its the slope and whether the relationship between the lines changes that is important - not which starts on top .

 

Without getting into the specifics, the reason why there are a "few detractors" and others that rave is because of the mixed uses that RX8 owners have with their vehicles.

The mazsport product is nice, well put together and complete. The problem is you can't beat the physics and the physics of the coils provided by Mazsport require a longer charge time than what the RX8 PCM is designed for.

If you're interested in the subject, google "dwell" to see what I'm talking about. The coil creates a magnetic field until it's fully charged and when that field is destoryed it creates a spark.

The coils do create a better spark but in the lower and mid-ranges where the coil has ample time to charge. Since the rotor turns slower at lower RPMS, the coil has a larger window to charge. As much as 20ms at low RPMS.

However, at higher RPM's the coil has less time to charge and thus produces less spark. This is why some are seeing a power fall off where they would normally maintain or gain power.

While Mazsport has said these coils can be tuned so the dwell operates properly with the RX8, I would prefer a setup which is designed to work right out of the box and do so in all RPM ranges.

As for the upcoming BHR kit, initial parts of the kit have been ran on MazdaManaic's RX8 for several months including a time attack and HPDE event with much success. Easy_E is currently testing the yukon coil set on his RX8 and I know I'm looking forward to the finished product.

Sorry to threadjack! I just wanted to drop some information in here for everyone.

 

correct me if i'm wrong but I thought the dwell time was set by the ECU . the old points operated systems were the ones that had lower dwell at higher RPM ....

 

^^^ cool explanation, Flashwing. Learned a few things...

 

I'll have to go back and look at my notes, but I imagine the PCM is operating on the same dwell settings but the coils themselves require those settings to be tuned in order to work properly through the whole RPM range.

I believe it has more to do with the coils not matching up with all of the car's needs than anything else. The coils that Mazsport provide work within the range of the PCM but taper off in the upper RPM range.

I've been told that tuning can account for the difference in dwell but I have no idea how much success people have had with that.

 

well the explanation given by Scott was that the existing dwell settings were fine for N/A use but needed tuning for high hp turbo applications .
With this knowledge there should be no reason not to go with the Mazsport coils either way .
N/A - ok as is
Turbo - you are going to have the capability of tweaking the dwell with your engine management system.

Lets not forget that the highest hp turbo systems yet seen on the Renesis are using these coils .

 

I have the Mazsport ignition solution and I have a turbo car. MazdaManiac tuned the Dwell settings for the coils using the Interceptor-X. When we started tuning my car we were getting a stumble from about 4500rpm all the way through about 7500rpm on just 7psi. This makes sense because that is where the torque peak is and the car is injesting the highest air and fuel. we gradually increased the Dwell from the OEM 2ms setting all the way up to 3.5ms. Now there is no stumble and the car pulls hard all the way through to 8500rpm.

I know some people say the Mazsport ignition solution caused problems. However, I don't think their issue is as much about the ignition solution as it is about the realease of the ignition solution without all the information. When the ignition solution was released no one was told that they would have to tune the Dwell. I don't think people are complaining about the product as much as they are complaining about the problems that were caused by the lack of information. When it comes to tuning high horsepower cars information is key and without it there is an increased risk of catastrophic failure.

 

^.....totally agree with this. I'm still NA but I can see where the Turbo guys might have been possibly tweaked by the apparent lack of some info.

 

sparkplugs.com if you want to get spark plugs at a good price.

 

Thanks tdiddy - I think that is first time someone with turbo + coils has explained this in that detail . What concerns me about your post is that at 7 psi the OEM coils would probably have been fine which begs the question ........
Are the Mazsport coils weaker than stock at the OEM 2ms setting ? If that were the case all the N/A cars with the coils should be altering their dwell as well and as most people that are N/A don't have the ability to do this ........ Not good !

The other thing that occurred to me : when these first came out they were touted as the "solution" to getting high hp (over 330whp) from the renesis. The 360whp dyno that was posted seemed to prove this . To get there they were running at 12-14 PSI I believe . If tdiddy was having blowout at 7 PSI then that car at 12-14psi would surley be having that issue as well . So - Scott must have altered the dwell to get that 360hp car running ..... What conclusion do we draw from that ?

 

it is not stated that you have to tune the dwell settings for n/a applications. i am n/a and i did not have any success with them. with the money that i sold mine i bought a cobb accessport, now i have the ability to change the dwell settings but it doesnt matter. my money is limited. but yeah, i have read a lot of the stuff thats been posted about dwell settings.

i would have preferred a solution that worked as stated. right out of the box.

 

The differences are in the tune. I was running below 10:1 AFR when we started experiencing the stumble. As we brought the AFR closer to 11.5:1 the stumble was not as noticible. Eventually, we could only feel a slight stumble between 6000rpm and 7000rpm. Thats when we started to adjust the dwell and everything just sorta came together. My car is somewhere in the 270-280whp range on 7psi. With AFR's below 10:1 I dont' think the OEM coils would ignite the mixture.

 

guys guys.. stay on topic...

 

^uh oh the thread police has spoken

 

yup - better get back to talking about where to buy oem coils and stop the mindless idle chatter about stuff that actually increases our knowledge about our cars and the products available for them ....

 

Yeah, no kidding on that

 

Thread is still on topic. Whats the best solution for a set of bad coils. BHR has a kit in the works. Mazport has a kit, and there are OEM coils too. Discussing the merits, pros and cons of each system is completely on topic.

Keep the hard data and personal experiences coming.

 

I had some dyno runs done with the factory ignition back in May, and I'm going back on the dynojet this saturday with the mazsport coils-wires-NGK plugs

I'll add my results this weekend

 

My comments are on topic. The OEM coils can begin to experinece "spark blowout" on a stock car when the AFR is 12:1 or richer. I know because I had this problem when I dyno'd my car before I installed my turbo kit. I was running the OEM tune and the OEM coils.

After I installed the turbo kit and the Mazsport Ignition Solution, my car would run well with AFRs richer than 11.5:1 on 7psi with the exception or the 6000-7000rpm range. That tells me that the Mazsport Ignition solution is better than the OEM coils on a N/A car because it could ignite a mixture with the same dwell setting that the OEM coils could not.

Had we brought the AFRs up to 12:1 or leaner while tuning I am very confident that the Mazsport Ignition Solution would have ignited the mixture at all rpm ranges with the OEM dwell settings. IMO there is nothing a properly functioning N/A car can throw at the Mazsport Ignition Solution that it could not ignite. I was running about 100 more horsepower before the OEM dwell settings began to affect the Mazsport Coils ability to ignite the mixture.

 

excellent information tdiddy

 

Are the coils the same for all 4? Or are they like the plugs, different for leading and trailing? Also, I've replaced all new plugs about 3 month ago, and my coils just went bad. Should I replace the plugs again? The dealership told me that bad coils can cause plug fauling in very short amount of time.

 

alot of threads around here get off topic haha...

 

oooops sorry just looking for info

 

all the coils are the same.. and a bad coil can cause a plug to foul..

beers

 

Got it. Thanks for the straight up info!