Mazda admits power deficiency!
#326
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: South Florida
Posts: 1,080
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This is not a flame, but wouldn't a performance-oriented buyer buy the car based on how it performs? To me this would necessitate a fairly rigorous test drive. If, after that, I was happy with the way it performs, I really don't need to know the exact horsepower. Hell, what is the real-world difference in performance between a car with 247 hp and one that has 238, or whatever it really has in this case. Is it much different that hauling a passenger around? Maybe even less.
I do think its embarrassing, and I'd be pissed about it too...scratch that, as a Mazda and rotary fan and owner (just not an 8, at least not yet) I am pissed and embarrassed....but more so because I have to take crap from owners of other cars now, and because of any potential negative impact on the future of rotary sports cars. That said...I don't see people avoiding Cobras or Miatas, and they had the same issues. I just greatly preferred being on "ha ha laugh at the other guy" end of it :-D
jds
I do think its embarrassing, and I'd be pissed about it too...scratch that, as a Mazda and rotary fan and owner (just not an 8, at least not yet) I am pissed and embarrassed....but more so because I have to take crap from owners of other cars now, and because of any potential negative impact on the future of rotary sports cars. That said...I don't see people avoiding Cobras or Miatas, and they had the same issues. I just greatly preferred being on "ha ha laugh at the other guy" end of it :-D
jds
#327
Registered User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Little Rock
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Re: jims
Originally posted by zthang
The base price of the Z starts at just under $27k...whats the base price of the 8 b/c i don't know? I did a comparo awhile back when i was choosing between the 2 cars of the Z and the 8 with similar options on their websites, and both cars came out to be about the same price: which was about $30k (albeit the Z comes w/a bit more ponies and the 8 a few more seats :D ) But aside from styling, for the same price, are the 2 seats and "refined" interior worth the now ~50hp advantage that the Z has?? If you owners are ok with that then kudos to you, but I wanted an 8 at one point, and yes i'm a performance oriented buyer. So after this revelation from Mazda, I would think again about buying this car personally. Don't flame me, this is just MY opinion, and I think a lot of people here are just too nice. If Nissan pulled this on us Z owners....I for one would be BI*&#ing for my ponies back to the end!!
The base price of the Z starts at just under $27k...whats the base price of the 8 b/c i don't know? I did a comparo awhile back when i was choosing between the 2 cars of the Z and the 8 with similar options on their websites, and both cars came out to be about the same price: which was about $30k (albeit the Z comes w/a bit more ponies and the 8 a few more seats :D ) But aside from styling, for the same price, are the 2 seats and "refined" interior worth the now ~50hp advantage that the Z has?? If you owners are ok with that then kudos to you, but I wanted an 8 at one point, and yes i'm a performance oriented buyer. So after this revelation from Mazda, I would think again about buying this car personally. Don't flame me, this is just MY opinion, and I think a lot of people here are just too nice. If Nissan pulled this on us Z owners....I for one would be BI*&#ing for my ponies back to the end!!
Frankly, I probably would have gone for the Z in the first place if not for the need for a back seat. Comparing the Z to the 8 is comparing apples to oranges in my book, since the Z is not an option for me given my requirements. If you are a "performance oriented buyer," there are so many more options than the 8 even if it had 270 hp.
#328
Forum Vendor
There are a lotof ways to compare this:
Power to weight, for example:
350Z Track Pack: 287hp / 3226lbs = 11.24 lb/hp
RX-8 with 247hp: 247hp / 3046lbs = 12.33 lb/hp
RX-8 with 238hp: 238 / 3046 = 12.79 lb/hp
RX-8 with 228hp: 228 / 3046 = 13.36 lb/hp
Therefore, to get the same acceleration figures from the RX-8 as the 350Z we would need to have 271hp.
Without getting into the math, the quarter mile times for the 350Z compared to the RX-8 support a power level of around 220hp for the RX-8.
Or, to put it as $ per hp, using Canadian $ and prices:
350Z Track Pack: $45,400 $158.19 per hp
RX-8 6MT - GT 247hp: $39,995 $161.92 per hp
RX-8 6MT - GT 238hp: $39,995 $168.05 per hp
RX-8 6MT - GT 228hp: $39,995 $175.42 per hp
BTW, I got the 228hp from the euro spec claim of 230ps as sold in Germany and UK.
230ps = 228hp
Looking at 228hp at the engine, and 17% loss, we would get 189hp, which is in the range of what people are seeing on a dyno.
With Mazda you can choose what power rating you want, just by going to different Mazda websites.
Canada, USA, Germany, UK, Japan, Italy, are all different:
247,238,228,228,247,240
Power to weight, for example:
350Z Track Pack: 287hp / 3226lbs = 11.24 lb/hp
RX-8 with 247hp: 247hp / 3046lbs = 12.33 lb/hp
RX-8 with 238hp: 238 / 3046 = 12.79 lb/hp
RX-8 with 228hp: 228 / 3046 = 13.36 lb/hp
Therefore, to get the same acceleration figures from the RX-8 as the 350Z we would need to have 271hp.
Without getting into the math, the quarter mile times for the 350Z compared to the RX-8 support a power level of around 220hp for the RX-8.
Or, to put it as $ per hp, using Canadian $ and prices:
350Z Track Pack: $45,400 $158.19 per hp
RX-8 6MT - GT 247hp: $39,995 $161.92 per hp
RX-8 6MT - GT 238hp: $39,995 $168.05 per hp
RX-8 6MT - GT 228hp: $39,995 $175.42 per hp
BTW, I got the 228hp from the euro spec claim of 230ps as sold in Germany and UK.
230ps = 228hp
Looking at 228hp at the engine, and 17% loss, we would get 189hp, which is in the range of what people are seeing on a dyno.
With Mazda you can choose what power rating you want, just by going to different Mazda websites.
Canada, USA, Germany, UK, Japan, Italy, are all different:
247,238,228,228,247,240
#329
Coming thru in waves...
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Somewhere between Yesterday and Tomorrow.
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by kidmarc
I believe you misunderstood... I stated that you should get all of the facts first before you make a move to your respective positions. There exists no speculation in that.
Peace
marcus
I believe you misunderstood... I stated that you should get all of the facts first before you make a move to your respective positions. There exists no speculation in that.
Peace
marcus
Yeah, peace.
I'm trying to be as forgiving as I can be with Mazda. I'm an engineer and I know that things totally unexpected can come up just like this.
Lets say they had the ecu mapped for the NA reg's. and for some reason, when they were shipped with that mapping, the epa test all of the sudden failed! Hundreds of RX8's sitting portside, confined due to failed epa test results! They did a quick fix by a less-than-optimum re-mapping that got the cars out of port & into the hands of the proud owners. Great, except, now the final fix still needs to be done. Meawhile, those proud new owners got bad mpg & bad rwhp numbers & this spread like wildfire & the doggon final fix has still not surfaced!!!!
In my opinion, this scenario is really not too far fetched. Hard to believe, sure. Unforgivable? Well....easy for some to say. Final fix never gonna happen? Well....easy for some to say. I say it's coming when it's ready & it's going to be "something wonderful!"
All speculation though.
Funny, 22 pages of nothing but speculation, my posts included, cuz... Budaman said the letters will be mailed-out tomorrow. Cheez. The letters haven't even been mailed yet.
Budaman got the short-n-sweet by someone in the know and the subtleties of the deal that show Mazda's true colors could have been left out for mere brevity. This is the same company that has been showering its RX-8 pre-orderers with unexpected gifts of gratitude. Now look at us...
Once again kidmarc, I liked your post. Peace!
I sure hope for everyones sake (except for those who feed upon this type of thing) that Mazda will treat us like they have already.
#330
Ok, I'll provide an argument for the "minimal" difference of hp between 247 vs 238...
I ask, how many here in the long term plan on upgrading exhaust, intake, headers, ecu and such? Basic bolt-ons to make it simple.
Sure it is no different now with 238 than it was a couple days ago with 247. But I wont be surprised when 6 months down the road, people here would be bolting on performance enhancements trying to inch more and more power out the rotary. More importantly, trying to make it "perform" better than in stock form.
Wouldnt you want to work with a strong foundation from the beginning?
But hey, for those who don't plan on not changing anything, it would still be fun to drive no matter the hp number right? Even in the long run and while hauling 4 adults?
I ask, how many here in the long term plan on upgrading exhaust, intake, headers, ecu and such? Basic bolt-ons to make it simple.
Sure it is no different now with 238 than it was a couple days ago with 247. But I wont be surprised when 6 months down the road, people here would be bolting on performance enhancements trying to inch more and more power out the rotary. More importantly, trying to make it "perform" better than in stock form.
Wouldnt you want to work with a strong foundation from the beginning?
But hey, for those who don't plan on not changing anything, it would still be fun to drive no matter the hp number right? Even in the long run and while hauling 4 adults?
#331
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
On the fence
I'm definatey on the fence right now. Should I take the buy back or the money and service? That is the question.
I love the car, I look forward to driving it everyday. It's a great car and I've had no complaints so far.
However, I got home Saturday afternoon and there was one message on the answering machine; it was the sales person I worked with. He briefly explained the offer in the message, but left out the real meat of why he called. My stomach sunk, because I knew deep down what it was about.
I do feel that car value is a question now, is $1500 or so enough? How can I justify the expense of this vehicle when it is very apparent that I paid for more performance than I actually got? Heck, the dyno results posted on this board suggest it's even more of a power deficiency than 9HP.
I'm trying not to be rash, hopefully a good nights sleep will keep from leaning towards the buy back. In the end I want the car, but the economics tell me I overpaid.
I'll be interested to see how this plays out over the next week, I won't make a decision until I receive the letter from Mazda.
Love the board, glad to see Mazda has at least reacted.
I love the car, I look forward to driving it everyday. It's a great car and I've had no complaints so far.
However, I got home Saturday afternoon and there was one message on the answering machine; it was the sales person I worked with. He briefly explained the offer in the message, but left out the real meat of why he called. My stomach sunk, because I knew deep down what it was about.
I do feel that car value is a question now, is $1500 or so enough? How can I justify the expense of this vehicle when it is very apparent that I paid for more performance than I actually got? Heck, the dyno results posted on this board suggest it's even more of a power deficiency than 9HP.
I'm trying not to be rash, hopefully a good nights sleep will keep from leaning towards the buy back. In the end I want the car, but the economics tell me I overpaid.
I'll be interested to see how this plays out over the next week, I won't make a decision until I receive the letter from Mazda.
Love the board, glad to see Mazda has at least reacted.
#332
Hubble has been saved!
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Richmond, VA
Posts: 1,221
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: spin doctor
Originally posted by canzoomer
To put it simply, the RX-8 performs similarly to a 2.2l turbo MX-6 GT Turbo. That is a car with a 2.2l engine making a rated power level of 145 and torque of 180
Top speed and acceleration are almost identical to my RX-8.
To put it simply, the RX-8 performs similarly to a 2.2l turbo MX-6 GT Turbo. That is a car with a 2.2l engine making a rated power level of 145 and torque of 180
Top speed and acceleration are almost identical to my RX-8.
Also, doesn't the MX-6 only weigh around 2,600 lbs vs the RX-8's 3,000 lbs?
#333
- Senior Menber -
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Melbourne,AU
Posts: 556
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Personaly, for 8 or 9 HP, give them a break!
Are you happy with the car? Obviously the people who are going to let mazda buy the car back have either realised the debt they created and/or are not true rotary followers.
My rx-8 is my 5th mazda and 3rd rotary i've owned, I have a following and didnt just jump on the next "how to be cool" band wagon.
Comments from Australia...where the HP has always been 238.
Are you happy with the car? Obviously the people who are going to let mazda buy the car back have either realised the debt they created and/or are not true rotary followers.
My rx-8 is my 5th mazda and 3rd rotary i've owned, I have a following and didnt just jump on the next "how to be cool" band wagon.
Comments from Australia...where the HP has always been 238.
#334
Registered
interesting read
this link http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/fe...5scc_mazdarx8/ has a good review of the rx-8 and mentions the power port sticking when it was dyno'd and how the car was taken away from them when this was found out. all apologies if this link has already been posted.
#335
Re: Re: Re: jims
Originally posted by Zaphod
Frankly, I probably would have gone for the Z in the first place if not for the need for a back seat. Comparing the Z to the 8 is comparing apples to oranges in my book, since the Z is not an option for me given my requirements. If you are a "performance oriented buyer," there are so many more options than the 8 even if it had 270 hp.
Frankly, I probably would have gone for the Z in the first place if not for the need for a back seat. Comparing the Z to the 8 is comparing apples to oranges in my book, since the Z is not an option for me given my requirements. If you are a "performance oriented buyer," there are so many more options than the 8 even if it had 270 hp.
The RX-8 seems to be good mix of sedan, coupe, and sports car. I believe there were many that cross-shopped the RX-8 in every one of these categories.
If I wanted a true sedan, I wouldn't even considered the RX-8. At one time, a little over a year ago, I was leaning that way. On my short list was a BMW330, G35 Sedan, Audi S4, and a Saab S-93.
Then that tastes progressed to a coupe - BMW 330ci or a G35c. More sporty styling than the sedan, but still have a rear seat.
Now if I would have wanted a more "performance orientated" car, I would have looked into something more in the lines of a Porsche, 350Z, S2000, a 'Vette or even something like a Mustang.
Now when the RX-8 came along, it seemed like a great compromise of all those categories. Sedan because it had a rear seat I wanted. A coupe because of it's look when the clamshell door are closed. A sports car with it's looks and its combination of performance and handling. And of course, I figure in another factor - affordability. Ideal for me.
The bottom line is that Zaphod, myself, and a number of people here, probably would have chosen something other than the RX-8 if our "requirements" was strictly a sedan, coupe or performance car. Because of it's styling & features, the RX-8 offered a compromising combination of all three, and that was the reason we bought it. At least for me it was. So this is why I'm not as disappointed as some because of the minus 9HP. I bought the car for more than performance alone. But I do understand and sympathize for those that feel cheated in the area of performance of this car.
Last edited by RX-8 Zoomster; 08-24-2003 at 11:59 PM.
#336
Registered User
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: NY
Posts: 347
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This is kind of off subject (maybe budaman can answer this), I need to know who I can contact so Mazda sends my letter to the right address. I'm in the military and recently moved. My last address will probably have no forward. Who would I have to call to make sure the letter arrives at my new home?
#337
Re: Re: Re: jims
Originally posted by Zaphod
So as a "performance oriented buyer" you wanted something with 247, but 238 is unacceptable? Or is it just that you were misled regardless of the numbers? Just curious.
So as a "performance oriented buyer" you wanted something with 247, but 238 is unacceptable? Or is it just that you were misled regardless of the numbers? Just curious.
By the way...i'm not just some hp junkie...i looked closely at handling/skidpad numbers, 0-60-100 times etc...i would take the rx8 with only 238hp in a heartbeat if it could do what the s2000 does with 240hp. Now thats worth $30k
#338
Please, the fact that current owners have test driven the car before buying hardly acquits Mazda in this situation.
Before the declared power output revision, the RX-8 was 'deceptively fast,' with the lack of a distinct feel of power being chalked up to 'the inherent smoothness of the rotary,' 'super linear power delivery,' 'a flat torque curve,' et cetera. These kinds of comments, repeatedly posted on this forum by test drivers, were made in good faith that, despite the feel, the RX-8 really does offer S2000/WRX/350Z/etc. performance in a unique package.
Now we are finding out that, frankly, it was all bullshit and that we should have trusted the seat of our pants a bit more. That Best Motoring video posted earlier this summer was the first clue that something was wrong -- the car was soundly beaten by supposedly comparable cars like the S2000, Integra Type R, WRX, and G35 Coupe, and we heard talk about 'green' engines, bad driver, and similar tripe.
The fact of the matter is that the RX-8 offers a level of performance on par with that of vehicles costing thousands of dollars less -- with more time for people to properly break in their 8's and pass the 'must baby it' stage, the truth would have come out sooner or later, anyway. The RX-8 is a nice 4-seater with sporty styling, but it is FAR from being the groundbreaking 'practical sports car' that was anticipated. Not with RSX Type S-level performance.
Also, considering the fact that the RX-8 currently dynos anywhere from 15-20rwhp under the 240hp S2000, one should seriously doubt the validity of the restated numbers.
Before the declared power output revision, the RX-8 was 'deceptively fast,' with the lack of a distinct feel of power being chalked up to 'the inherent smoothness of the rotary,' 'super linear power delivery,' 'a flat torque curve,' et cetera. These kinds of comments, repeatedly posted on this forum by test drivers, were made in good faith that, despite the feel, the RX-8 really does offer S2000/WRX/350Z/etc. performance in a unique package.
Now we are finding out that, frankly, it was all bullshit and that we should have trusted the seat of our pants a bit more. That Best Motoring video posted earlier this summer was the first clue that something was wrong -- the car was soundly beaten by supposedly comparable cars like the S2000, Integra Type R, WRX, and G35 Coupe, and we heard talk about 'green' engines, bad driver, and similar tripe.
The fact of the matter is that the RX-8 offers a level of performance on par with that of vehicles costing thousands of dollars less -- with more time for people to properly break in their 8's and pass the 'must baby it' stage, the truth would have come out sooner or later, anyway. The RX-8 is a nice 4-seater with sporty styling, but it is FAR from being the groundbreaking 'practical sports car' that was anticipated. Not with RSX Type S-level performance.
Also, considering the fact that the RX-8 currently dynos anywhere from 15-20rwhp under the 240hp S2000, one should seriously doubt the validity of the restated numbers.
#339
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: The 1999 Cobra SVT debacle
I searched the internet for information about the Cobra debacle, and I posted my results here:
http://www.rx8forum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9522
I hope I did not post that in the wrong forum. My apologies to the admins if I did...
http://www.rx8forum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9522
I hope I did not post that in the wrong forum. My apologies to the admins if I did...
#340
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: South Florida
Posts: 1,080
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I realize you're trying to make a point, but nowhere in my post which you seem to be responding to did I even remotely suggest this.
I can't really argue with anything else you have said, though. I think we differ on the conclusions that are to be drawn perhaps.
jds
I can't really argue with anything else you have said, though. I think we differ on the conclusions that are to be drawn perhaps.
jds
Originally posted by mashoutposse00
Please, the fact that current owners have test driven the car before buying hardly acquits Mazda in this situation.
Please, the fact that current owners have test driven the car before buying hardly acquits Mazda in this situation.
#341
Originally posted by mashoutposse00
Now we are finding out that, frankly, it was all bullshit and that we should have trusted the seat of our pants a bit more. That Best Motoring video posted earlier this summer was the first clue that something was wrong -- the car was soundly beaten by supposedly comparable cars like the S2000, Integra Type R, WRX, and G35 Coupe, and we heard talk about 'green' engines, bad driver, and similar tripe.
Now we are finding out that, frankly, it was all bullshit and that we should have trusted the seat of our pants a bit more. That Best Motoring video posted earlier this summer was the first clue that something was wrong -- the car was soundly beaten by supposedly comparable cars like the S2000, Integra Type R, WRX, and G35 Coupe, and we heard talk about 'green' engines, bad driver, and similar tripe.
I, too, believe that the power deficiency is closer to 15-20 hp. But I am glad to see that Mazda is trying to maintain a loyal customer base with its offer. Kudos for that at least.
#342
Originally posted by bureau13
I realize you're trying to make a point, but nowhere in my post which you seem to be responding to did I even remotely suggest this.
I can't really argue with anything else you have said, though. I think we differ on the conclusions that are to be drawn perhaps.
jds
I realize you're trying to make a point, but nowhere in my post which you seem to be responding to did I even remotely suggest this.
I can't really argue with anything else you have said, though. I think we differ on the conclusions that are to be drawn perhaps.
jds
#343
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Germany
Posts: 63
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Mazda admits power deficiency!
Originally posted by eccles
This just in:
Just got a phone call from budaman, who had just got off a conference call with MNAO. Apparently they are revising the RX-8 horsepower figures: the Manual is being revised down 3.6% to 238hp, and the Auto down 4.5% to 197hp.
Anyone who has already purchased an RX-8 will be receiving a letter from Mazda offering two alternatives:[list=1][*]Mazda will buy back the car. (He didn't have the full details - they'll be in the letter.)[*]Mazda will provide free scheduled servicing for the duration of the standard warranty plus a $500 debit card.[/list=1] Basically the same deal that they offered after the 2001 Miata was found to be down on power too. Owners will have 30 days to decide.
Personally, I'm amazed that they repeated such a basic blunder, but I know which of the options I'll be taking (and it ain't "return the car" ).
(budaman would have posted this himself but his 'net connection is down.)
This just in:
Just got a phone call from budaman, who had just got off a conference call with MNAO. Apparently they are revising the RX-8 horsepower figures: the Manual is being revised down 3.6% to 238hp, and the Auto down 4.5% to 197hp.
Anyone who has already purchased an RX-8 will be receiving a letter from Mazda offering two alternatives:[list=1][*]Mazda will buy back the car. (He didn't have the full details - they'll be in the letter.)[*]Mazda will provide free scheduled servicing for the duration of the standard warranty plus a $500 debit card.[/list=1] Basically the same deal that they offered after the 2001 Miata was found to be down on power too. Owners will have 30 days to decide.
Personally, I'm amazed that they repeated such a basic blunder, but I know which of the options I'll be taking (and it ain't "return the car" ).
(budaman would have posted this himself but his 'net connection is down.)
FWIW
#344
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Fair Oaks, Cali
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by Racer X-8
All speculation though.
Funny, 22 pages of nothing but speculation, my posts included, cuz... Budaman said the letters will be mailed-out tomorrow. Cheez. The letters haven't even been mailed yet.
All speculation though.
Funny, 22 pages of nothing but speculation, my posts included, cuz... Budaman said the letters will be mailed-out tomorrow. Cheez. The letters haven't even been mailed yet.
"The sky is falling"
#345
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Morristown Tennessee
Posts: 140
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Re: Mazda admits power deficiency!
Originally posted by Werner
-Optimistic pre-announcements and when the truth comes out. marketing refuses to have the numbers adjusted according to reality because they are afraid of lower sales.
FWIW
-Optimistic pre-announcements and when the truth comes out. marketing refuses to have the numbers adjusted according to reality because they are afraid of lower sales.
FWIW
#346
Re: Re: jims
what options were you choosing when you compared the two in price? When I do the same, Z comes out to be >2k higher. I find that I'd have to lose a lot in the Z to get an near equal price.
Originally posted by zthang
The base price of the Z starts at just under $27k...whats the base price of the 8 b/c i don't know? I did a comparo awhile back when i was choosing between the 2 cars of the Z and the 8 with similar options on their websites, and both cars came out to be about the same price: which was about $30k (albeit the Z comes w/a bit more ponies and the 8 a few more seats :D ) But aside from styling, for the same price, are the 2 seats and "refined" interior worth the now ~50hp advantage that the Z has?? If you owners are ok with that then kudos to you, but I wanted an 8 at one point, and yes i'm a performance oriented buyer. So after this revelation from Mazda, I would think again about buying this car personally. Don't flame me, this is just MY opinion, and I think a lot of people here are just too nice. If Nissan pulled this on us Z owners....I for one would be BI*&#ing for my ponies back to the end!!
The base price of the Z starts at just under $27k...whats the base price of the 8 b/c i don't know? I did a comparo awhile back when i was choosing between the 2 cars of the Z and the 8 with similar options on their websites, and both cars came out to be about the same price: which was about $30k (albeit the Z comes w/a bit more ponies and the 8 a few more seats :D ) But aside from styling, for the same price, are the 2 seats and "refined" interior worth the now ~50hp advantage that the Z has?? If you owners are ok with that then kudos to you, but I wanted an 8 at one point, and yes i'm a performance oriented buyer. So after this revelation from Mazda, I would think again about buying this car personally. Don't flame me, this is just MY opinion, and I think a lot of people here are just too nice. If Nissan pulled this on us Z owners....I for one would be BI*&#ing for my ponies back to the end!!
#347
Re: Re: jims
Originally posted by zthang
The base price of the Z starts at just under $27k...whats the base price of the 8 b/c i don't know? I did a comparo awhile back when i was choosing between the 2 cars of the Z and the 8 with similar options on their websites, and both cars came out to be about the same price: which was about $30k (albeit the Z comes w/a bit more ponies and the 8 a few more seats :D ) But aside from styling, for the same price, are the 2 seats and "refined" interior worth the now ~50hp advantage that the Z has?? If you owners are ok with that then kudos to you, but I wanted an 8 at one point, and yes i'm a performance oriented buyer. So after this revelation from Mazda, I would think again about buying this car personally. Don't flame me, this is just MY opinion, and I think a lot of people here are just too nice. If Nissan pulled this on us Z owners....I for one would be BI*&#ing for my ponies back to the end!!
The base price of the Z starts at just under $27k...whats the base price of the 8 b/c i don't know? I did a comparo awhile back when i was choosing between the 2 cars of the Z and the 8 with similar options on their websites, and both cars came out to be about the same price: which was about $30k (albeit the Z comes w/a bit more ponies and the 8 a few more seats :D ) But aside from styling, for the same price, are the 2 seats and "refined" interior worth the now ~50hp advantage that the Z has?? If you owners are ok with that then kudos to you, but I wanted an 8 at one point, and yes i'm a performance oriented buyer. So after this revelation from Mazda, I would think again about buying this car personally. Don't flame me, this is just MY opinion, and I think a lot of people here are just too nice. If Nissan pulled this on us Z owners....I for one would be BI*&#ing for my ponies back to the end!!
Last edited by graphicguy; 08-25-2003 at 07:06 AM.
#348
Registered
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Louisville, CO
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: spin doctor
Originally posted by canzoomer
Kind of like ordering a 16 oz. T-Bone steak dinner in a restaurant and getting a 12 oz. steak.
It tastes good, it is a nice meal, it just is short a bit from what I ordered.
If that happened in a restaurant they would not get off by offering me a free drink.
Kind of like ordering a 16 oz. T-Bone steak dinner in a restaurant and getting a 12 oz. steak.
It tastes good, it is a nice meal, it just is short a bit from what I ordered.
If that happened in a restaurant they would not get off by offering me a free drink.
Really, what more do you want? (I shouldn't ask that in today's society, someone is sure to sue saying they want compensation for the mental anguish of being forced to drive such a wimpy car, plus mental duress because their friends who own S2000s are now making fun of them.)
In short:
1) If you own an RX-8 and are unhappy with the HP or numbers, return it for a full refund.
2) If you like your car, keep it and take the credit and maintenance.
3) If you haven't bought one yet and are upset by the situation, DON'T BUY ONE. Don't whine here, it doesn't do any good. Write a letter to Mazda if you like telling them why you won't buy an 8; they're not reading your message here. Don't talk about how this will bankrupt Mazda; most buyers don't know/care about what's happened here and even fewer have heard about the Miata fiasco.
Why is this so difficult?
Last edited by BillK; 08-25-2003 at 07:08 AM.
#349
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Personally, I feel the power generated is considerabley below even the 238 admitted horses. I passed someone yesterday on a two lane highway and was wondering if I was EVER gonna get past him........just no power surge after 7,000 rpm.
If this offer is legit and not just internet gossip, then Mazda can have this car back. I'll wait for the MazdaSpeed version of the RX8 or new RX7.
If this offer is legit and not just internet gossip, then Mazda can have this car back. I'll wait for the MazdaSpeed version of the RX8 or new RX7.
#350
Talked to Mazda, sounds like they are offering good compensation for this! I found out that the $500 is in the form of a Mastercard that can be used anywhere. I have to take them up on this, doesn't change the fact that I love my RX-8!!!! They said that they mailed letters to all of the rx-8 owners on friday that will give instruction on how to opt for this deal!!!!