Top Gear Review - Caddy CTS - Hammond at his best :)
05-19-2006, 09:04 PM
#26
Originally Posted by picosrx8
Unless you have spent some sick dinero on a car that has a handstitched leather wrapped dash, then your dash is plastic. Some looks a little nice due to texture but if the fit is good, its all the same ****.
05-19-2006, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by r0tor
I drive a CTS at a Car and Driver Editor for a Day event and came to the conclusion it wasn't very well sorted out... the steering was in no way precise and the brake feel and more importantly the brake bias was completely f'd up as the fronts locked up really easily and the rear brakes weren't even doing anything
05-20-2006, 08:59 AM
#29
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Originally Posted by New Yorker
That's just not true! Compare the dash of a VW or Audi (plastic) to the dash of a Pontiac (also plastic). The difference is HUGE! The plastic in the German car's have a quality feel to them; the plastic in the Pontiac—as someone else so well put it—is "the same awful plastic RCA uses in their TV sets". GM thinks we won't notice the difference, but guess what? They're wrong.
05-20-2006, 09:50 AM
#30
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I love Top Gear. They're funny and they get to the point as bluntly as they want, but always in an entertaining way. They think all American cars are crap? News flash - they're mostly right.
05-20-2006, 12:08 PM
#31
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I agree that the car you drove must have been ragged from the other drivers. My CTS-V has extremely precise steering, quick turn-in and fantastic braking (Brembos with 14.5 in. rotors).
As far as the dash plastics, I test drove an M3 and a C32 AMG before buying my V. PicosRx8 is right- it's the same stuff, just with a different pattern on it. I agree that Pontiacs and Chevy dashes feel like knocking on the top of a TV set, but the Cadillacs all have a soft touch material.
Getting back to Top Gear and the CTS, their review of the CTS-V was a perfect example of the kind of bias you guys are talking about. They praised the straight line power and handling, loved the brakes and the fact that you could completely disable all the stability nannies. Then he complains about the door chime if you open the door with your key in the ignition or unbuckle your seatbelt in gear. The seatbelt chime is government mandated, and the key reminder could keep you from locking yourself out of the car- handy feature!
It's just typical that he has to find something to bitch about. Hell, he complained about the new Z06 having "fast food" as one of the default naviagtion icons. "So American...." he said. PPppffttttt.
As far as the dash plastics, I test drove an M3 and a C32 AMG before buying my V. PicosRx8 is right- it's the same stuff, just with a different pattern on it. I agree that Pontiacs and Chevy dashes feel like knocking on the top of a TV set, but the Cadillacs all have a soft touch material.
Getting back to Top Gear and the CTS, their review of the CTS-V was a perfect example of the kind of bias you guys are talking about. They praised the straight line power and handling, loved the brakes and the fact that you could completely disable all the stability nannies. Then he complains about the door chime if you open the door with your key in the ignition or unbuckle your seatbelt in gear. The seatbelt chime is government mandated, and the key reminder could keep you from locking yourself out of the car- handy feature!
It's just typical that he has to find something to bitch about. Hell, he complained about the new Z06 having "fast food" as one of the default naviagtion icons. "So American...." he said. PPppffttttt.
05-20-2006, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Tony Orlando
I agree that the car you drove must have been ragged from the other drivers. My CTS-V has extremely precise steering, quick turn-in and fantastic braking (Brembos with 14.5 in. rotors).
05-22-2006, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by saturn
Of course most American cars aren't that great. But, these guys, Clarkson particularly, bash American cars and seem to forget that they are by in large made for Americans. We have a different road system with different kinds of drivers and topography. We have different service costs for foreign and domestic cars. We have different needs, wants, and preferences. The CTS is perfect for some people and it wouldn't be a terrible thing if these guys would realize that not everyone is a middle-aged dude living in England.
I know it's a UK show, but maybe they could mask their hatred just a smidge. If they're not careful they're gunna get tossed in the Axis of Evil.
I know it's a UK show, but maybe they could mask their hatred just a smidge. If they're not careful they're gunna get tossed in the Axis of Evil.
In the ford truck review, they straight up speak about the american lifestyle vs the eu lifestyle and why the truck is as it is.
Half of the reason they rip US rides is for the sake of comedy, and half because our cars suck...they rip every country, actually.
And hey, it could be worse, we could be french!
:-P
05-22-2006, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by RotoRocket
Clarkston is an unadulterated *******.
At one point he knocks on the exterior of the Cadillac with his knuckles and then assuredly announced that "American cars are cheaply built."
What the hell does that prove? Did he detect something wrong with the harmonic frequency of the metal?
What an ***.
Edit - I just noticed Rhawb already addressed my bitch completely.
At one point he knocks on the exterior of the Cadillac with his knuckles and then assuredly announced that "American cars are cheaply built."
What the hell does that prove? Did he detect something wrong with the harmonic frequency of the metal?
What an ***.
Edit - I just noticed Rhawb already addressed my bitch completely.
In japan, the engineers spend time making the sound of the door closing sound "good". BMW likes to make their cars feel "solid" and they even make sure the hood closes with a proper "feel". Jag spent a lot of time on building a "classy" car.
These things may, or may not contribute to the effectiveness of the product, but it attributes something the british care more about than americans tend to.
Quality.
I don't need a $1000 pen(don't have one either :-P), and in all honesty, it writes about 1% better than a $5 pen, but it has something special. It can't really be quantified. It's just the pedigree, or class of the product. In america, class isn't thought of that often...in the UK it's still woven into daily life...and that includes how things feel when you knock on them with your nuckles.
Dell makes some pretty good computers, and they compute just as well as my thinkpad...but the thinkpad "feels better" when closed and i'm carrying it around...ithat makes me feel good.
Hell, an evo is fast, and drives well, but once i stop feeling the thrills of the driving and look around, the car sucks. Imagine washing a car...that's more enjoyable when your car is well built...and that's half of the fun to these guys. It's about owning something nice, all around. When driving it, looking at it, or kicking the tires.
As an american, you might not understand, or care...it's just how they think?!?!
*ironic though that with all i've said, the britts have made so few fully well rounded cars!*
05-22-2006, 12:43 PM
#35
i pwn therefore i am
Originally Posted by hedgecore
It is mostly comedy, but it is also valid.
In japan, the engineers spend time making the sound of the door closing sound "good". BMW likes to make their cars feel "solid" and they even make sure the hood closes with a proper "feel". Jag spent a lot of time on building a "classy" car.
These things may, or may not contribute to the effectiveness of the product, but it attributes something the british care more about than americans tend to.
Quality.
I don't need a $1000 pen(don't have one either :-P), and in all honesty, it writes about 1% better than a $5 pen, but it has something special. It can't really be quantified. It's just the pedigree, or class of the product. In america, class isn't thought of that often...in the UK it's still woven into daily life...and that includes how things feel when you knock on them with your nuckles.
Dell makes some pretty good computers, and they compute just as well as my thinkpad...but the thinkpad "feels better" when closed and i'm carrying it around...ithat makes me feel good.
Hell, an evo is fast, and drives well, but once i stop feeling the thrills of the driving and look around, the car sucks. Imagine washing a car...that's more enjoyable when your car is well built...and that's half of the fun to these guys. It's about owning something nice, all around. When driving it, looking at it, or kicking the tires.
As an american, you might not understand, or care...it's just how they think?!?!
*ironic though that with all i've said, the britts have made so few fully well rounded cars!*
In japan, the engineers spend time making the sound of the door closing sound "good". BMW likes to make their cars feel "solid" and they even make sure the hood closes with a proper "feel". Jag spent a lot of time on building a "classy" car.
These things may, or may not contribute to the effectiveness of the product, but it attributes something the british care more about than americans tend to.
Quality.
I don't need a $1000 pen(don't have one either :-P), and in all honesty, it writes about 1% better than a $5 pen, but it has something special. It can't really be quantified. It's just the pedigree, or class of the product. In america, class isn't thought of that often...in the UK it's still woven into daily life...and that includes how things feel when you knock on them with your nuckles.
Dell makes some pretty good computers, and they compute just as well as my thinkpad...but the thinkpad "feels better" when closed and i'm carrying it around...ithat makes me feel good.
Hell, an evo is fast, and drives well, but once i stop feeling the thrills of the driving and look around, the car sucks. Imagine washing a car...that's more enjoyable when your car is well built...and that's half of the fun to these guys. It's about owning something nice, all around. When driving it, looking at it, or kicking the tires.
As an american, you might not understand, or care...it's just how they think?!?!
*ironic though that with all i've said, the britts have made so few fully well rounded cars!*
But with Clarkson, as soon as he gets the impression that the car feels cheap he dismisses it as though it has no redeeming value. Then he makes some quip about how Americans are fat and stupid -- really helpful.
The problem isn't that he values certain things that the average American doesn't, it's that he thinks he's better and more refined than everyone, especially Americans. We have different tastes and priorities (on the whole) and that doesn't make us better or worse -- just different.
The dude rides around in supercars all day, bashes everything that comes out of America (he's actually stated that he's boycotting America in his home whatever the hell that means), and then owns a Ford Focus.
In the end it's all very entertaining and his issues don't affect the entertainment value of the show. They do however, affect the information that comes from the show. I find that to be anecdotal at best.
05-22-2006, 01:36 PM
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clarkson and crew argue many valid points about the cars they test .. they're statements are mostly valid and to the point .. the way they present them is a huge bonus for the show .. one thats makes it very entertaining and unforgettable .. and wins them awards - best unscipted show - i think it was .. i'm not surprised that this show is broadcasted all over eu as it does provide a service to consumers of the automobile market .. they are critics .. and they dont hesitate to give a ***** to the wall bashing for things that are wrong with a car .. viewers should have no problem in finding the tone of each review .. and should definatelly walk away with a good idea of flaws associated with a car they are interested in
it's definatelly worth while to find the full episodes of 'top gear' to catch all additional post review comments of the vehicles .. it is definatelly worth while to watch the full episodes for their entertainment value alone .. i've seen every single one (i hope) and not one had me bored .. in fact all of them inspired some passion towards or against a make or a model of a car .. thats the type show than can enthuse a person about cars .. and that means a lot for the future generations of cars and our expectations for those cars .. presently i don't know of any other car show that comes anywhere close to 'top gear'
it's definatelly worth while to find the full episodes of 'top gear' to catch all additional post review comments of the vehicles .. it is definatelly worth while to watch the full episodes for their entertainment value alone .. i've seen every single one (i hope) and not one had me bored .. in fact all of them inspired some passion towards or against a make or a model of a car .. thats the type show than can enthuse a person about cars .. and that means a lot for the future generations of cars and our expectations for those cars .. presently i don't know of any other car show that comes anywhere close to 'top gear'
05-22-2006, 01:40 PM
#39
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well Fifth Gear is pretty good too (better than anything on American TV) , but it doesnt come close to Top Gear.
I can't believe how they manage to give away cars on each episode. They gave out a new 350Z on last times episode. Damns Brits get the free cars./
I can't believe how they manage to give away cars on each episode. They gave out a new 350Z on last times episode. Damns Brits get the free cars./
05-22-2006, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by saturn
That's all well and good, but the thing that gets me is how quickly they lose perspective. For cars that normal people can afford, price is a huge factor. People want the "best" car they can get for their money. Everyone has a different idea of best and that's why different cars are made.
But with Clarkson, as soon as he gets the impression that the car feels cheap he dismisses it as though it has no redeeming value. Then he makes some quip about how Americans are fat and stupid -- really helpful.
The problem isn't that he values certain things that the average American doesn't, it's that he thinks he's better and more refined than everyone, especially Americans. We have different tastes and priorities (on the whole) and that doesn't make us better or worse -- just different.
The dude rides around in supercars all day, bashes everything that comes out of America (he's actually stated that he's boycotting America in his home whatever the hell that means), and then owns a Ford Focus.
In the end it's all very entertaining and his issues don't affect the entertainment value of the show. They do however, affect the information that comes from the show. I find that to be anecdotal at best.
But with Clarkson, as soon as he gets the impression that the car feels cheap he dismisses it as though it has no redeeming value. Then he makes some quip about how Americans are fat and stupid -- really helpful.
The problem isn't that he values certain things that the average American doesn't, it's that he thinks he's better and more refined than everyone, especially Americans. We have different tastes and priorities (on the whole) and that doesn't make us better or worse -- just different.
The dude rides around in supercars all day, bashes everything that comes out of America (he's actually stated that he's boycotting America in his home whatever the hell that means), and then owns a Ford Focus.
In the end it's all very entertaining and his issues don't affect the entertainment value of the show. They do however, affect the information that comes from the show. I find that to be anecdotal at best.
Naw man, you're all wrong here.
If you take anything he says personally, as an american, you should check your ego at the door before watching the show.
He talks sterotypes, for entertainment. Chances are, if it affects you, and keeps you from getting the info from the show, you have some self improvements to make. It's your fault, not the show's.
He doesn't ride around in super cars all day, he LOVES many cheap cars. He speaks about what his wife and family own pretty frequently....he might own a GT(or used to) but he has normal cars to get around in. And he often throws insults at the more expensive cars in a class in favor of the cheaper car.
Recently he's spoken well about the civic. In the hatchback shootout, he speaks highly of hatches, in general. He LOVES the RX8. Advocates the cheap version of the toyota land cruiser over the bling Range rover competitor. He likes the cheap vauxhall...this is pointless...
They focus on more $$$ cars because the show needs raiting...but there is a fair amount of more affordable stuff in there to...and ALL of the info is good. It might me given with a bit of sarcasm, and wit, try not to let your own issues keep you from the real ones.
05-22-2006, 02:54 PM
#41
i pwn therefore i am
Originally Posted by hedgecore
Naw man, you're all wrong here.
If you take anything he says personally, as an american, you should check your ego at the door before watching the show.
He talks sterotypes, for entertainment. Chances are, if it affects you, and keeps you from getting the info from the show, you have some self improvements to make. It's your fault, not the show's.
He doesn't ride around in super cars all day, he LOVES many cheap cars. He speaks about what his wife and family own pretty frequently....he might own a GT(or used to) but he has normal cars to get around in. And he often throws insults at the more expensive cars in a class in favor of the cheaper car.
Recently he's spoken well about the civic. In the hatchback shootout, he speaks highly of hatches, in general. He LOVES the RX8. Advocates the cheap version of the toyota land cruiser over the bling Range rover competitor. He likes the cheap vauxhall...this is pointless...
They focus on more $$$ cars because the show needs raiting...but there is a fair amount of more affordable stuff in there to...and ALL of the info is good. It might me given with a bit of sarcasm, and wit, try not to let your own issues keep you from the real ones.
If you take anything he says personally, as an american, you should check your ego at the door before watching the show.
He talks sterotypes, for entertainment. Chances are, if it affects you, and keeps you from getting the info from the show, you have some self improvements to make. It's your fault, not the show's.
He doesn't ride around in super cars all day, he LOVES many cheap cars. He speaks about what his wife and family own pretty frequently....he might own a GT(or used to) but he has normal cars to get around in. And he often throws insults at the more expensive cars in a class in favor of the cheaper car.
Recently he's spoken well about the civic. In the hatchback shootout, he speaks highly of hatches, in general. He LOVES the RX8. Advocates the cheap version of the toyota land cruiser over the bling Range rover competitor. He likes the cheap vauxhall...this is pointless...
They focus on more $$$ cars because the show needs raiting...but there is a fair amount of more affordable stuff in there to...and ALL of the info is good. It might me given with a bit of sarcasm, and wit, try not to let your own issues keep you from the real ones.
The 350Z, IMO, is such an example. If you listened to him there'd be no reason for anyone, anywhere, at anytime to buy that car. I disagree with that. How can I trust everything he says?
They show and say what they want to prove their points. I find it interesting, entertaining, and even kinda useful, but by no means complete or fair.
05-22-2006, 06:01 PM
#43
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how can we trust anything YOU say? it's an opinion, many folks have one or two, yous needs to get over it or get your own tv show and go off on how gay clarkson is, really.
what a bunch of homo's, arguing on clarckson's opinion.
what a bunch of homo's, arguing on clarckson's opinion.
05-24-2006, 08:54 PM
#44
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He dosen't hate us really. Detroit, he says, is one of his favorite cities! Check out this video he made in Detroit in 1995. Note the mullet and how Bob Seger seems to be intoxicated.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...son+motorworld
Clarkston is pretty funny, we Americans simply need to have thick skin when it comes to his comments.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...son+motorworld
Clarkston is pretty funny, we Americans simply need to have thick skin when it comes to his comments.
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