i agree with the OP, it's sad that mazda didn't try to increase the power for the '09 MY. the econobox MS3 will kick the crap out of an rx-8 in a straight line, and isn't that much slower on a road course from what i've read.

i knew these cars were slow from the factory and hard/expensive to modify so i'm not complaining... but i am suprised that mazda didn't do anything for power in the new cars.

 

There will always be something faster, and something that handles better. Be happy with what you've got, a miracle in a box 1.3L engine that does 230+hp and can be FI to do 300+ for a few grand. Think about the few grand difference between 350Z and a RX-8 - you'd spank the Z and feel good about it.

Or you can just type up a rant, not doing anything and go on living your life hating your car.

Don't get me wrong, I realize a Mazda speed 3 and 6 will beat me, but sometimes it's not about being beat. Do you get looks from people if you have an everyday 3 or 6? No... but now tell me if you had a badass body kit and didn't drive it like you stole it, and you let people actually pass you while you're just enjoying some nice cool weather & not WOT, you'd feel like you're worth a million bucks. People come talk to me at the gas station probably 1 out of 3 or 4 times I fill up. The conversation doesn't go, "**** man you got ripped off, anything can beat your ***", it normally goes something like "man that's a sick car", "I've been thinking about getting one of those", "how much did all that cost you?".

Like it's been said a hundred THOUSAND times before, if you want a fast car get something else, but really if you want it for the fun and excitement - you need an attitude adjustment.

 

Yes, for about $5500 out of pocket, I could do a nice turbo kit to the Renesis, but I prefer not to boost engines that were'nt designed for it in the first place (trust me, I've turboed quite a few N/A cars in my day... in the end, most had cooling issues, low reliability, and sometimes were very quirky.)


I also am very able to use the most out of my RX-8 in handling and braking, etc. I want to keep all of that and just have some extra 100-150 or so HP in that package. It would be nice for Mazda to bring us something similar so that I don't have to go in my garage and make it myself. I really have no problem with converting my car to a older turbo 13B, returning the fuel system, wiring up a MegaSquirt standalone, fabbing a new exhaust system, and dissecting the gauge cluster wiring to make my tach and speedo work. I just know how much time it will involve to get it done... LOTS.


I could start with a 13B RE Cosmo (i've got a cheap source on that) and do an ebay front mount, boost controller, injectors, and 3" turbo-back exhaust for close to what I could sell all my renesis stuff for. Later on, I could upgrade to a BB turbo and make about 360+ whp with an engine not living on the ragg-ed edge.

 

I worked on a couple of BMW E30 cars with installed turbos, and a 80's BMW M6 that had a turbo kit with a RRFPR and piggyback. We removed that junk, then installed a Megasquirt onto that car too.

I really am very impressed by the megasquirts constant development and mltiple options. Even if i had the money, I may never buy a haltech or motech type system in my lifetime. I working next door to Jerry of DIY auttune for about 8 months... great guy, great company. I learned alot about the systems and how to use the software.

 

Moral of the story is, the 8 does have power, if it doesn't have ENOUGH for you, then turbo it or something, or sell it... or you can always go to some other country where 98% of the cars are all 50bhp and then come back and find your 8 is a godsend.

 

Some of you guys are really myopic in your scope of thinking. How and why are you giving this man such a hard time for wanting more power (read: torque) out of his car. Please forgive his mis-blatant-use of the word "performance." As patrons of this site, most of you understand that performance isn't as linear as straight line acceleration. So why is it, that you people choose to bash him for wanting more than a car that is "king of the twisties."

Why shouldn't this car have both the power of a Goat with the gracefulness of porshe? What the hell has crawled up your collective butts and died?

Are you bashers so bitter that your car can't beat civic or s2k in a foot race that it's backed you into an egotistical corner where the only thing you can take pride in is the road holding capabilities with this car and death to all those that seek to change it?

It's so often that you smart-asses say "you bought the wrong car." Can you come up with a more effective argument. Fact is, there's not many cars out there that offer the comfort, styling, and "performance for the dollar. It's a small sect of cars to choose from. It's practically a system of false choices which is why people mod their cars, seeking to improve upon what they feel is lacking.

Let us examine this issue from another angle.

THE CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT!
(not really, but it's a point worth noting)

How many fuggin times has some made a post on this site or other sites about the slowness of this car? HOW MANY? If so many of us feel this way, then could it be possible that Mazda has issued an incomplete product. Albeit in it's current form is still good enough to make sales. Why shouldn't Mazda man-up and put some ballz on this car? Why is it the buyer the one that got it wrong?

Another issue that I have with this bullshit.

The OP put out a well thought opinion. It wasn't some stereotypical juvenile bashing. Come on people, think outside of the box. You're being so offensively defensive about this car that you're being dicks for the sake of a company that decided that your survey results needed to be dropped from their aggregate of total satisfaction surveys and wanted to keep it secret. Who benefits from your retaliations of those that don't feel the way that you do?

Shall you attack those owners that have turbo'd their cars? Surely they felt it was lacking....did they buy the wrong car? What about the companies that are providing these modifications for this car. Are they making stupid mods for the wrong car? Surely they don't know what their doing by investing so many man-hours and dollars of other people's money.

 

Don't like the power? Then don't buy the car anyway and then bitch about how you don't like the power.

We should be lucky that the rotary is even still available. And there is still bitching about how it isn't powerful enough. There's plenty of nice cars out there with more power and good handling. But he didn't buy any of those cars. He didn't buy a powerful car and bitch about handling.

If people feel that the RX-8 is an incomplete product, then they shouldn't buy one. And if they do buy one, there's no reason to cry about how unsatisfying it is. It's the car buyer's responsibility to buy the right car for them. That's what I didn't. I didn't buy something that was sort of what I wanted and then try to gain sympathy because I realized my car was too slow, or didn't handle well enough, or the interior wasn't good enough, or had an ugly body etc.

It's funny how magazine editors can rave about how great this car is after driving it for free. Yet there's so many people who paid hard earned money for the same car and start bitching about how they don't like the performance.

It's a sports car and it does what a sports car is supposed to do. This should have been apparent during the test drive. This is not something you finally realize a year later then try to blame Mazda for the poor decision you made by purchasing the car. Or maybe it is something you realize a year later, indicating you realy don't know what you want. Again, don't transfer the blame over to Mazda for not building your dream car. If the performance is so disappointing, then I would imagine that there are plenty of other cars out there with better performance. I'm sure one of the other dealers will be happy to sell you one of those "better" cars.

Myopic nothing. If you buy a car your not happy with, guess who's fault that is?

If all he wants to do is turbo it, then turbo it and don't complain about how you don't like the car you just bought. Can't afford a turbo kit, maybe that should have been something to consider when buying the car. Again, nobody else's fault. So no need to rant to everyone about how it's not your fault.

 

I don't care if your experience includes engine-swapping the space shuttle- you will not get a 13B-REW into an RX8 for less money with greater reliability than you would just putting a turbo on the Renesis, and you're going against all the accumulated experience and knowledge of the real know-hows here by trying. Seriously, it's been done. Jesus, the 13B-REW is unreliable enough in the car it was designed for. You're welcome to try, but don't say no one warned you.

Anyway, if you don't like the 8, sell it and buy a 7. Or anything else, really- if the market is ripe with superior cars, go buy them and quit annoying everyone.

Numbers don't tell the whole story, either. In every quantitative measurement, my RX8 soundly outperforms my airplane. And yet, my car still can't fly.

 

Damn, I knew something was wrong withmy 8!

Thanks, Rootski. Now I know my car can't fly.

 

why are people so obsessed with the 13B-REW, it doesn't make much more HP than ours does NA (the version we got)?

Also, I think a lot of people perceive our cars low on power bc there is no kick like you get with VTAK at a certain RPM, its just smooth power delivery.

now just grow up and stop bitchin', the 8 is what it is...pure fun!

 

It still might. Maybe you just put the wings on upside down?

 

VTAK is overrated. It always feels like it's going to blow up compared to the ROTARY power delivery across the RPM range.

 

and megaspuirt is true to the rx8 how..

people have been there. let us know when you get it under you well modded belt..

you got lots of background facts. but a big bunch of nothing in the long run..

you claim to be able to build what ever you want. that was the point of my first post.

jump up to you words, cowboy..

beers

 

Dont forget the 8 was designed to be both a 4 door sedan and a sports car with reliablility and drivability in its mind, meaning anybody can drive it ( I saw a granny driving one!). It was never built to be like the FD with 100% performance in mind, where the market is limited to car enthusiests. So theres no point in comparing the 2.
Dont forget it wasnt mazdas idea to make it a 4 door family sedan, I'm sure they would of went for a full blown performance rx if the company was up and running at the time...

 

There's nothing myopic with anyone's feelings here. It's the case of wanting your cake and eating it too. It's simply not realistic.

The design of the rotary to date doesn't allot for high HP or torque numbers because mazda has to operate within the restraints of emissions, cost, fuel mileage and a target audiance.

The whole point of modifying a vehicle is to shape the car to perform the way YOU want it to. If you want more power or torque then there are plenty of FI options from superchargers, nitrous, and even turbos.

With sub 10 second 1/4 mile rotary engines being out there, I'm certain these motors can handle boost. How reliable the engine is depends on how realistic you are with your power goals.

Hell a few weeks ago I almost got beat by a V8 Tundra on a highway onramp. You'd think I'd be pissed cause a pickup truck with a V8 was roasting me on acceleration.

I'm sure he was laughing till he hit that ramp...then it was my turn to laugh.

 

I know what the RX-8 was designed as and what it's initial intention was to be. Hell, at the time it came out it was dead-even with it's direct competition... the 350Z. Nowadays though, the 350Z has long surpassed the RX-8 in performance.... pretty much everything has. I remember reading about the RX-8 in 2003 before it hit shores and I thought that it was really cool and the low power didn't bother me so much becaus the chassis was stiffer than the previous RX models, it had a 6 speed, and it revved to 9,000 rpm. The thing I didn't pay attention to back then though, was that my cousin had purchased an 04' accord 6 speed and it was actually faster in a straight line than my RX-8 sports car.... yeah, 14.4 @ 99mph!!



The whole point of my OP was that the RX-8 is not getting any faster and still has the same brakes and suspension. All the other cars in it's class are getting faster and perfoming better, while also getting better gas mileage. THAT is what I am getting at, that is why I feel that the RX-8 is lacking. In a couple more years, the new toyota sports car will probably be out, and Acura is supposed to have a new sports/supercar. What is Mazda going to have? What will they be bringing to the table, some old dirty dishes? When the 3rd gen RX-7 was out, nothing in it's price range (or out of) could really touch it.... not the evo, not the 300zxTT, not the corvette, not the camaro, not the mustang, not the 911 carrera, not the nsx. For the money, it would basically hang with or beat all those cars on the proper circuit. Is mazda going to try and clean house again, or just sit around, WTF MATE!


Show the world again that less displacement still can mean more. Make it a 2800-3000lb, 350-400hp 3-rotor, with an amazing chassis, and huge brakes. Then Mazda can rear it's ugly head right up corvettes, evo's, sti's, 370z's, and S2k's *****! Look at what Nissan did, they went fully global with the GTR and I bet it will sell out every year it's in production (unless they royaly engineered something wrong). That car took the world by storm, and now toyota and acura are trying to follow-up with some thing equal or greater... If the corvette wasn't such a global icon, then I bet it would plumet in sales in the next few years to come. I believe that the RX series has a strong enough following that there is a void in the market just sitting there waiting to be fulfilled. I know i'm waiting, and i'm getting tired of waiting. Yes, the RX-8 curbed the hunger for most of us for awhile, but the Rx-8 is proving to not be as filling as it looked. I would love to dig into something meaty again, the RX-7 twin turbo was just a major tease for us americans.


You know, maybe a lot of you on here are just soft, and maybe i'm just talking to the wrong crowd. I should just go back to RX7club, where the men hang out. You all probably couldn't tame a beast like a modified FD. Maybe that's why your RX-8 is so satisfying and feels PLENTY FAST ENOUGH. hehehe


Seriously, I'm ******* with you all.... lighten up!

 

Post removed by Moderator

 

When I start seeing accords racing on the race track then I'll bow down to their performance. Till then I'm sure they will get groceries much faster than the RX8.

Ever heard of not fixing it if it's not broken? The suspension and brakes on the RX8 are pretty good.

Wasn't it priced around $40,000 at the time too? I'm sure if people were willing to pay $40,000 - $50,000 for a RX8 that mazda would make something to fit into that price range. One great part about this car is all the fantastic stuff it does and all much less than an Evo, 350z, or a vette.

Plenty of time to hang out cause their 7's are not running...

 

I think you Americans are too used to Mustangs and Corvettes with 6 litre engines. People come in here and say the RX-8 is slow. Now I agree that off the line it's not that fast, but compared to price and usability... if driven right it's a fast car, say what you want. Keeping it in the right range and such.

But sure, I'd love to have a 20B engine in it tuned just lovely.

 

The 350Z has nothing on the RX8... ok maybe torque but thats its. I should know, I have 2008 350Z 6 speed.

The RX-8 does feel and perform like wings welded to your arms. The Z feels like you are clopping around in cement buckets.

The RX-8 feels refined. Like someone developed it to be its own car, share nothing with lesser cars and designed to compete from the get go.

The Z feels like an afterthought with cramped seats, cheapo interior that has no space to put anything. Even cupholders they couldn't get right. They put a glove box BEHIND the passenger seat??

The RX-8 gets side curtain and seat airbags.

The Z? you get the front and thats it... unless you are lucky enough to find one that has the side curtain airbags. Cost? $620.00 The fact that Nissan doesn't make them standard is in my opinion, a crime.

Who the hell cares about horsepower?? The fact that you all gloss over it like a 12 year old looking at his first playboy, tells me you have no idea what you are talking about.

Its all about torque. Period. You couldn't even use 200 horsepower on the street. You wouldnt be able to get up the actual mph that would get you too..

Its all about the torque.

And a rotary WILL NOT have that kind a force that a piston does since it operates completely differently.
It operates in an rpm range that most cars can't. It has no valves to float, no rockers to break and no camshaft to go flat. No timing chain. No timing belt. No pistons etc..

It already sucks in fuel on every rotation, do you really think that Mazda couldn't make it way faster and more powerful?? Of course they can! But at what cost? 10 Mpg?

I drive a 350Z. And Im getting rid of it. To get a RX8. all 159 ft.lbs of torque of it. Which is over 100 less than the 350Z.. And I can't wait! To get my hands on one of the best shifting transmissions I have ever used.. For the silky delivery of the rotary engine... for the comfort, and usability of 4 seats without looking like a Camry. For 9K rpm redline...

But mostly because I love the concept of a rotary.. its what it is..

 

The 20B in the Eunos Cosmo gives about 300nm from 2250rpms...

 

You're comparing an old turbo car at least 15 years versus a car that has been debuted just a handful years ago.

Are you forgetting you own an RX as well?

This section of the forum is no different than the tech section of the 7 forum. It shares the SAME amount of problems.

AND your cars are newer than theirs.

lol Nice aimless stab.

 

Look everyone, it's the distinct mating call of the North American Loserus Backing-out-erus Argumentorus.

Go buy an RX-7 and quit crying. The RX-8 never was and never will be an RX-7. Something that's very apparent to everyone here but you. Let all the other cars get more power bumps and watch them go up in price, and watch them still not be as fun to drive.

We all understand that you don't understand, we're waiting for you to realize that you don't get it. Horsepower and 1/4 times are top priority for children. Let the children have their toys, I'll keep my no torques RX-8 and have more fun than any of them.

Once again, you don't understand what a true sports car is. Some of the best sports cars ever made were slow in a strait line and made little power. Power doesn't make the car. Horsepower isn't relevant to what year it is or how much power the other cars have. That's why the original RX-7, 240Z, 510, etc. are still a blast to drive. You don't design a car by trying to make it better than something else, you design it to be as fun to drive as possible for as little as possible. The RX-8 isn't in competition with the Z or the S2K, it's simply just in a similar category. Mazda hit the mark with this car, you're the one that missed.

 

If Mazda did improve the car year after year after year.... that would affect YOUR individual car how exactly? They won't send techs around to install the new features for you. Trust me, I asked.