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How to shift

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Old 10-14-2003 | 09:33 PM
  #51  
8_wannabe's Avatar
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From: La Jolla CA
Originally posted by Hayseed
When I shift, I simultaneously release the throttle and disengage the clutch (the teeter totter), which immediately reduces the rpms. Before I again let off the clutch I give the throttle a "blip" to bring the rpms back up to the level necessary for the new gear (whether lower or higher). When the rpms are at the right spot, I release the clutch.
This is exactly what I do. I never thought of it as blip or rev matching, but I guess that's what it is. I'd bet about 98 percent of MT drivers do this but a purist like druck thinks no one on the winning side of the pond could possibly drive stick with anything tantamount to skill.
Old 10-14-2003 | 10:28 PM
  #52  
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From: Seattle, WA but doing 3 years hard time in Cambridge, MA
Originally posted by druck
Well a Frenchman invented the first steam powered car, a Scot invented the first electric car, and Germans invented the first petrol and diesel cars. What did you invent again?
...
Cheers
---Dave
We invented the assembly line and perfected interchangable parts (starting on a gun of course, the Colt). Keeps them backwards RX-8s quite a bit cheaper than if they were built one by one, eh?:D
Old 10-14-2003 | 11:45 PM
  #53  
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From: San Diego, CA
Originally posted by visitor
why is it that you should be in neutral when you blip the throttle, instead of just holding down the clutch, blipping the throttle, shifting down and then letting off the clutch? there's probably a good reason, i can't remember. i
It's called double-clutching and is required with transmissions that don't have synchros... not needed for most modern cars but will help save the synchros.

When you put the car in neutral, the input shaft of the transmission is connected to the engine but is disconnected from the output shaft (connects to the wheels). Blipping the throttle will increase the engine speed AND the input shaft speed to match the speed needed for the next gear. When the shifter is moved into place for the actual gear change, the gear teeth will engage smoothly without needing synchro help because the input shaft is already spinning at the right speed.

When you downshift without double-clutching, the synchros have to speed up the input shaft to match the gear you are engaging which puts wear on the synchros. Not a big deal since that's how the transmission was designed to work.

I haven't actually tried double-clutching myself. I think I learned it all from reading the web at some point.
Old 10-14-2003 | 11:49 PM
  #54  
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tyranosaurus rex-8
 
Joined: Jan 2003
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From: los angeles
Originally posted by Jon H
Because the drive has to be connected when you blip the throttle, ie. the clutch has to be let out - its not just to get the engine speed right, but also the correct shafts in the gearbox too. Releasing the clutch whilst in neutral makes this connection, so that the 'throttle blip' can be transmitted through the drive.
I'm not a technohead so maybe someone out there might be able to add more detail, but I enjoy my driving and know that it works!! I'd draw a diagram if that was possible!
JH
i believe you are looking for the layshaft. if you are in neutral, and have the clutch pushed in, giving a blip on the throttle will spin the crank faster up to the flywheel. the driveshaft will be spinning at whatever it happens to be while the layshaft, which is basically the clutch disc and pressure plate (depends how you consider this), is slowing down. so even if you revmatch the motor to what it should be, you are missing the middle part.

since i can't draw a picture here's the sequence of the drive train =)

crank -> flywheel |1| clutch disc -> layshaft -> one side of your gears |2| other side of your gears -> drive shaft -> differential -> wheels.

the clutch connects |1| and the shifter connects |2| ...so basically when you want to double clutch, rev match, or shift smoother you need to spin up all 3 parts.
Old 10-15-2003 | 12:55 AM
  #55  
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From: San Diego, CA
ah, ok, that makes sense. so double clutching just saves wear on the syncro's. i assumed that when the clutch was depressed, the entire drivetrain was disconnected, didn't realize the middle part of the drivetrain.
Old 10-15-2003 | 06:17 AM
  #56  
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From: Gloucester, England
Originally posted by Kamala
We invented the assembly line and perfected interchangable parts (starting on a gun of course, the Colt). Keeps them backwards RX-8s quite a bit cheaper than if they were built one by one, eh?:D
Yes, I'll acknowledge Henry Ford's contribution to manufacturing, especially as Ford own Mazda - but the RX8's engine is still built by hand!

Cheers
---Dave
Old 10-15-2003 | 03:22 PM
  #57  
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From: IN
interesting.....learn something new here.

I have been driving manual trans since I was 15 (many moons ago) and never considered what goes in to double clutching. I drove an old 280z with the syncros worn out and was in effect matching rpm to drive train to slip the gears in.

Nice to see the explanation.

Also, enjoying my chukles on Ex British Empire folk lore.
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