What led forum members to believe the 2004 Rx-8 would hold it's value?

I was talking to this girl that writes for the Star Ledger auto section shortly before I bought my car. Her chief complaints about my decision to buy the car were
1. Gas mililiage
2. Torque
3. Depreciation

1 and 2 really didn't bother me since it's a sport's car and I wasn't planning on racing it or anything.

3. Led me to move forward and lease so I didn't get trapped. After I leased the car I really wasn't concerned about how much value the car would hold...however I am hearing some voices from the forum that the trade in values are a dissapointment.

 

https://www.rx8club.com/rx-8-media-news-11/rx-8-runner-up-best-sports-car-value-52079/

No offense to your Star Ledger writer friend, but Im going to value Money's opinion quite a bit more.

 

Retain 42 % with how many miles? I have a fully load GT with NAV 6 speed, 10k miles, Guarantee you I couldn't get more that 22 from the dealer right now. I paid about 28k on a 33k invoice. That's about 11k in one year. I'm really asking objectively, what led forum mebers to think 2004 rx-8 would retain their value.

 

You have to remember that the retaining value of rx8 was based off the initial hype and expectations of this car. The problem is, that this is a very low demand car used, and unfortunately the depreciation is not gonna be what was expected. Money magazine's quote of rx8 holding 42% of it's value after 5 years is not fully disproven yet, but as of now about 20-25% of it's market value is currently wiped out in a very short amount of time, so it is on pace to not reach anywhere near that figure. Keep in mind, that trade in value is not what this percentage is, however as of now it doesn't look good. No time to worry just yet, because when the demand meets the supply, this depreciation should taper off, and hopefully not be as bad. If Mazda continues to build this car in such a massive form, and the demand is not there, those of us who plan on trading car in 4-5 years are in for a huge disappointment. The real problem here is all the leftover 04 models still for sale, due to the mistake Mazda made in guessing how many would sell. They overproduced the 04, and we only can hope they wise up and make less 05 models. They really based this value from the past, and expressed confidence in how the general public would look at this car. Unfortunately the rx8 cannot escape the worries of it's flooding (although that is a minor issue now), past failure of the rotary engine and the horrific gas mileage. There is no way of knowing how it will turn out just yet. To answer your question specificially, what lead us to believe car would retain a lot of it's value was based on the fact that we thought car's demand was going to meet it's supply, and be a long term success. Initially the car started out strong, but really began to fade in terms of supply and demand. We also looked at the reports as SET IN STONE, without realizing how the market changes. As of now, the RX8 has faltered greatly in terms of market value, but we still have a chance at weathering the storm. I never took the reports seriously, and when I began to see this car sell for dirt cheap, I predicted this would happen. For an unproven new model vehicle, especially a car as unique as a rotary rx8, those reports mean nothing, and what happens in real time is all that matters. We'll see how it all turns out after the remaining 04 models are sold, but as of right now, we have no other choice but to hang on to our cars and wait it out. The money is already gone, so no sense in worrying now.

 

Just my thoughts on this...

My first issue when trying to buy a RX8 was the behavior of dealerships that had them new & used. Alot of the dealerships did not want to work with me very much and did not budge on the MSRP price...very much.

This one dealership had about 10-12 2004 RX8's in December and just did not want to budge on their price. They only lowerd the price because I had S-Plan but they still were not very flexable. While I admit I was looking for a pretty hard deal it was not impossible, hence I finnally got my 8 once I had my financing ahead of time at another dealership.

I love my car and there is no doubt about that and while I think it's priced pretty fair, do you guys/gals think they might have to lower the price in the near future? Again...I think the price is fair, but if they sold it for about $2000 less...I think they would be flying off the lots.

Also, if they advertised it more...when is the last time you saw a commercial for the RX8? Their advertiseing department is focused on the 3 & 6 (rightfully so) but tend to ignore the 8.

But, then again it's true that fuel economy and the unfamiliar engine probably are big reasons too. If Mazda would teach people more about rotaries (like after purchase invite them to a rotary class, course, and Q&A) they could shake off that initial fear people have of the car.

I'll be honest if I had not gone to this website and learned so much, I would have been in a G35c, G35 4dr, or GTO instead of my 8.

I hope the best for our car because I don't know if Mazda will continue building rotary sports cars or rotary engined cars if the last two they tried in the US failed to meet expectations.

Here is my formula...

Make the rotary UNFLOODABLE
Lower the price by $1,000
Give it about 40 more HP
Find some extra torque (180 or so)
Get it to avg 19/26mpg

Hard, sure...but not impossible...but we might need a new rotary engine.

We can call it, Rxodus...lol

 

You don't ask for much, do you? I think the car should be able to fly, too. Like George Jetson's car. :p

 

180 lb/ft of more torque? Damn...even Jesus himself couldn't do that at the factory!

 

Here's my $.02...If the 8 continues to sell as it has been (which Mazda is not helping by not promoting the vehicle) I forsee the demise of the RX8. Similar to what happened to the RX7 when sales plummeted. As for me, I don't care (I actually felt this way before I purchased the car) because this will only help the resale of our vehicles. Supply and demand. Look how much people are asking and getting for the older 1st, 2nd & 3rd Gen RX7s. The RX8 will become a commodity and collectible in the long haul.

 

It's bittersweet I guess. If the Rx8 does fall the pattern, and like the previoous generations,which extremely possible, I suppose that may end up being a good thing for me personally. If they make a improved MS rx8 that still fails, I trade in my 04 for an 08-09 that's fast, limited production, and the end of the RX8, I'll gladly take it and enjoy it's uniquness. The 04 model is guaranteed to be the least rare of all the rx8s in future, unless by some miracle, the rotary becomes a household engine, and the Rx8 begins selling like hot cakes. The demise is actually the key to our rx8s holding their value. HOW SAD IS THAT!!

 

Wait, are sales really bad? I know they weren't selling like crazy, but I didn't think it was doing that poorly?

 

Also, The blue book value for my car is currently over $30k and I only paid $28,3! I should be buying and selling these things!

 

I think they were aiming to have RX-8 follow the footsteps of the Miata -- an easy-to-love sportscar.

Flooding was a temporary glitch. Where they fell woefully short was mileage. Predicted to be in the 30+ mpg range, EPA claims 18; real-world 15. Car will never get outside its niche market unless mileage improves substantially. I do love the car, though.

 

Are sales really that bad? Check and see how many 04s are still left on dealer lots besides the 05s. This is not a good sign for any vehicle. When I purchased mine, they gave it away. The sales manager said going forward he would keep very few in stock and the majority would be ordered when puchased. I personally don't care, I love the car, I plan on adding mods and keeping it for sometime.

 

The fewer 8's I see on the highway, the happier I will be with mine. AND the less I will have to mod mine in order to stand out in the crowd. It would be sad to see Mazda discontinue the RX8, but hey, I have mine, and she isnt going ANYWHERE!!!

 

Last I heard, ( it was posted on this site), the 8's are selling better then Mazda expected, so I doubt they are going to shut it down. I don't know why there are so many 04's left on lots, but at the price range they are in now, they are competing with RSX's, celica's, tiberons, cobalts, eclipse's, and high end focus. With those choice's, how could they NOT sell.

 

When you produce a car in any quantity, of course they will all eventually sell. If the the RX8 is selling better then expected, then why are there still plenty of 04s left, when other car companies will be having their 06s out this summer? If you look at the total rx8s sold before the 05 came out, surely that number is pleasing to Mazda if they ignore their total production. They didn't produced the 04 in such a quantity where they planned it to be around now. That is common sense. It's possible that mazda is satisfied with the 05 sales, but they are lying if they say they are happy with the 04 sales. They would have never produced this many 04 models had they known they would still be in the dealer lots, selling for peanuts. Furthermore, no car company wants their vehicle to sit in lots long after the 05 models arrived. I do think better advertising would have changed this situation entirely, but it's too late now for the 04 model. Why Mazda didn't pull a closeout advertisement on their remaining 04 models is beyond me. I guess with the huge success of their other cars, they didn't feel the need to spend that money, because it may have cost more, then just waiting for 04s to be gone with the incredible deals. It alsmost seems like they hung the dealerships out to dry. One more thing. I remember when I got my rx8 a year ago, the dealers were overflooded with rx8s. I had my pick of crop in any color, any option package, and to boot I was able to browse. If I check inventory now, it is greattly reduced on the 05 model, so I'd imagine production of 05 will be put to a hault very shortly, and may end up only being half the production of the 04. It is interesting nonetheless, but at same time it's rather disturbing.

 

When I bought my '05 Ti Grey Red/Black RX-8 in October, there had to have been at least 20! 2004 models on the lot. At that time, there was only about a 1000 incentive on the 2004, and I was able to get the 2005 for a few hundred above invoice. Being that depreciation driving the car off the lot was at least $4000, that was a no-brainer.

It was really amazing that the dealerships were so dim about the car's demand... they kept trying to tell me that there was really no difference in price between the 2004 and 2005! And then trying to sell me the car at MSRP. Since I was about the only person who bought one for at least a month in 3 counties, what were they thinking? Probably, the success of the 3 has made mazda feel a little less pressure to move the rest of its line.

I agree that mazda was really bone-headed in not discounting the 2004 models, particularly because the ones left were greens, yellows, and blues, which didn't seem to be too popular. The '05 production is probably lowered too because of the fire at the japan plant which slowed production. They probably didn't ramp up production either, or diverted production elsewhere, because of the remaining '04 dealer stock.

The car's great, but its a niche car. I've got mine while the warranty lasts. Thereafter, we will have to see...