R&T rated the Corvette at 12.9 mpg. Wow—imagine how many more Vettes they could sell if they could just get that damn number up!

 

I don't know about you guys but in the past few months i've seen to many 8's on the road =(

 

when i vist my home town (okinawa) every year i see alot of 8's. i m wondring is UK big on 8 to?

 

It's not a question of advertising. It's a question of marketing. Marketing is about creating a want/need/desire where none exists. As in does anyone really need 300hp? But marketing makes you feel inadequate/lacking if you don't have it.

Advertising is about creating awareness. This thread referred to marketing and not advertising, so your blue in the face comment is irrelevant.

The balance of your post is also irrelevant. For instance, we should consider war in Iraq to be a debacle. Hp downgrade to meet cafe emmissions is an annoyance and damage control had to be invoked to mitigate the situation, but in the end no one was hurt.

As much as the 8 has going against it, it has as much (if not more) going for it. Please refrain from overtly displaying your dislike of the 8 at every opportunity. If it is not in the scope of your comprension to realize that there are those of us who enjoy our cars regardless of your opinion. So why beat a dead horse?

Sales success does not necessarily mean a better product. It merely means that the manufacturer has a better refined marketing program, bigger advertising budget, more efficient distribution system, etc.

The Z is an unqualified success for various reasons - one of which may or may not be that it is a better car. Most of the automotive press seems to think that the 8 is a better car (as do I).

The fact that you highlight Gran Tourismo players as a market for the WRX is certainly interesting. It is interesting that Subaru choses to market to the videogame demographic. Perhaps that is the reason that Subaru has chosen to take its proven turbo engine and put it into a boy-racer car body?

In any event, if you have a WRX, we respect your opinion and your purchase. There is really no reason to toot your horn at at every opportunity. Again, I think the horse has been beaten to death.

Lastly, someone said that there are people who love cars and people who love driving. It is an important distinction and the two are not one in the same. For the most part, RX-8 owners love driving. The other group tends to talk about hp, 0-60, 1/4 mile, lateral acceleration, etc. Your constant beating of the hp drum is tiresome since it falls on mostly deaf ears. We love the driving experience and not being carted from 0-60 in 3.9 sec.

To prove a point, I'd take a Boxster over a Z any day...... but wait, it's down on hp vs the Z. Maybe I should shun the Boxster....... it cant keep up with a turbo Neon.

 

Is that the same Vette with 500hp?

 

There is no way that's true. The Vette gets better gas mileage than the 8 even @400 horses.

 

good read btw /bow

 

Corvette Coupe, 400hp, 3/05 comparative test.

 

I don't know if it's already been said, because I'm not reading through 3 pages of stuff, but I like the fact that my car is "rare".

If mazda never sold another RX-8, I wouldn't be upset. I live in texas, which is the land of mustangs, and I swear to god if I don't see a mustang every 15 feet.

I don't want to be like everyone else, I want to be different.

I like the fact that I see maybe 1 or 2 RX-8's a week, not 537.

The evo and the WRX don't interest me. You're paying out the *** for amazing engines and AWD systems shoved in a **** body. Maybe I'm getting old, but I'll give up some horsepower/torque to ride in style.

The 350z is a nice car, but they're like mustangs here in texas, plus they seem kinda porky. When I ride in my friends Z I can't help but feel it needs to go on a diet.

 

yah i live in the beaumont area of texas. on my way home from work i tend to count how many mustangs that pass me by.

 

Yes, let's remember that often—due in part to marketing—the best choice isn't the most popular. (As someone recently said regarding the last presidential election, "it was like a normal person losing the Special Olympics." )

 

people who say the rx8 fails simply cause of HP and 'faster cars' 'cheaper' etc, to me are missing the whole point of the car. the car will never appeal to people who judge cars only by those methods. That is what most judge cars by, thus, making the 8 and rotaries, niche cars.

thats why those who make those statements don't really bother me, its just tells me that the car's not for them. dont get me wrong, id love a tad more uuppmph, but really, its no big deal. REally. the car is balanced as it is and plenty fun for me.

 

I'd love for you to explain to me how you can have a marketing campaign without advertising. Plus, the thread title may have referenced marketing but a commercial and an advertisement was clearly used as an example in the original post.

After the horsepower revisions the reputation of the RX-8 was hurt, it was also widely talked about because many people believed the revised horsepower was also generous. It was not a good thing for the reputation of the RX-8 and is a big part of why it's branded as slow by many people. If you think having a car that was initially rumored at 280hp, then 250hp, then 247hp, then 238hp, and now 232hp is a debacle then you're entitled to your opinion, but I disagree.

I'm not quite sure how you managed to twist around what I said into me saying the RX-8 doesn't have a lot going for it. Please point out one single thing in my post that would indicate I have a dislike for the RX-8. The RX-8 absolutely does have a lot going for it, but it has detractors that other cars do not. Apparently it is not "it is not in the scope of your comprension to realize" that my post is simply pointing possible reasons why the RX-8 has poor sales. I fully realize why RX-8 owners enjoy the car since I enjoy the car for the very same reasons. However, the average american isn't going to care nor realize on a testdrive that it can "take em in the twisties".

Not once did I say the WRX or 350Z is a better product than the RX-8 so I'm not sure why you're pointing that out. I was pointing out some of the reasons for their sales success compared to the RX-8. Being in the business I am, I am fully aware that often inferior products sell much better than superior ones.

Subaru didn't choose to market to the video game generation, that appeal was created by the video game and Subaru reaped the rewards. The WRX existed long before playstation, however the average american kid had never heard of it, nor the Skyline, nor the Evo, until Gran Turismo made its debut. Everyone under the age of 35 could be considered the video game generation, it's a huge demographic, make a product that greatly appeals to those generations and you'll be doing pretty well for yourself. Subaru didn't decide to put their turbo engine in the Impreza, they decided to bring a model that had existed in other markets for 10+ years to North America.

I no longer own a WRX, and it's quite clear to me you don't respect my opinion with the way you have nitpicked and twisted around what I said. I fail to see how pointing out that the WRX was a sales success it tooting my own horn. It was a car that Subaru thought they could sell 10,000 units of a year, they ended up selling over 3 times that. The release of the Evo and STI were a direct result of the WRX. The WRX was also most likely a big part of why you see so many special model sport compacts in the market today.

You're defending against something that isn't there, and making points that don't go against anything I've said. The horsepower issue absolutely doesn't fall on deaf ears, your defensiveness indicates quite the opposite as does the talk on various car forums. If you don't think sales are affected by horsepower numbers with the average consumer then you're delusional. What's the first thing a stranger says about your car in regards to how it drives, I know I always get asked "how fast is it?", it's never "how well does it handle?". It may be a flaw in the average American's thinking, but that flaw shouldn't be ignored by car companies when they're trying to sell a car.

Lastly, I don't know many people that wouldn't wanted to be "carted from 0-60 in 3.9 seconds". A large part of the sales success of past rotaries has to do with the fact that it could out accelerate its competition (the 924 and 280Z), same goes for the FC when you compare it to the competition. Sure they handled well and they revved high, but one of the biggest reasons they sold so well was because you got more bang for your buck. Whether you're talking a bottle of wine, a dinner out, or a car, people love the thought of getting more for less. It's the reason why Yellowtail sells so well compared to a great Brunello, and Chili's is more popular than that great little French restaurant. Quality over quantity isn't something people can wrap their brains around.

Every once in a while you can get both quality and quantity, and I think the Z is just that. Overall the RX-8 may be a better car, but like that bottle of Yellowtail compared to some higher quality yet more obscure wine, the average consumer will never realize it

 

The reason its not about horsepower... Miata!
At almost exactly the same time as the RX8 HP "debacle" (or whatever you wanna call it), the miata had the same problem. Did it affect miata sales in any way? No, it's still the best-selling (real) sports car on the planet. Same manufacturer, same problem of overestimatng HP, no impact on sales.

Regarding marketing, the fact that the rotary is soooooooo rare is an issue that could be overcome if Mazda would start making other cars with rotary engines, or licensing the technology to other manufacturers. The fact that Mazda themselves only make ONE rotary car is part of the problem - it gives the perception that it's still experimental, even for them.

Personally, I'd like to see them make an AWD hybrid rotary-engined 4 seater sports coupe with a retractable hard-top, 300+ HP, and 40MPG, for under $20k

 

My mistake, let me just review so I have it straight.

Vette 400hp, 0-60 mph low 4 sec (12.6 mpg)

RX-8 222hp, 0-60 mph 6.1 sec (13.6 mpg)

hmmmm.......

 

I think they could definitly do more to market the car, but a serious flaw in the car is definitly its percieved last of performance. As a proud Winning Blue owner, I still look at the radio when a Camaro SS or WS6 Trans-Am roll up next to me, I know those cars would rip me a new one. Does it make my choice a bad one? Not at all, it's just different tastes for everyone. I can appreciate a car that will rip your head off in the quarter mile, or stoplight to stoplight, or one that handles like a shifter kart, but I made my choice. I agree that other things can/should be added to the car (turbo), but those are things that the aftermarket can handle.

 

Hm to tackle the main question or another subject that has risen out from this threat hmmm.......

See I believe the Rx-8 was and is marketed properly, its a niche car as many have said. Either you like it or you hate it. Should Mazda attempt to break the Rx-8 outa its niche yeah they should if they wish to see sales explode but to do so they'll need to conquer the gas mileage and horsepower issues. If all else the gas mileage, imagine Mazda marketing their "sports car" with 30mpg? Right now the mainstream is looking at Mpg not horsepower as it was 2 years ago.

The Mustang is still selling mainly because it has a cult like following if you will and will always sell Mpg or not (that and I love the new body style myself), the Rx-8 to me doesnt have that cult like following, it does have a following as evidence of this board but you dont hear people bidding to purchase the first car off the assembly line of a special model (Watched Barret Jackson Auction off a Ford GT with a option to buy one of the first 100 Shelby Mustangs, the bidding jumped up another 50k).

Now on the WRX comment I read about Gran Turismo. Subaru paid Sony to produce a special demo of the game to feature their cars with a special arcade'sh rig, it traveled around the country/world to show off their cars especialy the WRX/STI. I went to two autoshows and at both shows Subaru had their arcade rig there and people from 13-30 were lined up. Did this help sales who's to say but it did expose the car(s) to a audience to whom might of just ignored the car all together. Imagine if Mazda did something similar and hence expose the car to a larger audience?

Oh also, racing is picking up popularity again thanks to Nascar (love it or hate it folks its popular), if Mazda could publisize their Rx-8 wins in magazines and oh I dont know say put the 6 in Nascar (I know evil but its already helping Toyota) even more people will take notice at Mazda. More people who take notice the more they'll go into the dealerships and notice that nice lil awsome sports car and say "Hmm whats that..".

'eh I dont know I'm rambling now I believe but I made the points I wanted to make so I'm out.

 

Unfortunatley, Mazda has never been very good about advertising any of their cars. I work at a Mazda dealership and I am always bitching to district reps about the lack of advertising. Seems all the advertising bucks are spent by Ford for the most part. The RX-8 was named best sports car numerous times, did Mazda jump on it? No. The RX-8 demographic is around 35 years of age, income of 75k plus and someone who steers from the norm. Similar demographic to the new CX-7. We who own an RX-8 know what a unique car it is.

 

why is it that whenever there is a "compare" topic people seem to have it in for the banana, i think he made a good point.

 

No matter what I say some people will always turn what I say into me bashing their car.

 

i agree as well.. I cannot remember the last time I saw a dedicated 8 commercial...

 

They did in the past, there was a rotary powered station wagon in the 70's, most car manufacturers were also experimenting with the engine up until the fuel shortages and big gas price hikes that happened in that decade. That has always been blamed as the main reason the rotary slipped away into obscurity in any case... They also made a rotary powered pickup and other cars in japan. Most ppl here tend to forget about the japanese market and the fact that there never was a gap between RX-7 and RX-8 production, which is another arguement against the eventual return of the RX-7... but that's another discussion.

They wouldn't sell many cars if they made mostly rotary powered stuff, gas mileage is too bad, and ford won't let them anyway, ******** tried to can the RX-8 project early on.

 

I personaly don't want to see as many RX-8's as I see 350z's
I like the uniqueness of this vehicle, the fact that not everyone who want's a sports car runs out and buy's one.
Because they don't know anything about it.
Now take the enthusiasts, into fine cars and you have all of us.
The few, the proud, the ROTARY owners.

 

Fair enough… good point.

 

Maybe not. The comparison is missing at least one very important factor:

Corvette MSRP: $43,690 - $64,890
RX-8 MSRP: $26,435-$32,600

About 50% of the price. Doesn't seem like a bad comparison to me.