Advice on driving manual Rx-8
07-02-2009, 02:44 PM
#51
correct...
although I am not not sure how I would use double clutching in any useful way....modern trannies with synchros make double-clutching pretty unecessary for smooth shifting...some would disagree.
where heel-toe is absolutely critical is in a scenario you find at the track alot. you are coming into a turn that requires a high reving 2nd gear but you are in 3rd near redline as you enter the braking zone. the only way to work the corner correctly is to brake hard and just before you turn in and while still braking...you clutch, blip, shift, release clutch. All in the blink of an eye...literally.
When done correctly it is absolutely a thing of beauty.
although I am not not sure how I would use double clutching in any useful way....modern trannies with synchros make double-clutching pretty unecessary for smooth shifting...some would disagree.
where heel-toe is absolutely critical is in a scenario you find at the track alot. you are coming into a turn that requires a high reving 2nd gear but you are in 3rd near redline as you enter the braking zone. the only way to work the corner correctly is to brake hard and just before you turn in and while still braking...you clutch, blip, shift, release clutch. All in the blink of an eye...literally.
When done correctly it is absolutely a thing of beauty.
07-02-2009, 02:52 PM
#52
3.2 Liter Inline Sex
the really fun part is while you are learning how to do it you will undoubtedly do a bunch of face plants into your steering wheel when you brake too hard while blipping.
you don't really use your heel...you can, but most people don't...it depends on your pedal configuration and foot size. I typically press the brake with the inside ball of my foot and roll the outside of my foot onto the accelerator.
the sooner a person can make this part of their technique the better and easier it will be. trying to learn it later can be REALLY frustrating and can actually screw up your current shifting pattern while you try to re-train your brain and muscles to fire in that rapid sequence.
Last edited by Kevo; 07-02-2009 at 06:12 PM.
07-02-2009, 02:59 PM
#53
yep, sounds like fun, eh?
the really fun part is while you are learning how to do it you will undoubtedly do a bunch of face plants into your steering wheel when you brake too hard while blipping.
you don't really use your heel...you can, but most people don't...it depends on your pedal configuration and foot size. I typically press the brake with the inside ball of my foot and roll the outside of my foot onto the accelerator.
the sooner a person can make this part of their technique the better and easier it will be. trying to learn it later can be REALLY frustrating and can actually screw up your current shifting pattern while you try to re-train your brain and muscles to fire in that rapid sequence.
the really fun part is while you are learning how to do it you will undoubtedly do a bunch of face plants into your steering wheel when you brake too hard while blipping.
you don't really use your heel...you can, but most people don't...it depends on your pedal configuration and foot size. I typically press the brake with the inside ball of my foot and roll the outside of my foot onto the accelerator.
the sooner a person can make this part of their technique the better and easier it will be. trying to learn it later can be REALLY frustrating and can actually screw up your current shifting pattern while you try to re-train your brain and muscles to fire in that rapid sequence.
07-02-2009, 03:03 PM
#54
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yep, sounds like fun, eh?
the really fun part is while you are learning how to do it you will undoubtedly do a bunch of face plants into your steering wheel when you brake too hard while blipping.
you don't really use your heel...you can, but most people don't...it depends on your pedal configuration and foot size. I typically press the brake with the inside ball of my foot and roll the outside of my foot onto the accelerator.
the sooner a person can make this part of their technique the better and easier it will be. trying to learn it later can be REALLY frustrating and can actually screw up your current shifting technique while try to retain your brain and muscles to fire in that rapid sequence.
the really fun part is while you are learning how to do it you will undoubtedly do a bunch of face plants into your steering wheel when you brake too hard while blipping.
you don't really use your heel...you can, but most people don't...it depends on your pedal configuration and foot size. I typically press the brake with the inside ball of my foot and roll the outside of my foot onto the accelerator.
the sooner a person can make this part of their technique the better and easier it will be. trying to learn it later can be REALLY frustrating and can actually screw up your current shifting technique while try to retain your brain and muscles to fire in that rapid sequence.
07-02-2009, 03:13 PM
#55
3.2 Liter Inline Sex
your entire approach to the pedals is different...not by a ton, but just enough to screw everything up. you'll find that you attack the brake differently and you shift in a very fast yet rhythmic manner...you tend to want to use the technique everywhere and whenever you can and find yourself heel-toe downshifting through just about every gear.
nope not possible to blip or heel-toe an AT...at least not that I am aware of.
07-02-2009, 03:16 PM
#56
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Yeah its funny how inate Heel toeing is now.....I do it without thought seamlessly when driving..... Funny what a lil muscle memory can do for your driving skills
But compared to learning how to do it while hard braking on a motorcycle its easy as pie!
But compared to learning how to do it while hard braking on a motorcycle its easy as pie!
07-02-2009, 03:38 PM
#57
what I mean by later is the amount of time it takes you to learn to shift normally without having to think about it. as with any motor skill once you get it that engrained into your muscle memory it will be hard to retrain everything. this preiod of time can be very awkward.
your entire approach to the pedals is different...not by a ton, but just enough to screw everything up. you'll find that you attack the brake differently and you shift in a very fast yet rhythmic manner...you tend to want to use the technique everywhere and whenever you can and find yourself heel-toe downshifting through just about every gear.
nope not possible to blip or heel-toe an AT...at least not that I am aware of.
your entire approach to the pedals is different...not by a ton, but just enough to screw everything up. you'll find that you attack the brake differently and you shift in a very fast yet rhythmic manner...you tend to want to use the technique everywhere and whenever you can and find yourself heel-toe downshifting through just about every gear.
nope not possible to blip or heel-toe an AT...at least not that I am aware of.
07-02-2009, 05:56 PM
#59
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I wear size 13 shoes, so the RX-8 is almost impossible for me to heel-toe consistently.
Instead, I do toe-heel.
I place my heel on the brake pedal, and my toes on the accelerator, tilting the foot only slightly.
I wish I had smaller feet... I "hear" the 8's pedals are positioned perfectly... for normal people lol
Instead, I do toe-heel.
I place my heel on the brake pedal, and my toes on the accelerator, tilting the foot only slightly.
I wish I had smaller feet... I "hear" the 8's pedals are positioned perfectly... for normal people lol
07-02-2009, 06:20 PM
#60
I don't know if it's a good idea to jump into heel-and-toe when first learning to drive a stick, that's a pretty advanced technique for someone who's just learning to use the clutch.
Start with single clutch downshifts to get the hang of rev matching, then learn to double clutch. Double clutching is part of heel-and-toe and should be learned first.
Start with single clutch downshifts to get the hang of rev matching, then learn to double clutch. Double clutching is part of heel-and-toe and should be learned first.
07-02-2009, 06:35 PM
#61
3.2 Liter Inline Sex
you wouldn't jump right into heel toe...but its not a bad idea to work it into the fold as you begin to get things down.
imho on double clutching...i respectfully disagree it is a part of heel toe. simply not needed nor is it an efficient expenditure of effort.
to each his/her own...do what works for you!
imho on double clutching...i respectfully disagree it is a part of heel toe. simply not needed nor is it an efficient expenditure of effort.
to each his/her own...do what works for you!
07-02-2009, 06:37 PM
#62
So you don't engage the clutch in neutral when you blip the throttle? Hmmm, I guess I was taught the hard way to do it.
Last edited by Marklar; 07-02-2009 at 06:40 PM.
07-02-2009, 06:46 PM
#63
3.2 Liter Inline Sex
i do but it doesn't take two clutch presses to do that. here is my sequence...
the brake goes down to slow for turn in, and right as I am ready to shift the clutch goes in, throttle get's blipped, at peak rev the gear gets shifted and the clutch comes out. it is extremely fast and one press gets her done.
the place I track at has 4 extremely technical turns in it that if you tried to do anything more than what I just described above you would be toast. simply not enough time to get the extra press in...and it's not really needed any way...or at least the way I do it.
like I said to each his own. if it works for you then that's cool. wasn't trying to argue, just trying to clarify.
the brake goes down to slow for turn in, and right as I am ready to shift the clutch goes in, throttle get's blipped, at peak rev the gear gets shifted and the clutch comes out. it is extremely fast and one press gets her done.
the place I track at has 4 extremely technical turns in it that if you tried to do anything more than what I just described above you would be toast. simply not enough time to get the extra press in...and it's not really needed any way...or at least the way I do it.
like I said to each his own. if it works for you then that's cool. wasn't trying to argue, just trying to clarify.
07-02-2009, 06:52 PM
#64
i do but it doesn't take two clutch presses to do that. here is my sequence...
the brake goes down to slow for turn in, and right as I am ready to shift the clutch goes in, throttle get's blipped, at peak rev the gear gets shifted and the clutch comes out. it is extremely fast and one press gets her done.
the place I track at has 4 extremely technical turns in it that if you tried to do anything more than what I just described above you would be toast. simply not enough time to get the extra press in...and it's not really needed any way...or at least the way I do it.
like I said to each his own. if it works for you then that's cool. wasn't trying to argue, just trying to clarify.
the brake goes down to slow for turn in, and right as I am ready to shift the clutch goes in, throttle get's blipped, at peak rev the gear gets shifted and the clutch comes out. it is extremely fast and one press gets her done.
the place I track at has 4 extremely technical turns in it that if you tried to do anything more than what I just described above you would be toast. simply not enough time to get the extra press in...and it's not really needed any way...or at least the way I do it.
like I said to each his own. if it works for you then that's cool. wasn't trying to argue, just trying to clarify.
Thanks, I think I've learned something useful, I'm going to start trying to do it that way. I was taught to do a double clutch downshift while braking, and never really questioned it.
07-02-2009, 07:02 PM
#65
3.2 Liter Inline Sex
cool. give it a shot.
what I found to be important was not to depress the clutch too soon. you don't want to "free wheel" it. allow the engine and tranny to stay locked and spinning together for as long as you can...this will keep them closer to the same speed and make the blipping and clutch rengagement consistently smoother.
glad I could provide some useful info!
what I found to be important was not to depress the clutch too soon. you don't want to "free wheel" it. allow the engine and tranny to stay locked and spinning together for as long as you can...this will keep them closer to the same speed and make the blipping and clutch rengagement consistently smoother.
glad I could provide some useful info!
07-02-2009, 10:51 PM
#66
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wow you guys seriously have me breaking down how I shift gears step by step... I'm now going to be heading to work tomorrow trying to figure it out which shifting pattern i use.
Oh, and I killed my 8 soo many times when test driving. All it takes is determination and a friend that is willing to sit through the whole expierience with you and talk you through some of it. I went to an empty school parking lot and just practiced my starts from a dead stop. It was ugly, but it was the best thing for me. I've had my car only a few weeks but I have put on more than 1300 miles on it. Now, i hardly kill it at stop signs and stop lights, and rarely ever bark the tires. I still hate reverse, but I make myself drive in reverse everyday so I can get comfy with it.
If you kill it in public dont be like me and get embarrassed. Half of the people around you probably never learned how to drive a manual, and if they did, they couldnt handle it so they got an auto.
Good luck and enjoy your 8!
Oh, and I killed my 8 soo many times when test driving. All it takes is determination and a friend that is willing to sit through the whole expierience with you and talk you through some of it. I went to an empty school parking lot and just practiced my starts from a dead stop. It was ugly, but it was the best thing for me. I've had my car only a few weeks but I have put on more than 1300 miles on it. Now, i hardly kill it at stop signs and stop lights, and rarely ever bark the tires. I still hate reverse, but I make myself drive in reverse everyday so I can get comfy with it.
If you kill it in public dont be like me and get embarrassed. Half of the people around you probably never learned how to drive a manual, and if they did, they couldnt handle it so they got an auto.
Good luck and enjoy your 8!
07-03-2009, 01:05 AM
#67
Registered
Hey man, I was in the same boat. I finally got manual transmission figured out, it has taken me over a week to be able to drive without stalling the car. I'm getting better as well, I'm starting to shift alot smoother now too. Keep at it, you will get it after awhile. I just hope I haven't damaged my tranny during my learning process, I'm sure I have burned up the clutch as I was learning.
I had my mom give me the pointers, she is good with manuals as she is used to driving them as she is from England, and all they drive over there is manual trannies. Here is a good video from youtube to learn the basics on, he also has advanced techniques as well as how to drive a manual in congested traffic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B59-pWSPoZU&feature=fvw
I had my mom give me the pointers, she is good with manuals as she is used to driving them as she is from England, and all they drive over there is manual trannies. Here is a good video from youtube to learn the basics on, he also has advanced techniques as well as how to drive a manual in congested traffic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B59-pWSPoZU&feature=fvw
07-03-2009, 09:13 AM
#68
Call me ROTO BAGGINS
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I just stalled my 8 for the first time ever a month or so ago. I was talking to my brother on the phone about something and I was in my apartment parking lot on my way out and just spaced on it.
It's ironic because it hadn't been but a few days before it happened that I was thinking to myself how I was proud that I had never stalled my car in over a year of driving. I guess I just got a little bit too full of myself!
It's ironic because it hadn't been but a few days before it happened that I was thinking to myself how I was proud that I had never stalled my car in over a year of driving. I guess I just got a little bit too full of myself!
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