Elara

Um, yeah, crossfire= autoban. I wish I knew where that came from.

Anyway, I'm cleaning up this thread. The next person who craps in it WILL get an autoban, screw the warning. If you have nothing constructive to say, and just want to attack people, go somewhere other than this forum.

StewC625

You will get a biased view of the RX-8 from members of this board. Shop for yourself and decide for yourself. Come back if you bought one, don't if you didn't.

If I had a nickel for every guy that has come onto this board in the last 3 years said "I'm looking at a this, that, the other and an RX-8, convince me to buy the -8" I'd be a rich man."

Shop for yourself, do the research. Every car you list has a fatal flaw, and every car has a great attraction. For example, you list two very high end M-B's on your list - but to get those, you're looking at a 7 year old car at least. Have you thought about maintenance costs? Ever priced a set of brakes, a clutch, an automatic transmission, etc. on those cars? I'd bet if you had, you wouldn't be looking at them.

Don't expect us to solve your problems.

Ok, so I'll play along for a moment, here's a one-liner on every one of these choices:

Mercedes SL500 & SL600 - maintenance/repairs will kill you and you'll be driving a 7 or 8 year old car that will need lots of maintenance. Ready to spend $2K on a brake job for your 8 year old Benz?
Mazda RX-8 - Good car for the money, rotary engines are "special needs" - engines - behooves you to understand the car before you buy it. - but nothing sexier on the road.
Lexus IS350 - Ugly *** car. Looks like my grandma's Camry. Ick.
Nissan 350Z - Nice car. 2 seats, torquey engine. Can't go wrong.
Infinity G35 Coupe - Z with back seats. Old man coupe. Ick.
Porsche 911 (I can stretch to about $30K if the right one finds me) - Maintenance costs will kill you - worse than the Mercedes.
BMW M3, M5, & Z3 - Z3 is terrific, and the maintenance costs on an M5 or M3 will kill you - again $2K for a brake job - $3K for a clutch. Hard to find M-cars on the used market that haven't been flogged to death.
Audi A4, TT - A4 is OK for a Volkswagen Jetta. TT's are fun. High cost of maintenance compared to a Japanese car.

Kdoubt

Well if you would stop making assumptions you might come off less combative. I'm not here to but heads with anyone saying any 1 car is better than an rx8, im here for information. Parts are not a problem. My Girlfriends father owns an import autoparts shop locally so things are at cost or no charge. Care to rewrite your post now?

Why is everyone here so negative and on the defense? Is it because I'm not yet an 8 owner? I wasn't aware public forums were an exclusive club :s

Edit: Let me just add, you're tired of people coming to a RESOURCE asking for opinions and suggestions. You should stop reading these posts, otherwise you're going to have a tough time on the internet. Its full of people looking for legitimate information who dont know where to begin, so they begin somewhere (in this case, at rxclub.com).

konradk

QFT:
ouch. i mean... ouch. i think we need to really reassess what we as a community find to be a helpful post.

dmp

Mercedes SL500 & SL600: Great when you want to be comfortable. No real styling, IMO

Mazda RX-8: My car doesn't have reliable power-output. I'm staring to lose 2nd gear. The Mazda dealer can be an *** when it comes to warranty work. The car goes-like-stink when it's 'on the boil' under the right circumstances. It looks AWESOME. It's practical, and VERY fun to drive. It's easy to drive fast - very responsive. Horrible fuel-economy-to-HP ratio.

Lexus IS350: It's comfy - and scoots. Can you find one for 25K though? I thought they sold for close to $40k. It's an AT. Looks great. Has good 'cool factor'.

Nissan 350Z: Very quick. Harsh ride. 2-seater. Doesn't have the exotic look of a couple of the others. Pedestrian interior.

Infinity G35 Coupe: Great looks. Nice interior. Heavy-feeling. Lots of power and 'gotta-have-it' or 'wow' factor.

Porsche 911 (I can stretch to about $30K if the right one finds me): You're probably looking at a 996 911. They aren't exactly LOVED by porsche-purists. You're looking at HUGE repair bills. One car dealer told me their extended-warranty sells for $1500 PER YEAR. Yeoch. It's a status car, to a large degree. Capable - but harder to drive fast for the novice than something like the 350Z or the RX8. Not much faster than the 350z in a straight line. I hope you like it stock, because aftermarket stuff is VERY expensive.

BMW M3, M5, & Z3: Typical BMW awesomeness.

Audi A4, TT: A4 = Plain-jane exterior. Weak-power. More comfort than sport. You could find a 2004+ S4, though, for $30K. Nose-heavy, but lots of power and junk. The TT? Until this model year, it's been weak-powered, heavy, and weird-looking.


HTH.

Darin

Shinka-Dono

He still makes a legit point regarding the cost of owning these old Europeans you're interested in. First, they're old means they are likely to break more and cost a great deal while doing it. You're monetary cap should include an estimation of those repair costs. Second, you're assuming the flow of foreign parts is going to be around forever. I'm not making any comment on your relationship at all but sometimes people break up and get pretty pissed off while doing it.

The point is I wouldn't glibly dismiss the phenomenal repair costs some of those cars come with. I think you're much better off getting something with a little warranty left on it (or new). Just lookin' out for ya.

Kdoubt

Some very interesting points. I love the RX8 from afar, and have driven the rx7 but have yet to test the 8. Are there many differences?

Its things like not reliable power output that worry me. Can this be retained by regular servicing things? I'm the kinda guy who brings it in for a checkup earlier than on time just in case. However, praticality, style, and innovation are outweighing the bad and balancing my decision just in the middle. Its almost got to be a unanimous decision for all factors before I could comfortably sign on the dotted line.

Finally, I've read to stay away from the '04s as they are more likely to have problems. Is this true or just a case of there being more 04s out there and therefore more are having issues?

StewC625

Kdoubt:

Addressing your first reply to me, since you never mentioned your girlfriend's dad owns an import parts shop, I couldn't assume you had any idea of maintenance costs. Sorry aobut that - but your post came off as a wishlisting 16 year old who was only considering purchase prices, not long term ownership costs. Being a bit more "seasoned" than the averrage poster around these parts, I tend to look at things far differently than the average person.

Therefore, that's why I said what I did - you asked for my opinion, and I gave it to you. I wouldn't buy a 7 or 8 year old M-B on a dare due to the insanely high costs of parts for those cars, AND the labor to put them in. I wouldn't buy a used M3 or M5 unless I had personally observed how the previous owner drove it and could examine the maintenance records AND had a thorough checkup done on it. Those owners generally flog the crap out of their cars ... old 911s are like boats. Your happiest day is the day you buy it and the second happiest day is the day you sell it! Blast to drive, but bring a lot of money to the party.

Sorry you didn't like my answer, but you did ask for my opinions on them. I told you why I would or would not buy them. Not living inside your head, that's the only perspective I can give you.

I stand by my answers regardless of your girlfriend's dad's business.

Which leads me to - your comment reminded me of in Fast Times At Ridgemont High when Spicolli and the big football player's little brother wreck the football player's new Camaro. Spicolli says:

It's OK dude, we can fix it. My dad is a TV Repairman. He has the most awesome set of tools! We can fix it.

"my girlfriend's day owns an import auto parts place ...."

Kdoubt

No problem and I understand, but I'm not stupid, and I have definitely researched each of these cars before putting them on the list. Any car on the list that I've chosen is obviously within budget, range, style, maintenance costs etc... otherwise, it wouldn't be on the list.

I guess I should really be referring to her as my wife... There is no ring, but we've been together for almost 5 years, have a house together, cars, everything else that goes along with it. That would make the owner of the APC Auto Parts store my father in law.

StewC625

And you decidely aren't the typical 17 year old tool that comes in here. My bad for the "profiling" ... been a LOT of idiots around lately, and your original post sounded suspciously like one of them

Cool, welcome, and happy shopping - one of my most pleasurable experiences is looking for new cars.

That all said, STILL stand by my answers ... I'd love an SL500 or 600 or 911, if someone else were buying the repairs!

Kdoubt

No worries,

About the 04 question

StewC625

Well, it depends on which RX-7 you drove. The RX-8 is absolutely NOTHING like the previous generation RX-7 whcih was a very highly-strung beast. The Rx-8 is quick, comfortable, handles amazingly well, and is just an all-around wonderfully balanced and refined car.

Not sure I understand your comment about "not reliable power" - rotary engines, with proper maintainence (hell, any engine with proper maintenance) will give out the same power for years and hundreds of thousands of miles. If you're the type who considers oil changes cheap insurance and has things checked out "just because", then you won't have a single issue mechanically with your RX-8 unless you install some sort of performance mod that overstresses the engine, like an FI kit or something. Intake mods, exhaust mods, handling mods, etc. won't hurt anything.

And you're dead right on about practicality, style and innovation - there's not a single car like it on the market, ergo, that's why I have one. I have a killer sports car and room to take my sons along for the ride - doesn't get much better. All wrapped up in a wrapper that stops traffic and turns heads everywhere you go.

And it's reliable, and the vast majority of the non-powertrain parts are standard Mazda/Ford parts bin stuff, so parts are cheap and plentiful. Great car to have. Glad they are still elusive and exclusive.

Now if only someone was making a killer aftermarket sunvisor ...

StewC625

Oh, and '04s ...

I have one. It has 35,000 miles on it. It never floods, it has started every time, and drives great. I've done nothing out of the ordinary - just regular maintenance and got all the updates done when they came in.

I would not be scared at all of an '04 - just make sure you buy it from a Mazda dealer, or have a Mazda dealer search the VIN to be sure all the updates have been done. Worth having the car inspected and paying for it. Also run a CarFax report on anything you buy as well.

dmp

Well - my post stated the not-constant-power issue...but in honesty, that's due to subsequent Cat-converter failures, not from the engine per se.

23109VC

oh PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEASE...

you list $25k as a budget and then you put cars like an IS350 and an E46 M3 and a 911 on there?

ok..so are you going to be buying salvage titled cars? or cars with massive body damage then fixing them yourself? or are you actually looking at an E36 M3 or a 1970s 911?

if you think you can find a GOOD CLEAN LOW MILEAGE 911 - like a 996 - for $25k then you're smoking crack. it will have 75k+ miles or be a beater/salvage...

bro in law of mine JUST bought a 1998 996 - kbb valued it at over 35k.... and his car had about 50k miles on it.. no warranty...

for $25k you could almost get a NEW RX8. for $20k you can get a barely used 05 or 06.

for 25k in the porsche 911 camp you will get a POS...

you are comparing apples to oranges.

dmp

fwiw, 1998 Porsches are 993s, and they are more expensive, generally, in the used market than 996s.


996 w/ 50K miles for $30k

996 w/60K miles for $25k

996 w/27K miles for $28k

Spin9k

You really have to drive them don't you? I mean if you're looking for a car that's fun, not just for transportation, the feel from the driver's seat is the thing - in fact its nearly everything. I know dealers now-a-days try to say for some of the 'hoit' new toys "Can't drive it til you buy it." but that's baloney - I'd always walk with talk like that.

You say that covers about 10 acres of new and used cars for less than $25K, yes (except for the can I drive it/girls part)? Perhaps spend some quality time with you own needs and wants and come up with something a little more detailed or restrictive for 'All I want.." might help you.

As for our car - Depending on where you live, the 8 is pretty exclusive. My wife counts, and it's a rare day when she says, "Look! There an RX-8..." Not so often anymore but random street peps still yell "Damn, hot car!" from the side of the road. Me I just take it to the track to keep the big grin on my face, and play with it in my garage to keep my hands and mind happy. That and smile when (my 4yr old used car) still lights up someone elses imagination enough to get so excited about its looks.

rovic

Not considering theS2000. Just curious. I know you want >2seats, but you do have the Z3 listed.

I have an '04GT VR. Great car. My daily drive.

I do find it completely odd you haven't even test driven one.

Test drive. Take some notes. Come back here and use "search" for specific questions. If you can't find the answer post one. Then decide for yourself if this is the car you want.

shaunv74

I'd agree with most of the general thoughts from the group:

1)Make sure you factor in your gas and maintenence costs. Older european cars are going to cost more to fix and for some reason are put together backwards so you have to remove the engine to do silly things like change the oil or the alternator. (ala 911).

2)You mentioned 2seats vs. 4 seats. I've had 2 seats and you hit the nail on the head. It ends up staying at home when you go out with the buddies because you can only fit 1 person in the car. I say keep it to 4 seats.

3)test drive them all. You find out so much from the drive. Some cars will just fit you right and some won't. I thought I would love an Integra when I was looking years ago and then when I got in I realized I would have to move the seat back every time I wanted to get out of the car. It immediately came off the list.

On the '04's. I have an '04 and it's been a great car. I would say get an '05 mainly so you can get some warrantly left. There are some TSBs out there you will want to have the dealer fix for you. All cars have them. It's nice to get them all taken care of for free though! If you search on TSB's on the forum you'll find a list to read through.

Subdivisions

Well, here is my quick list ...

Plus
-Great handling
-Cool design
-Not common (not everyone has one)
-“Decent” power (see RPM in plus or minus)
-Above average interior quality
-Excellent safety systems designed to aid driver, but can also be disabled.
-Smoother ride (and quieter) than most sports cars

Plus? or Minus?
-“Unusual” exhaust note, I personally like it
-Headroom, especially with sunroof (depends on your height)
-High RPM’s to get/stay in power band

Minus
-No much low-end torque (no red-light racing)
-Low fuel economy (function of rotary). Some owners get less than advertised
-Don’t even try to drive in the winter without winter tires
-Sore facial muscles from too much smiling (couldn’t resist)

As for reliability and power issues ...
Just like any other car, some will have no problems, some have minor, and some have major.

I personally haven't had any "major" issues, just minor annoyances that were easily and quickly fixed by my dealer under warranty.