Deadly crash in Chicago!
03-15-2007, 09:40 PM
#126
Insanely Yellow
Man, this is just horrible.
Obviously the driver was doing something dumb and got "out over his skis" and couldn't haul it back from the brink. Was he driving with or without DSC? We'll never know. Did he have the summer tires on? Likely - and if there's any moisture on the road plus temps below 45, those are useless.
Bottom line, too fast for conditions, and he paid the ultimate price. And he took two kids with him as well.
Just awful. I'm sorry for the families. What a pointless waste.
David/signdamnrx8 - I'm sorry about your sister. I can't imagine how you feel.
Drivers everywhere - not just young. Gang, there's something to be said for driving responsibly - clearly the driver in this crash was not - one does not lose control driving responsibly. Does it mean "driving like a grandma" much of the time? 'Fraid so.
Stew
Obviously the driver was doing something dumb and got "out over his skis" and couldn't haul it back from the brink. Was he driving with or without DSC? We'll never know. Did he have the summer tires on? Likely - and if there's any moisture on the road plus temps below 45, those are useless.
Bottom line, too fast for conditions, and he paid the ultimate price. And he took two kids with him as well.
Just awful. I'm sorry for the families. What a pointless waste.
David/signdamnrx8 - I'm sorry about your sister. I can't imagine how you feel.
Drivers everywhere - not just young. Gang, there's something to be said for driving responsibly - clearly the driver in this crash was not - one does not lose control driving responsibly. Does it mean "driving like a grandma" much of the time? 'Fraid so.
Stew
Last edited by StewC625; 03-15-2007 at 09:45 PM.
03-15-2007, 10:37 PM
#127
Super Moderator
Originally Posted by Chrisbert
He makes it sound like the RX8 became self-aware and floored itself. His post is just plain ignorant, but I'll chalk it up to lashing out in grief. It matters not what whether you are in a Civic or a Ferrari if you drive irresponsibly both can kill you.
As for the Brother , your grief is undertandable....and I am sorry for all concerned.
ALL CARS ARE A LETHAL WEAPONS......you have to respect them and know them..
when you are young you think you are invincible and bullet proof, but none of us are..
03-15-2007, 10:54 PM
#128
Super Moderator
David...after reading your post on page 7 man ,I wish this 49yo could give you and your mom a big long hug (0o0o)...because there are many *Tears* in my eyes...even from Australia..
03-16-2007, 12:13 AM
#130
OK Guys. I drove by the accident scene tonight. Here is the location.
A bunch of flowers were laid on the east side of pillar in the median, so I would guess the car was east bound leaving the light at Columbus Ave.
Below is a picture of the car as it was being carried away. The distance from the light to the accident location is less than a block. I don't know how they got to the reported speed of 60 mph in that short of a distance. Or caused this much damage.
It looks like from other pictures that most of the impact was on the passenger door area. There should have been some speed scrubbed off while the car was skidding.
A bunch of flowers were laid on the east side of pillar in the median, so I would guess the car was east bound leaving the light at Columbus Ave.
Below is a picture of the car as it was being carried away. The distance from the light to the accident location is less than a block. I don't know how they got to the reported speed of 60 mph in that short of a distance. Or caused this much damage.
It looks like from other pictures that most of the impact was on the passenger door area. There should have been some speed scrubbed off while the car was skidding.
Last edited by alnielsen; 03-16-2007 at 12:16 AM.
03-16-2007, 12:14 AM
#131
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David, I'm sorry for your loss. It is a tragedy made even worse by the simple fact that it was completely preventable. That single fact is what bugs us here the most. We RX-8 owners know how fast an RX-8 can go in two blocks, and sadly the answer is far faster than 60 mph. My impression from the photos and video I saw was that the road was nearly straight there. If DSC was on, the car would have been tough to accelerate on wet/slick roads or worn tires. If it was a base model it didn't have DSC, but wet roads should have still made it hard to accelerate. Speed is a factor here, but not the only one. Something caused the driver to swerve. An RX-8 with a helical diff will NOT simply snap sideways on a straight road, even in the wet.
My bet at this point is either (A) a cat or dog ran out in front of the car or (B) a left rear tire blowout while accelerating or (C) the driver was just screwing around and was weaving for fun. And I hate like hell that this accident took the life of your sister.
Yes, Tsuyicha has wrecked racecars, but that's because he drives them at the limit on the track, with full safety gear protecting his ***. You're right that the car was flying to do that much damage. The chassis is remarkably strong, especially at the doors. We're trying to understand what happened in view of witness reports which conflict with the evidence of a very hard crash.
Personally, I'd tell the media to f@ck off and find another family's blood to leech off.
Last year three high school kids were killed in an RX-8 when they managed to launch it off a curving highway overpass and into the trees tens of feet below. We, as a community, felt horible and, even though there were some thoughtless comments made at the time, we all recognized it as a senseless tragedy, like this one.
I'm certain that I speak for everyone here when I say that any of us would give up our cars in an instant if it would bring your sister back to your family.
My bet at this point is either (A) a cat or dog ran out in front of the car or (B) a left rear tire blowout while accelerating or (C) the driver was just screwing around and was weaving for fun. And I hate like hell that this accident took the life of your sister.
Yes, Tsuyicha has wrecked racecars, but that's because he drives them at the limit on the track, with full safety gear protecting his ***. You're right that the car was flying to do that much damage. The chassis is remarkably strong, especially at the doors. We're trying to understand what happened in view of witness reports which conflict with the evidence of a very hard crash.
Personally, I'd tell the media to f@ck off and find another family's blood to leech off.
Last year three high school kids were killed in an RX-8 when they managed to launch it off a curving highway overpass and into the trees tens of feet below. We, as a community, felt horible and, even though there were some thoughtless comments made at the time, we all recognized it as a senseless tragedy, like this one.
I'm certain that I speak for everyone here when I say that any of us would give up our cars in an instant if it would bring your sister back to your family.
03-16-2007, 12:21 AM
#132
Tonight there was no sign of any moisture on the road. The road has a about a 5% grade, running down to the west. That would eliminate any chance of water puddling. The road is covered by upper Wacker Dr. It is open, to the weather, along the north side of the road.
03-16-2007, 12:26 AM
#133
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Originally Posted by alnielsen
It looks like from other pictures that most of the impact was on the passenger door area. There should have been some speed scrubbed off while the car was skidding.
Japican: How did the driver spin the car out?
03-16-2007, 02:10 AM
#135
幹他媽!
some might remind that u forgot to include (D) the pole moved all by itself from the side of the road and then rammed directly into the side of the car...
still, condolences to the families... bottom-line is that teenagers need to be especially careful on the road because statistically they are at a higher risk of having fatal accidents. and, we all need to drive safely to prevent this sorta thing from happening...
still, condolences to the families... bottom-line is that teenagers need to be especially careful on the road because statistically they are at a higher risk of having fatal accidents. and, we all need to drive safely to prevent this sorta thing from happening...
Originally Posted by PhotoMunkey
My bet at this point is either (A) a cat or dog ran out in front of the car or (B) a left rear tire blowout while accelerating or (C) the driver was just screwing around and was weaving for fun.
Last edited by Detrich; 03-16-2007 at 02:20 AM.
02-12-2008, 02:45 PM
#140
The family is saying that because of a claimed design defects in the car there kids died in. They are talking about the rear doors not being able to open with out the front doors being opened. I suppose by that logic all 2 door couple with a back seat have a design defeat.
Another b@llsh*t law suite to keep the lawyers busy. I'm sorry about there kids but go after the idiot that killed them, don't go after Mazda because they have deep pockets and your looking for a buck. It's nice to see they have gotten over their grief enough to put a price tag on their children's life. I know this sounds harsh but this country's sue happy attitude is out of control.
Another b@llsh*t law suite to keep the lawyers busy. I'm sorry about there kids but go after the idiot that killed them, don't go after Mazda because they have deep pockets and your looking for a buck. It's nice to see they have gotten over their grief enough to put a price tag on their children's life. I know this sounds harsh but this country's sue happy attitude is out of control.
02-12-2008, 02:48 PM
#141
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The family is saying that because of a claimed design defects in the car there kids died in. They are talking about the rear doors not being able to open with out the front doors being opened. I suppose by that logic all 2 door couple with a back seat have a design defeat.
Another b@llsh*t law suite to keep the lawyers busy. I'm sorry about there kids but go after the idiot that killed them, don't go after Mazda because they have deep pockets and your looking for a buck. It's nice to see they have gotten over their grief enough to put a price tag on their children's life. I know this sounds harsh but this country's sue happy attitude is out of control.
Another b@llsh*t law suite to keep the lawyers busy. I'm sorry about there kids but go after the idiot that killed them, don't go after Mazda because they have deep pockets and your looking for a buck. It's nice to see they have gotten over their grief enough to put a price tag on their children's life. I know this sounds harsh but this country's sue happy attitude is out of control.
02-12-2008, 02:50 PM
#142
Registered User
The family is saying that because of a claimed design defects in the car there kids died in. They are talking about the rear doors not being able to open with out the front doors being opened. I suppose by that logic all 2 door couple with a back seat have a design defeat.
Another b@llsh*t law suite to keep the lawyers busy. I'm sorry about there kids but go after the idiot that killed them, don't go after Mazda because they have deep pockets and your looking for a buck. It's nice to see they have gotten over their grief enough to put a price tag on their children's life. I know this sounds harsh but this country's sue happy attitude is out of control.
Another b@llsh*t law suite to keep the lawyers busy. I'm sorry about there kids but go after the idiot that killed them, don't go after Mazda because they have deep pockets and your looking for a buck. It's nice to see they have gotten over their grief enough to put a price tag on their children's life. I know this sounds harsh but this country's sue happy attitude is out of control.
02-12-2008, 03:00 PM
#143
幹他媽!
geez louise... what if the car had been a standard 2 door coupe? wouldn't the rear passengers been just as trapped?
the last i checked, the rx-8 is still a coupe. so, are they trying to say that coupes should be banned or are thy saying that every door on a car needs to be able to open independently?
not to be unsympathetic, but the families sound like they are just out for blood... ie utter BS lawsuit. they need to teach their teenager how to drive first. but- oh wait, they should probably sue the state for issuing him a drivers license to begin with, because clearly he isn't qualified to drive a motor vehicle.
the last i checked, the rx-8 is still a coupe. so, are they trying to say that coupes should be banned or are thy saying that every door on a car needs to be able to open independently?
not to be unsympathetic, but the families sound like they are just out for blood... ie utter BS lawsuit. they need to teach their teenager how to drive first. but- oh wait, they should probably sue the state for issuing him a drivers license to begin with, because clearly he isn't qualified to drive a motor vehicle.
02-12-2008, 03:55 PM
#144
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This thread is especially poignant to me considering the fact that I very recently lost a good friend of mine in an accident. The 350Z he was driving caught air, and he lost control when the car came back down, flipping and hitting a tree roof first. He and the passenger were killed instantly.
The hardest way to learn that speeding is a bad idea...
The hardest way to learn that speeding is a bad idea...
02-12-2008, 04:28 PM
#145
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in hopes of keep from sounding too calloused and cold, i can't help but say that they have NO lawsuit here. If they win, it would mean anyone in an auto accident can sue the maker. It was a gamble that they took in the back of a car that only opens through the front days first. Was it tragic? VERY. But it's not a lawsuit, and Mazda can't help it that someone smashed into their side and deemed the door unopenable.
Heaven forbid how many people have been pinned in cars during accidents before. That's why their called accidents.
my heart still goes out to the familes...a year later. It's a tragic, sad loss. However, money isn't a way to continue the grieving in this instance.
Heaven forbid how many people have been pinned in cars during accidents before. That's why their called accidents.
my heart still goes out to the familes...a year later. It's a tragic, sad loss. However, money isn't a way to continue the grieving in this instance.
02-12-2008, 10:01 PM
#146
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If this is a normal 2 door coupe, then yes they would have no case. But the way the rear doors were designed might give people the impression that they can be operated independently of the front doors. In reality once the rear passengers are belted in, they can't really operate the doors without assistance.
Think about the last time you were alone with the car, and decided to plop yourself in the rear seat and close the suicide door. It's damn near impossible to close and open the front door without reaching around the front seat. I'd hate to have to extricate myself from the backseat of a burning RX-8.
Think about the last time you were alone with the car, and decided to plop yourself in the rear seat and close the suicide door. It's damn near impossible to close and open the front door without reaching around the front seat. I'd hate to have to extricate myself from the backseat of a burning RX-8.
02-12-2008, 10:19 PM
#147
If this is a normal 2 door coupe, then yes they would have no case. But the way the rear doors were designed might give people the impression that they can be operated independently of the front doors. In reality once the rear passengers are belted in, they can't really operate the doors without assistance.
and who will sit in the back when no one is in the front, is like telling people that I want to go somewhere but no one drives.
Think about the last time you were alone with the car, and decided to plop yourself in the rear seat and close the suicide door. It's damn near impossible to close and open the front door without reaching around the front seat. I'd hate to have to extricate myself from the backseat of a burning RX-8.
If its a 2 door only couple, I can say its a design defect because they should have 4 doors ! There is still space ! (For example, the new Altima 2 door Couple)
If its a 4 door, I can say its a design defect because the door is weaker than the actual body frame !
When I saw this news a year ago, I feel kinda sorry that they died. but now, I completely think that They *DESERVES* to die. Why ? when you think about it, with a irresponsible family like this (suing Mazda and estate of the driver), do you expect the driver of the car to be a responsible person ? I dont think so
Yeah if the brakes suddenly fail then its Mazda's fault. But this door thing is just utter bullshit to me.
They drive, They crashed, they died, their own damn fault. God you gotta love our great American's system. where you can sue Mcdonaldo's Hot coffee being too hot.
02-13-2008, 10:49 AM
#148
The same can be said of any 4 seat couple. Once your in the back seat it is hard to open the front doors. The only difference the RX-8 has is you don't have to tilt the seat forward to get in and out of the back seat, even though you could. Both cars require the front door to be open.
Again this is b@llsh$t that will only end up costing you and me more, to cover the money lost to the lawyers. Our legal system allows these types of ridiculous law suites with out any possible ramifications to the person initiating the suite. They figure they will roll the dice and maybe win a big settlement. Start having the losers cover the legal cost of the winners and watch all these frivolous suite dry up over night.
We can put all the out of work personal injury lawyers to work in Iraq disarming road side explosives. Yes I am not a big fan of frivolous law suites and those would profit from them.
Think about the last time you were alone with the car, and decided to plop yourself in the rear seat and close the suicide door. It's damn near impossible to close and open the front door without reaching around the front seat. I'd hate to have to extricate myself from the backseat of a burning RX-8.
Again this is b@llsh$t that will only end up costing you and me more, to cover the money lost to the lawyers. Our legal system allows these types of ridiculous law suites with out any possible ramifications to the person initiating the suite. They figure they will roll the dice and maybe win a big settlement. Start having the losers cover the legal cost of the winners and watch all these frivolous suite dry up over night.
We can put all the out of work personal injury lawyers to work in Iraq disarming road side explosives. Yes I am not a big fan of frivolous law suites and those would profit from them.
Think about the last time you were alone with the car, and decided to plop yourself in the rear seat and close the suicide door. It's damn near impossible to close and open the front door without reaching around the front seat. I'd hate to have to extricate myself from the backseat of a burning RX-8.
02-13-2008, 10:56 AM
#149
I would not say anyone deserved to die beside the idiot that was driving the car. I believe you sleep in the hole you dig, accountability. The two passengers in the rear who's family's are suing certainly didn't deserve this fate. They were simple passengers, I definitely do not agree with their families course of action and I understand your anger at this type of law suite but I feel for their lose. And don't believe they deserved to die because some stupid kid was driving beyond his skill.
When I saw this news a year ago, I feel kinda sorry that they died. but now, I completely think that They *DESERVES* to die. Why ? when you think about it, with a irresponsible family like this (suing Mazda and estate of the driver), do you expect the driver of the car to be a responsible person ? I dont think so
Yeah if the brakes suddenly fail then its Mazda's fault. But this door thing is just utter bullshit to me.
They drive, They crashed, they died, their own damn fault. God you gotta love our great American's system. where you can sue Mcdonaldo's Hot coffee being too hot.
When I saw this news a year ago, I feel kinda sorry that they died. but now, I completely think that They *DESERVES* to die. Why ? when you think about it, with a irresponsible family like this (suing Mazda and estate of the driver), do you expect the driver of the car to be a responsible person ? I dont think so
Yeah if the brakes suddenly fail then its Mazda's fault. But this door thing is just utter bullshit to me.
They drive, They crashed, they died, their own damn fault. God you gotta love our great American's system. where you can sue Mcdonaldo's Hot coffee being too hot.
02-13-2008, 11:26 AM
#150
For the record, Mazda does provide Rear Door exit instructions in the "Quick Tips" Reference Guide:
For a rear occupant to exit without a front occupant:
1. Release front seat to forward position
2. Unlock and open front door
3. Open rear door
Perhaps the real reason Mazda includes them is to avoid possible lawsuits.
(I actually sat in the back seat with all the doors closed and tried this, just to see how feasble it is. It does work, though moving the passenger seat forward requires an awkward stretch. Of course, moving the (power) driver's seat is easier.)