've seen so far that is impressive about the Z technology is the fact that they can use the platform for so many different models.

Shiri

The Z has great internal balancing, as you put it, but you have probably overlooked the fact that it was not designed specifically for handling alone. The immense power that comes with it tells you that. And with that power, you need a more rigid frame. It happens to every sports car that tries to add more power.
Some become more expensive than others because they use more expensive and more complicated components.

The Z carries more weight because of the power it produces. The RX8 produces less power because it has less weight to pull. Being a lighter car does make it seem light on its feet, hence the "supposedly superior handling" that some people keep raving on about.

Regarding tires, I guess that is a fair argument if the companies were trying to keep costs down. The Z was fitted with second rated tires as some owners on my350z can attest to.

Dracon

wow... this is funny... I don't have either cars, I was just linked here from another forum that was making fun of bickering on the internet... But now that I'm here, I just can't seem to help myself... I have to post. Oh, btw, I have a WRX...


I actually have driven bot a Z and an 8, and I liked both cars, as others have said they have two different purposes. I do think it's funny when people say things that meant to talk down to the other car group but they make it out to be just general talking...

example:

Z owner: "I think the 8 is a great car, I almost bought my wife one..." or "The 8 is a great car, but I wanted a sports car that felt like one..."

8 Owner: "I think the Z is a great car, It's just too heavy, uses old technoligy from a sedan, and put a big V6 in it because it's not innovative... But I love the car!"

Both are dumb...

bottom line, My modded WRX (272whp) will smoke both of you, BUT I'm selling it for something else because it doesn't match what I want...

both cars are great, but I do think it's funny when car people talk bad about another car when it's just not the case. WRX guys talk bad about the SRT-4 because it's a "neon" or "wrong wheel drive" but the fact is, it cost less than our WRX's, doesn't have the Tranny probs we do, and is a Damn fast car...

I've heard over and over in this post that the 8 can beat the Z on a track, or from a roll, or from something... and some guy posted a link to a Motor Trend article that tested the cars. Well guess what, for all the people calling the Z heavy, and overweight, and whatever, here are the numbers from that article:

1/4 mile, sec @ mph ------ RX8 - 14.49 @ 95.47 ----- 350Z - 13.77 @ 100.94

Braking, 100-0 mph, ft ------ RX8 - 318 ----- 350Z - 318

Braking, 60-0 mph, ft ------ RX8 - 115 ----- 350Z - 113

600-ft slalom, mph ------ RX8 - 68.1 ----- 350Z - 68.0

200-ft skidpad, lateral g ------- RX8 - 0.87 ----- 350Z - 0.87

Figure-8, sec @ avg g ------- RX8 - 26.1 @ 0.70 ----- 350Z - 26.1 @ 0.71

Top-gear rpm @ 60 mph ------ RX8 - 3000 ----- 350Z - 2250

The Z beats or ties it every time, who the flip cares if one does it more innovativey than another.

That being said, THE RX8 WON THE SHOOTOUT, which means it's a damn good car. it'll carry more things, still hang with most every car out there, handles awesome, has a creamy interior, and looks great!

It all comes down to what YOU want, what YOU think looks better, what YOU need.

Do you want a lot of torque? get the Z.

Do you want to actually be able to take your golf clubs to the course? get the 8. ( I know you can fit them in the Z... I'm just saying...)

I'm looking at both cars right now, am driving 2 sales people crazy because I keep comming in and looking at both but never buy... I actually like the looks of the Z, the interior of the 8, the handleing of both, the torque of the Z, the room of the 8, the.... I just keep going back and forth, but I LOVE both cars.

It all comes down to each person looking at both cars and saying. "I need this, and want this" if you do that, one car should come to the front. it's going to be different for each person. Why the heck do people have to argue...

PaulieWalnuts

Is that really necessary? Funny. The more you post the more immature, irrational and unbalanced you become. Very much like some of the owners on this forum you referred to as jerks. It's impossible to have a constructive argument with irrational people.

Shiri

Sorry, but that's not the arguement you first proposed - technology. Also, now that you have decided to switch the argument to performance, you are contradicting yourself. The 350Z is the same type of car as the orginal (?) 240Z.


Sorry, perhaps you're not understanding what I wrote. Technology is the reason why we change our cars, phones and computers. When the 350z and RX8 came out, what were we expecting technologically wise? A faster car? A more efficient car? A different looking plenum?

The 350z was based on the 240z, just with the latest technology Nissan has engineered over the past couple of decades or more.

The Z now is faster, more efficient and a better sports car overall.


You so nicely pointed out that the 8 is in a different category than the Z which also applies to the 7. The 8 is no RX-7 and wasn't meant to be its replacement or "successor" nor was created to beat a Z. If you're going to create an argument, make relevant points and stop being shifty.


What's so shifty about the points I made? The 350z was a replacement for the 300z, the RX8 was the replacement for the RX7.


Now regarding technology, the Z has a sedan/coupe platform with a motor that's also used in their trucks if I'm not mistaken. A 280 hp 6 cylinder? Chevy SUVs have those. Technology wise, the Z is a (high performance and nice looking) parts bin sports car. The only thing I've seen so far that is impressive about the Z technology is the fact that they can use the platform for so many different models.

I can see where you're going here, defensive.

The parts bin is an excuse that too many people uses when they really have nothing else to say. That's too bad. All companies reuses parts, you could be the richest man on earth (like Bill Gates) but still has enough brains to reuse current technology than to reinvent the wheel. Even Bill would reuse his codes to make future Windows.

The VQ engine did not start out as a 3.5 l 287hp workhorse, it had much more humbler beginnings.

But because it is so flexible, its design allows Nissan to use it for several different applications, from sports cars to trucks. This is not a new idea, Lamborghini, Ford, Mercedes, BMW, GM, Volvo etc etc have all been doing this for a long long time now.

To add to this, the VQ has established new heights, gaining successes in motor racing in tthe JGTC with both the 350z and Skyline race cars.

It is truely an amazing engine which is too often overlooked by people too small minded.