Spoonie

Not really, I would like for the option of all maintenance to be included with the price of the car.

What does TANSTAAFL stand for?

PatrickB

There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.

PatrickB

You know, if you asked the dealer, they could probably give you the price on all scheduled maintenance and let you prepay for it. I'm sure they'd be happy to earn interest on $1200 while you put 30k miles on the car, instead of you keeping the money while you use the car and getting that interest yourself...

-Patrick

Immi

I think a maintainance package should be included upon purchasing a rx8 - basically because of the history the last rotory powered car left behind in north america and the fact that it is a totally different engine.


Plus it's better for competition.

PatrickB

That's not a bad idea at all - requiring people to come in for scheduled maintenance so you can make sure that the oil changes and routine maintenance happen on time for such a new (and unfamiliar) engine in case of any later warranty claims (which killed Mazda on the RX-7) is a good idea.

mjgc0

This thread is getting a little ridiculous. Korean Hyundai junk-mobiles can't compare to Mercedes quality even if you get more for your buck. You can go out and buy a real nice Aiwa stereo with all the bells and whistles but it won't sound anything like a Denon. I do personally think buying the Mercedes in question is a waste of money but there is a middle ground of price and quality. We are talking about two totally different ends of the spectrum comparing Hyundai junk with Mercedes, even if it is the under-powered and cheapest Mercedes. I am willing to place a wager on the car that will last the longest. Safety wasn't part of the discussion either....

Also one thing not considered in this free maintenance is the inconvenience factor. I just finished picking up the VW we own from its free 10K oil change and they didn't finish it in the same day. They had the car for more than 24hrs for an oil change! I would almost not want the free maintenance if I knew it was going to be this inconvenient. They only provided shuttle service for 10 mile radius and the workplace is about 20 so this wasn't of use to me either. The maintenance that is "free" is on the car dealer's schedule and let me tell you; when there is no money involved, they aren't in a hurry to finish your "free" maintenance.

PatrickB

And Mazda and Infiniti, which don't provide "free" maintenance *do* provide loaner cars while your car is being serviced.

mjgc0

We did get the loaner car free for the 5K maintenance but it wasn't given for the 10K. Do they offer the free loaner for the WHOLE free maintenance period? It is still an inconvenience unless you live near your dealer and the free loaner car is truly free for the whole free maintenance period. I am not entirely unhappy with VW free maintenance but it is less convenient than me changing the oil or having my regular mechanic do the service during a lunch time. If I had the option to reduce the price of the VW and skip the free maintenance, I would have without a second thought but this is a standard 2.0 4cyl and not a rotary (never owned one) so I can't comment on if the rotaries are likely to need more adjustment/maintenance than others. I suppose others in this forum would know better.

Hercules

No, I am simply saying that why argue the fact? I might be wrong on the C230 in which case I apologise, but you are here trying to provoking a response that you can argue with, at least in the tone that you've used.

Fact is, MBUSA makes a LOT more money per car than Mazda does per car. Their S classess, E classes, etc give them a huge amount of money with which they can offer free maintenence for the life of a lease or three years.

So I might be wrong but it doesn't matter... I think we need to look at the whole picture here.

fuz

Yep. I think the margins on a BMW average at 60%. Highest in the industry. Free scheduled maintenance for 3 years, though I have mine extended for 4 (major tune up time), as my car is already paid off and I plan to keep it beyond the normal warrantee.

I don't know how much Mazda is making off their cars, but they can't be making very much for the amount of features that they cram in. If you look at a BMW, there are a good amount of standard features, and fair build quality, but really--does better plastic and smarter engineering cost thousands more?

It's like design. All cars have to be designed, but in the end, some end up being more expensive even though the base car is the same. (e.g. PT cruiser and Neon). That little extra money that they spend in design time lets them add a huge extra margin that is pure profit.

Luxury cars are just regular cars built a little better, but they don’t cost a little more, they cost a lot more.

Rich

I don't understand why anyone would want to pay for 3 years of maintenance up front when they buy the car. That's really what happens when you get "free" maintenance from the dealer/manufacturer.
First of all, as has already been mentioned they get to get paid up front and earn interest on the extra money you've paid.
Second, they can charge whatever they want and the costs are hidden from you.
Third, what happens if you don't keep the car for 3 years? Even if you plan on keeping it that long, if it gets totalled after a year you've paid for 2 years of service that you can't get back. Fourth, what if you prefer doing the service yourself? Some dealers do provide quality service, but I've dealt with some dealers who I wouldn't let get within 15 feet of my car. Most enthusiasts I know would prefer doing everything themselves. Do you think you'll get full synthetic with the pre-paid (or "free") manufacturers service? I don't think so. How often are the oil changes? I would bet that they're as often as the owners manual says, which on my Miata IIRC is every 5,000 miles under harsh conditions. Even if that's truly all that's necessary, I would rather pay a tiny extra amount to get the oil changed every 3,000 miles. Even if it doesn't protect the engine any better, it gives me some extra piece of mind and it comes in very handy to have full documentation of oil changes more often than recommended when selling a car. Trust me on that one, it pays off in the end if you sell the car.

In other words, I can only see reasons why it's a bad deal for the customer and a good deal for the dealer. Perhaps it's a good marketing gimmic, but for the customer it's a scam as far as I can see.

Where is my thinking wrong?

PatrickB

Well, for higher-end cars, it's a good selling point for most of the public, as its one less thing you have to worry about later. Econmically, I agree that it's not necessarily great for the reasons I mentioned earlier in this thread. It is convenient, however, and most people buying higher-end cars are paying for convenience and comfort, not just performance. It's important to remember that enthusiasts make up only a portion of the sport sedan market, for example, and that joe middle-manager makes up a sizeable portion too. Personally, I'd prefer that if someone's going to offer it, that it be optional so I don't have to pay for it if I don't want.

Unfortunately, with the kid on the way and us already having one small car, I'm probably out of the running for the RX-8. As a result, I've been looking at the Mazda6, VW Passat, Audi A4, Acura TL-S, and the Infiniti G35. Frankly, the A4 is quite appealing, since a loaded 1.8T quattro + with manual transmission is very good for going skiing and for toting a lot of stuff, and it's also a very comfortable car. However, I'm forced to pay for maintenance up front, something that annoys me slightly.

Anyway, food for thought.

-Patrick

threeputtwash

Quick breakdown:
1) benefits both manufacturer and consumer.
2) we're still comparing apples to oranges
3) manufacturers are protecting their investments.


Explaination of my convoluted way of thought:

1)
I'm doubting that the "free scheduled maintenance" is free. But odds are, I doubt that they charge you for the full price of the service. So if the manufacturers have a hidden charge of $1000 for this feature, does all the maintenance costs for those 3 years equal the $1000? I might be wrong, but somehow I doubt that. I'm guessing that it would costs the consumer more than that. I'm betting that it's profitable for the manufacturer, AND at the same time, cost saving for the consumer.

2)
As is been pointed out, the margins for the german cars are higher. But then again, compare the prices for their middle entry vehicle. The german cars cost wayyyy more than the mazdas. Heck...we're comparing the cheapest Mercedes to the top line mazdas. Something doesn't seem right there. It's like everyone always comparing the Z to the RX-8, it's not really fair, but it's going to happen.....

3)
I might be totally wrong, but here's another thought as to why the German manufacturers are willing to give "free" maintenance. Isn't there a significantly higher percentage of leasing going on with the german cars? To them, it's like insuring their investments. If I had one with free maintenance, I'd say, why not, it's free. If I had to pay for it, I'd skip as much as I can, because hey, I'm returning it in a few years, so why bother!

Anyways, that's just a few of my opinions on the subject.....

Buger

My co-worker mentioned that he had "free" oil changes on his $40,000 US Audit TT.