Needing confirmation as to if I need to tear down and rebuild my Renesis!
#1
Needing confirmation as to if I need to tear down and rebuild my Renesis!
Hello RX8 world,
First off a breif history and info on my 8. 2004 (Base Model) A/T, just yesterday surpassing the 83,000 mile mark. I have put nearly 10,000 miles on it myself thus far. I bought it from a smaller used car lot auto auction here in my town knowing she needed a little work but as a project the dirt cheap price Tag and relatively low miles were a no Brainer, I wanted to build a Rotary 😊 The major issue was the radiator starting to Crack near the bottom passenger side corner so the Lot mechanic put a new one in for me at no cost (Still the moronic plastic factory radiator but I couldn't complain I suppose haha) The first few days owning My 8 I did more and more research and found all of the reported service history that I could possibly dig up. Not too many complaints, the car was taken decent of. Nothing coming close to Rotary standards of care and maintenence. However, service history states it did get frequent Oil changes and standard maintenence on a regular basis, all in all the Car was cared for. My only concern was a gap in Odometer recordings. From 52,000 miles to the next standard Odo recording of a little over 67,000 miles there weren't any Oil changes reported to the vehicles service history records. Which I know not everyone or every auto mechanic reports a vehicles service history and many people such as myself do Thier own oil changes and dont report, But nonetheless that Gap is bothersome to me. Another thing I noticed in the service history records was at 47,144 miles the Engine was replaced under Mazda's ShortBlock Recall/Warrenty. Meaning that when I bought the car with the Odometer reading a little over 74,000 but the Engine itself was only about 27,000 miles old. Which don't get me wrong, if someone who doesn't understand or even really care TO understand the ins and outs of owning and maintaining a Rotary Engine buys this car and trys to treat it like it's just any ordinary vehicle, the Engine could easily fail within 30,000 miles.Now on to the work i've done up to this point. I had one(1) check engine code at first, which was "P0661- intake manifold tuning control valve circuit low- bank 1". I removed the UIM and replaced the Air solenoid (the middle one) which removed the Cel and I haven't seen that code pop back up since. A list of the work i've done since is as follows...MODS:-New MAF Sensor-AEM Cold Air intake (which FYI for anyone experiencing this with the AEM. I fitted the single removable screen from the Stock Airbox into the AEM CAI about 5-6 inches before the MAF sensor and that completely smoothed out that unfortunate rough Idle many of us experience with aftermarket intakes!)-New Throttle Body-New 2.0 2,000 KW high torque Starter Motor-New Battery: Optima 35 Red Top-Manzo Exhaust Headers-Turbo XS RacePipe (catless)-Turbo XS CatBack exhaust Now that ya'll got the specifics, on to the incident in question. FIRST I WILL SAY THIS JUST TO CLARIFY AND REITERATE!!!! This car is not only a vehicle, this Car is my life. As I'm sure anyone who reads this can attest to, we LOVE our rotaries and we care for them as such!!! I Premix with Idemistu at a 1/2 ounce per gallon every single time i fill up with NOTHING but Cenexx or Shell 93 Octane. I only Use Royal Purple 5W-20 and Royal Purple Oil filters to Change the Oil out for fresh every 2,000 miles like clockwork. I don't EVER start it up and then subsequently turn it off nor have I ever even thought about putting her in gear until AT LEAST the Temperature gauge begins to rise and even then I still give it 10 minutes or so out on the road before I really open the throttle up. Almost 10,000 miles ive put on this car, NEVER ONCE have i flooded it. I always be certain to Rev up to at least 5,000 RPM's a few times and then wait for the Idle to drop back down to normal prior to EVER shutting the engine off. Almost 10,000 miles ive put on this car, NEVER ONCE have I flooded it. I RedLine multiple times a day, every single day as well as having seafoamed the engine twice thus far. Now, here's exactly what happened. I was driving home from work tonight on the highway, my radar was clear so I was doing about 110 MPH id say when this occurred. Driving along, Everything is as smooth as can be then all of a sudden the gas pedal just felt like it was losing power near the 5,000 RPM range. I know I've been needing a new fuel pump so I immediatly figured it was that finnally starting to really give out on me. I depressed the pedel in a little more and a little more just to see, yet still yielding no change or acceleration so I just took my foot off the Gas completely. Well....the moment I took my foot off the pedel and the RPMs began to drop I heard what sounded like an exhaust backfiring or "spitting" as some call it. Then, immense clouds of white smoke started flowing out of the exhaust. No visible smoke that i could notice coming from the Engine bay area. I babied the car home in which doing so to my surpise at stop lights and such, the Idle was still perfectly sitting right at 900 RPM as it always has, no fluctuation whatsoever. I noticed my temperature gauge as well as my oil pressure was still perfect which in a moment I'll explain why that is so odd to me. I get home and I'm inspecting everything under the hood, things looks exactly as I left them the last time I was under the hood and then I noticed it....right below my air filter (aftermarket stainless steal reusable air filter) was a puddle of ehhhhh I'd say half a qaurt of Oil, If even that much. Dripping down from the filter pooling on top of my undershield directly behind the bumper Lip, but no visible oil anywhere else under the hood.....BUT somehow a FULL 4 1/2 qaurts of oil is just GONE. Pulled my dipstick after I saw the Oil leakage coming from the air filter and theres not even enough oil in the car to register a line on the dipstick.....Like.....HOW in the hell?!?! I know that white smoke was probably Oil burning but losing 4 1/2 qaurts in a matter of a few minutes? Any input is appreciated. BTW I forgot to mention, when I bought the car I ran a compression test myself. Front Rotor- 107 PSIRear Rotor- 101 PSI Soooooo I think it's safe to say compression isn't the culprit here?
#3
40th anniversary Edition
A massive oil leak while driving at high load can cause serious damage. You need to find the source of the leak, fix that and get a new engine compression test done. I know this isn't good news, but if you love this car it needs to be done.
#5
Anyone know of any links here for purchasing a genuine Rotary compression tester? I found them online new starting at $300+ but if I can find a used one for cheaper I'd like to own one.
#7
P0302 and PCM failure?
Just went out and hooked the 8 up to my OBD and now I have 2 codes (had zero before) P0302 rear rotor misfire and another code for PCM failure, P0610 I think. I'm leaning towards fouled plugs, gonna pull them soon and have a look.
#8
Registered
iTrader: (1)
Fuel pumps do not foul plugs, that's not a thing. Weak ignition can lead to that though.
Have you taken out the plugs to see if they're actually oiled/fouled/broken?
You're missing oil and having smoke, if I were a betting man, that smoke is your oil. Oil in the intake can be caused be excessive blow-by through a failed oil seal.
PCM failures are exceptionally rare. Has someone been messing with the wiring in this case?
#9
2 numbers do not a compression test make. You can use a regular compression tester to confirm an engine is dead, but you can't use one to confirm it's healthy.
Fuel pumps do not foul plugs, that's not a thing. Weak ignition can lead to that though.
Have you taken out the plugs to see if they're actually oiled/fouled/broken?
You're missing oil and having smoke, if I were a betting man, that smoke is your oil. Oil in the intake can be caused be excessive blow-by through a failed oil seal.
PCM failures are exceptionally rare. Has someone been messing with the wiring in this case?
Fuel pumps do not foul plugs, that's not a thing. Weak ignition can lead to that though.
Have you taken out the plugs to see if they're actually oiled/fouled/broken?
You're missing oil and having smoke, if I were a betting man, that smoke is your oil. Oil in the intake can be caused be excessive blow-by through a failed oil seal.
PCM failures are exceptionally rare. Has someone been messing with the wiring in this case?
And I've removed the ECU and inspected it and all the wiring looks good doesn't look modified or anything. If I bought an ECU off the Internet that matched mine number for number would I still need to remove the immobilizer for the car to start?
#10
FULLY SEMI AUTOMATIC
iTrader: (9)
white smoke is usually coolant. do you have real gauges for water temp and oil pressure? the ones on the dash are dummy gauges
#11
Registered
iTrader: (1)
I was thinkinthinking about it, would oil burn white or would it burn black? Because the exhaust smoke was definitely thick and white. Only thing I saw that looked like it was a ruptured coolant seal but coolant level and temperature were both unaffected, as well as oil pressure. All perfect. If an oil seal blew out wouldn't I notice a drop in oil pressure? The smoke smelled of a faint burning plastic other something. Definitly wasn't a sweet coolant type smell.
And I've removed the ECU and inspected it and all the wiring looks good doesn't look modified or anything. If I bought an ECU off the Internet that matched mine number for number would I still need to remove the immobilizer for the car to start?
And I've removed the ECU and inspected it and all the wiring looks good doesn't look modified or anything. If I bought an ECU off the Internet that matched mine number for number would I still need to remove the immobilizer for the car to start?
Oil seals don't hold pressure and I misspoke before : blowby is from a failed side seal (which holds compression).
Yes replacing the ECU would require reprogramming to work with the ignition cylinder.
Start taking things apart, all this thinking isn't getting you closer to a solution
#12
So...we agree the smoke is oil?
Oil seals don't hold pressure and I misspoke before : blowby is from a failed side seal (which holds compression).
Yes replacing the ECU would require reprogramming to work with the ignition cylinder.
Start taking things apart, all this thinking isn't getting you closer to a solution
Oil seals don't hold pressure and I misspoke before : blowby is from a failed side seal (which holds compression).
Yes replacing the ECU would require reprogramming to work with the ignition cylinder.
Start taking things apart, all this thinking isn't getting you closer to a solution
I'm gonna start tearing it all apart shortly. Just to be clear, you are saying that there is no way an old failing fuel pump could cause something like this?
Is the reprogramming of the ECU something I could do with an access port or is it a special mazda programmer?
#14
#15
#17
FULLY SEMI AUTOMATIC
iTrader: (9)
you can push it back together
#18
Registered
iTrader: (1)
Ok wait what? The disptick doesn't read the entire volume of oil. Even if it's dry, you still have 5.5ish quarts in there (because the total system volume is 7 quarts, some stays in the oil coolers when you do an oil change, so you only change 4-5 quarts).
Are you saying it took 4.5 quarts to get the oil level back to the FULL mark on the dipstick?
Are you saying it took 4.5 quarts to get the oil level back to the FULL mark on the dipstick?
#20
Ok wait what? The disptick doesn't read the entire volume of oil. Even if it's dry, you still have 5.5ish quarts in there (because the total system volume is 7 quarts, some stays in the oil coolers when you do an oil change, so you only change 4-5 quarts).
Are you saying it took 4.5 quarts to get the oil level back to the FULL mark on the dipstick?
Are you saying it took 4.5 quarts to get the oil level back to the FULL mark on the dipstick?
#21
#22
Water Foul
Pretty much every sticky on this site warns NOT to use eBay coils. They are all junk. The ignition is one of the most critical systems in this car and NOT a place to cut corners or try to save money.
#23
Registered
iTrader: (1)
Everytime I've changed my oil and filter it's always been 4.5 qaurts puts it right around the full line. But perhaps I was mistaken and I'm apologizing if I was but I could've sworn when I got the car home that night and saw my air filter, checked the dipstick and wiped it off three straight times and saw nothing on the dipstick each time. But today with the car cold sitting ever since, I pulled the dipstick wiped it and checked the level again and it's right around the full line so I was obviously mistaken about all the Oil being gone.
If you found half a quart hanging out under your air filter, this starts to add up.
Mazda revised the oil filler neck design (which integrates a whole bunch of things including the PCV) after 2006-ish to better avoid barfing oil into the intake at high rpm. Not saying you don't have a problem, but if you don't already have the updated neck, you may want to look into that before rebuilding the engine.
The smoke may be from oil entering the through the intake, since you really have a lot of it in there.
#24
I couldn't agree more. I hope anyone needing new coils sees this thread and the sheer lack of qaulity. You get what you pay for. I planned on an upgraded ignition system but figured I'd get further than the 600 miles these coils got me.
#25
That's not what I meant. It will be dry if you've lost 1.5 quarts or more. The end of the dipstick is not the end of the oil pan. So you didn't lose 4.5 quarts of oil.
If you found half a quart hanging out under your air filter, this starts to add up.
Mazda revised the oil filler neck design (which integrates a whole bunch of things including the PCV) after 2006-ish to better avoid barfing oil into the intake at high rpm. Not saying you don't have a problem, but if you don't already have the updated neck, you may want to look into that before rebuilding the engine.
The smoke may be from oil entering the through the intake, since you really have a lot of it in there.
If you found half a quart hanging out under your air filter, this starts to add up.
Mazda revised the oil filler neck design (which integrates a whole bunch of things including the PCV) after 2006-ish to better avoid barfing oil into the intake at high rpm. Not saying you don't have a problem, but if you don't already have the updated neck, you may want to look into that before rebuilding the engine.
The smoke may be from oil entering the through the intake, since you really have a lot of it in there.
What if I bought a 6 speed automatic from a 2006 model, transmission and the Engine. Would I just be able to drop it into my 2004 base model, aside from the obvious exterior components that would be different. Are the chassis and stuff different on the 2006 6 speed automatic as opposed to my 2004 4 port auto? I've heard the Automatic transmission on the 06 model is far superior top to bottom so if possible if I HAD to rebuild, instead just drop a 2006 auto both engine and transmission So I'm not just rebuilding an engine with inferior design flaws. Or is the new filler neck interchangeable?
Last edited by Xander6; 03-06-2017 at 04:17 PM.