Notices
RX-8 Discussion General discussion about the RX-8 that doesn't fit in one of the specialty forums.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: CARiD

FAA certified RENISIS aircraft engine?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Rate Thread
 
Old 11-30-2007 | 03:42 PM
  #1  
alloyicon's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered
 
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
From: San Diego
FAA certified RENISIS aircraft engine?

http://www.mistral-engines.com/
Old 11-30-2007 | 04:45 PM
  #2  
alloyicon's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered
 
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
From: San Diego
Turbine Like!

The following is an excerpt from the Mistral Engines Technology section

"The sheer simplicity of the rotary engine block leads to its high reliability, longevity and low maintenance and overhaul costs. There are no valves, no pistons, no connecting rods, no camshaft…

The crankshaft is replaced by a much more simple and robust eccentric shaft, and the same power as some six-cylinder piston engines can be produced by a two-rotor engine. This design has proven itself over many years of reliable service in automobile applications. In car racing, rotary engines are renown for their dependability and piston engines are no match for them in endurance.

Contrary to reciprocating engines in which pistons brutally reverse direction thousands of times per minute, rotary pistons only … rotate, with a slight eccentric movement. This results in incomparably smooth, vibration-free engine operations and great durability… turbine-like!"
Old 11-30-2007 | 04:51 PM
  #3  
tajabaho1's Avatar
Destroying Threads
 
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,296
Likes: 2
From: (swartsnegga state)
I want that
Old 11-30-2007 | 05:05 PM
  #4  
alloyicon's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered
 
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
From: San Diego
Bonanza of Rotary Technical Info!

http://www.rotaryeng.net/

This is a link that is in the "links" page of the above posted Mistral Engines page. This has a vast collection of rotary info that should keep many of you rotor heads busy for days. Enjoy!

Make sure to check out what seems to be an old 1970's Mazda Rotary commercial by going to the bottom of the page to the Video/Sounds links and watch the
"..... Before Zoom Zoom there was the ----" link. It is funny stuff.

Last edited by alloyicon; 11-30-2007 at 05:25 PM. Reason: additional comment
Old 11-30-2007 | 09:23 PM
  #5  
champi0n's Avatar
Registered User
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 562
Likes: 0
From: Portland, ME
i love how everyone that drives a civic says the rotary is unreliable, and how new owners are always like, omg this d00d told me i got ripped off coz tha rotary is unreliable and breaks.

i bought it for knowing its reliable and im glad people that fly airplanes like it too.
Old 12-01-2007 | 01:27 AM
  #6  
astrozoom's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
From: Tacoma, Washington
If you do a google search, you can actually find that there are numerous people out there who have or are working on putting a rotary in their own experimental planes. There is one site that the guy actually keeps an online log of everything they have done to the rotary to convert it to an aircraft engine. It is not all that uncommon to see auto engines in airplanes though.
Old 12-01-2007 | 04:05 PM
  #7  
Crztrtldck's Avatar
Jonathan
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
From: Houston
the rotary engine was in a plane before it was in a car
or so ive heard
i'll see if i can find some sources on that
Old 12-01-2007 | 04:12 PM
  #8  
Crztrtldck's Avatar
Jonathan
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
From: Houston
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotary_engine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wankel_engine

the first link is the history of the rotary in WW1 aircrafts
and the second link is history of the rotary in cars
Old 12-01-2007 | 04:32 PM
  #9  
Easy_E1's Avatar
Registered
iTrader: (2)
 
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,675
Likes: 5
From: Bellevue WA
Atkins Rotary in Tacoma Wash. has been doing this for years.
Old 12-01-2007 | 04:44 PM
  #10  
enforcer's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,432
Likes: 0
From: Brisbane
In your research did anyone see any rotary aircraft engines which failed....?
Old 12-01-2007 | 08:05 PM
  #11  
astrozoom's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
From: Tacoma, Washington
Originally Posted by Easy_E1
Atkins Rotary in Tacoma Wash. has been doing this for years.
Are they actually certified by the FAA or do they just put them in experimental aircraft?
Old 12-01-2007 | 08:07 PM
  #12  
refugeefrompistons's Avatar
Registered
 
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 452
Likes: 0
completely different kind of rotary in airplanes during ww1. They just moved with the propeller, not like our rotary with rotors.
Old 12-02-2007 | 07:11 AM
  #13  
Crztrtldck's Avatar
Jonathan
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
From: Houston
Originally Posted by refugeefrompistons
completely different kind of rotary in airplanes during ww1. They just moved with the propeller, not like our rotary with rotors.
true but its the same concept... almost
its what inspired the rotary we have today
Old 12-13-2007 | 04:17 PM
  #14  
shinka1313's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
From: Louisville
Originally Posted by Crztrtldck
true but its the same concept... almost
its what inspired the rotary we have today
Not the same at all, WW1 rotary engines had pistons and the whole engine rotated. Wankel engines don't have pistons, rods or valves, they have rotors and the whole engine doesn't rotate. The rotary name was applied by Mazda marketing to the Wankel so now that's the common name for it.

Last edited by shinka1313; 12-13-2007 at 04:34 PM.
Old 12-13-2007 | 04:42 PM
  #15  
von Richtofen's Avatar
Ace of Aces
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
From: Jasta 11
shinka1313 is absolutely correct. WWI rotary engines are exactly like "radial" piston engines with one difference: The crankshaft is stationary and the propellor and pistons rotate around it.

The WWI rotary has nothing to do with the Wankel concept.

Very, very few WW1 vintage rotary engines are still flying today. Most flying WWI aircraft, whether authentic or reproduction, use a modern stationary "radial" engine instead of a "rotary". Parts are very difficult and expensive to procure for an 85-year-old engine.
Old 12-13-2007 | 04:59 PM
  #16  
rotarygod's Avatar
Registered
 
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 9,134
Likes: 25
From: Houston
The engines Mistral is using are older 13B's. They are not Renesis engines.
Old 12-13-2007 | 05:25 PM
  #17  
von Richtofen's Avatar
Ace of Aces
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
From: Jasta 11
Notice that the Mistral engines use a planetary reduction gearbox of 2.8235:1 rpm reduction, to optimise propellor efficiency. At 9000 rpm engine speed, that corresponds to ~3187 rpm final propellor speed.

Typical WW1 propellor rotational speeds were almost all under 1500 rpm.

One wonders if Mazda has done gearbox-reduction experimentation for an automotive application? Torque gains would be most welcome.
Old 12-14-2007 | 05:10 PM
  #18  
astrozoom's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
From: Tacoma, Washington
Originally Posted by von Richtofen
Notice that the Mistral engines use a planetary reduction gearbox of 2.8235:1 rpm reduction, to optimise propellor efficiency. At 9000 rpm engine speed, that corresponds to ~3187 rpm final propellor speed.

Typical WW1 propellor rotational speeds were almost all under 1500 rpm.

One wonders if Mazda has done gearbox-reduction experimentation for an automotive application? Torque gains would be most welcome.
Not only does the engine have to be geared down for efficiency, but it is also for prop noise and the stress of turning a propeller at 9000 rpms would created way too much stress on the entire system. Much added stress equates to bulky parts, which means the parts would be heavier, which makes the overall aircraft heavier, and weight is a huge deal in aircraft design. Weight drives a large part of the design.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
vapor2
West For Sale/Wanted
11
11-03-2020 04:38 PM
mr. GrandGame
New Member Forum
5
03-23-2016 11:16 AM
badinfluence
Series II Aftermarket Performance Modifications
6
08-31-2015 12:51 PM
Eirulisse
New Member Forum
13
08-15-2015 01:34 PM
MolecularConcept
New Member Forum
8
08-09-2015 05:46 AM



You have already rated this thread Rating: Thread Rating: 0 votes,  average.

Quick Reply: FAA certified RENISIS aircraft engine?



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:59 PM.