rotten42

To some extent I agree but the one thing that college/university does is open doors. Some employers won't even look at you unless you have that piece of paper. This means you may never get the chance to show them what you are made of. It may not be right, but it is what's happening.

Dlrosie

You are going to bring home about $2500.00 a month. Run the numbers on a piece of paper. Be smart. You'll make the right decision. And if not, you'll learn from it.

SilverEIGHT

"Everyone is bagging on the dude"
Actually not the dude, it's the idea and a topic that I feel is extremely important to anyone making this decision. I'm very glad he made this post.

I do agree with you on the importance of the debt free scenario...

(OMG, here Silver goes on a tangent)
I am debt free because I got an education, started with a technical school followed by work, college, another college and work. I worked for $12K per year starting off (after college) and drove old beat up cars. I worked my way up the financial ladder and eventually purchased land and built a home. I'm now a VP of Marketing and would never have had this opportunity to be debt free if I had not gone to college.

I know this thread is turning into a college issue, but it must be understood that making this choice is a LIFE choice and will affect the rest of a person’s career and is a choice the individual has to live with.

Bitch, bitch, bitch... I'll shut up now. OK, no more lecturing from me on this one, good luck... son, an RX-8 is a wonderful car.

alphapenguin

depending on the jobmarket you are trying to get into, good jobs are hard to come by. I have a lot of friends who are having a hell of a time as it is getting a job with a degree, but they get one in the end. I can just imagine someone with no college background trying to get the same jobs, but then again, someone who didnt specialize in an area of study at school may not be trying to compete for the same jobs.

ANyway, 18$/hr working full time is like 34k a year, after tax, its gonna be lower, but I think someone could live off of that. Granted they wont have the luxuries as others, but i think he said "our company" referring to a family business, so chances are he'll be getting more than that. Regardless, why not go to college, its fun. You get an education while meeting new people and if you wish, get plastered with different types of people from different places. Thats if you like that type of thing:-)


oh yah, one more thing, well said silver8.

dmp

It's not their lack of degree holding them back, it's their imagination and work ethic.

czr

iTrader: (3)

You can have the best of both worlds. $18/hr is good for someone yound w/o a degree. Go to school at least part-time including summers. You won't regret it in the future.

You only live once, make the most of it. The 8 is worth the $30k. But don't drown yourself in debt, save some money, but don't be an ebeneezer either. Good luck! Downgrading from the M3 is the right move. I applaud you.

dmp

There are other ways to have doors open...and I agree with the last part; it's pretty lame to see society placing value on one area - one form of education (academia), yet there are people out there who have 'life education' a college simply can't replicate.

(sigh). It's the reason so many 'shady' degrees are to be found online...people want a piece of paper; to the point where what the paper actually MEANS is lost.

dmp

Excellent advice.

Rotary Nut

No, not really!

I have no University education and I'm making over $21 an hour! But then again I have 25 years experience under my belt.

Experience is worth more than a piece of paper my friend!

I for one would rather be out on the hanger floor turning a wrench instead of getting a case of brain drain sitting in front of a computer screen!

Frank Patrick

Stay in School!! Cars will always be there- don't cut yourself short- for the Gotta have now- deal. Finish your education--I know -sounds like the same lecture I got- way back-from my parents, I didn't listen either- wound up- drafted- did my time-and 2 tours-came back with a different perspective. That Mustang I droped out of college to pay for, all of sudden did not seem that important, I was just glad I made it back. I was amazed at how smart my parents got in 2 years, or maybe I just learned to appreciate their advice more- not sure.

SilverEIGHT

Nothing would make me happier than for "BMW Man" to come back online and say: Well guys, I’ve made my choice. I’m going to continue going to college and since I have a job too, I will drive my RX-8 to classes. :D

It hasn’t been that long ago that we helped “rx8wannahave” get back on track when he strayed from getting an 8 due to a bad experience. I can’t tell you how happy that made me. We are “family” (questionable word) and should endeavor to help make good decisions not just feel good decisions.

flip

with all this discussion... i was reminded of the next Apprentice show.. its gonna be book smarts vs. street smarts.. thought i'd share..

mysql101

Most jobs will want a degree OR equiv work experience.

I've been in the position of hiring people, and I can tell you that I'll take someone with work experience over a fresh college graduate ANYDAY.

The worse person I ever hired was straight out of college.

btw, I have no degree, I make about 40/hour in my full time job, and do contract work on the side, so easily 6 figures a year. However, nothing is guaranteed. Only a few years back I was struggling to find even a job that would pay $20. The job market constantly changes.

A degree only says "This person can be trained", I don't read more into it than that.

Nick

I have to say that a lot of the points made here in this thread hit home for me - I'm stuck right in the middle. I have a good job with good potential for experience, but I still want to finish school. I say want to, because at this point, I've got more of a responsibility to be out there working - I just got married this year, and have about 20 bills a month that I didn't have before I don't like to have budget numbers become public discussions, but if he feels $18 an hour translates into a $750/mo. car, or even a 2006 RX-8, then that is his decision. I have to say that no matter what you decide - school or not - the most important thing is to live within your means. Just because any given car payment falls within the amount that we bring home each month, doesn't mean it's going to be practical or even possible. One thing I've learned in 6 short months of marriage is that there is a huge difference between crunching the numbers and living the budget. And that the expenses will keep piling on, not falling off.

That new Apprentice show does pose an interesting question - I'd bet that about half of us here have made it through experience and work, and the other half through education. What the majority of (you) have in common, is that you've somehow become successful. The road you choose to take there is not tied exclusively to a college education - but the way you manage your budget is going to hint to how you will manage your life. Both WILL have a profound effect on your success, or lack of.

dmp

Excellent advice, too, Nick... :thup:

khtm

I'm guessing by all your anti-education comments that you don't have a degree? Sounds like a bit of jealousy to me.

dmp

Where I did I make anti-education comments? My comments addressed people's stated beliefs that 'college' = 'education'. I contend we can learn as much, or more about our world thru other means.

khtm

This comment is a bad generalization. Hiring is quite industry and position specific. There's no way in HELL you can get a job with an engineering firm as an engineer without an engineering degree (at least in Canada...I know your standards are lower down south). Similarly, there's no way in HELL you can get a job as a lawyer or a doctor (legitimately) without going to law school or medical school.

Sure, if you like the trades, want to run your own business, or like office administration, don't go to school - but if you want a real career where you'll never have a hard time finding a job, you better think again.

mysql101

Picking jobs like engineer and doctor/laywer are bad examples on your part. Of course they require a degree.

SilverEIGHT

I suspect that "BMW Man" is going to be quiet surprised when he gets home this evening and checks his thread out. He has quiet a good post but I don't think it is in the direction he wanted it to go. Can't wait to see what he has to say.

dmp

Excuse me, but you are coming across as a pompous *** with this line...I hope that's not what you meant.

khtm

I dunno. Maybe I'm mistaken. I agree that it does suck that society places such an emphasis on education, but maybe there's a reason for it. The major things I got out of 5 years of university was how to be *resourceful*, how to *learn*, and how to *cope with pressure*. I had 2 years of internship while going to school, so it's not like I came out all green, but I still realize the advantages I've been given after those 5 years.

There's a direct correlation between level of education and income. I guess it could be considered sad, but true? Maybe you've done well for yourself by not going to school, but many, many other people are not so lucky.

khtm

Hey, I'm making a generalization like everyone else. And yes, good call, I was being a pompous ***. It's -40 C here today and I'm grumpy

khtm

True, but I'm guessing that many people who own nice cars (M3s, RX-8s) probably have a "profession" rather than a "job". These are professional careers that I used as examples. Of course this is just a guess and I could be entirely wrong.

mysql101

I don't think it's that simple. I think there are more people who are driven to succeed and accomplish that attend college than those who don't. There are exceptions to the rule, but saying one equals the other isn't necessarily true. For example, there was a study that just came out that said people who slept longer tended to be less overweight. But sleeping more doesn't mean you lose weight. It might just be that being awake longer means you have more time to eat, or your body is suffering from more stress because of the lack of sleep and you don't process foods as well.

There are many ways to look at a situation.


I'm a software developer. Not sure where you place it in your list of profession vs job description, but I'd say it falls somewhere in between. Programming isn't just mechanical repetition, there is theory that should be learned, good programming style, code commenting, etc. College for it is good, but given that schools aren't always teaching the latest and greatest, I don't think it's absolutely required.