gord boyd

I will say this for the Audi Quattro V6's with 4 winter tires
in a winter storm, the linearity allowed passing big transports
with terrific confidence. (a bit of shock and awe on the faces of the transport drivers).

You won't be passing any transport trucks with the RX-8
during a snowstorm, I suspect. And maybe during heavy
windy rains, although this board should be interesting reading.

Sometimes a light feel can be scary in good cross winds
and some black ice. Experience counts.

nostatic

Here here. I own a 2002 A4 1.8T and live in British Columbia. The car performed superbly on many trips to the local ski hills. People have mentioned starting in the snow and stopping in the snow, but failed to discuss maneuvering (driving while already moving) in the snow. I believe that's where AWD really shines.

My '93 FD absolutely sucked in the snow. I always use snow/ice tires for my vehicles in winter, but the FD just couldn't hook up and stay hooked up. IMO it was just too light with too much power. Scary as hell.

AbusiveWombat

These are very strange quotes.? I used to drive a Chevy z71 truck. Now I can't vouge for snow but in wet weather the rear would be all over the place if not for being able to turn on the Auto 4-wheel drive. AWD helps in many more situations than just starting. For places that get lots of rain and snow the AWD would be a great benifit.

Huh? I'm really not sure what's wrong with the STi or EVO's driving position. From the EVO's point of view there's a recaro seat with momo steering wheel. There's plenty of head room for a helmit and plenty of room for heal-n-toe'n. And I'm 6'2" 210 lbs. Ohhh and plenty of visibility. Can you clarify your opinion?

Ali

Having a Recaro and a Momo don't automatically make a sports car. It's the seating position that matters most to me. The extra feedback and the added composure of having a low slung and enveloping driving position.

The Evo and Scooby are scarily fast sports saloons, but a sports car is, in my mind, epitomised by the Elise/VX220. The closer you can get to that ideal, the closer a car is to a sports car. The Evo and Scoob have sit up and beg driving poistions, dictated by passenger space and practicality in their junior versions. It's the same reason I don't particularly love my Civ Type R. It's a hot hatch, not a sports car, yet the mechanically identical new ITR is a sports car. You sit nearly six inches lower, are more cosseted and gain far more feel through the car, yet all the hardware is identical.

As to my friends Scooby remarks, he's not alone. Another guy I know takes his wife's Renault Clio diesel when it snows after too many scary moments in his Impreza. It's a common story. If all the cars were on chains then that may be a different story but most people in teh UK use stock tyres as the snow rarely lasts for more than a few days, and in that situation the Scoob is inferior. I've tried a Scooby WRX in the pouring wet and I'd honestly say I'd rather take the Type R. It's far better balanced despite being FF.

hairyfrog

What makes a sports car for me is more than performance numbers and handling, important though they are. A sports car has to turns heads!

I could never buy a scooby etc as in the end they are just plain ugly imho. Great cars in lots of ways but at the end of the day they look like family cars on steroids... no offence intended...

rotarypower

i hope you guys don't give me dirty looks if or when i get a wrx . still debating... WRX.... RX-8... WRX.... Rx-8.... *sigh* had that 6k difference in price between the cars been about 3k... i'd definitely choose rx-8. oh woe is me....

btw... why do the face icons after not show? for me at leasT?

zerobanger

I think some of you are being VERY bias. Lets, objectivly look at the cars. The STI is UGLY, the Rx-8 is styled very, very nice. While the WRX is a station wagon, the Rx-8 is a serious sportscar.

So there you have it, the Rx-8 OWNZZZZZZZZZZZ the STI.

Nice day..

OH YEA...The -8- CAN'T Lose!!!

zoom44

i was wondering the same thing *cough* tman? *cough*

TybeeRX-8

Perhaps you might want to consider that Subaru does NOT recommend the STi be driven on ice or snow! It has way too much power. And as for the torque, anyone want to buy my G500? It's got bags of torque!!! The RX-8 is about a refined sports car with a dash of practicality. And for those who question it's speed, I do F&C for SCCA and regularly see 2nd Gen RX-7's (ITS) beat everyone in the class, including BMW's. Even the older Gen I RX-7's in IT7 lead the pack. Miatas aren't known for their torque, but just go watch a SM racing with other classes and you won't be surprised to see the better drivers winning races..overall!:cheers:

nk_Rx8

I thought it was because it comes with summer tires. I think I'd rather drive a Subaru with winter tires than a rwd car in the winter.

BlueAdept

As others have said, 4wd tends to help you go more than it helps you stop... so this can be bad!... a 2WD car will FEEL less competant than it really is, while a 4WD car may FEEL more competant than it really is... The result is that people feel less secure in a 2WD car, and so drive more safely. (IMHO).

RX-pecting

No so:

RX-8 GT: 39 800
WRX STi: 46 995

still a big difference though, but I think we get overall better deals than our cousins

RX-pecting

Oh and Canadian STi's are getting performance seats which, as I understand it, aren't offered as std in the US, Americans are getting "a much less restrictive design".


http://www.canadiandriver.com/articl...ages/sti_8.jpg

tribal azn2

yea cuz americans have big fat asses

nk_Rx8

But then the reasons given for AWD being bad is because of uneducated drivers. A driver who is knowledgable will not think that AWD helps his braking distance and will be just as safe as someone driving a FWD. And he will have more traction to get going. I've been driving on snow for a long time now, so I am experienced enough to know that. So for me AWD is a advantage for me.

Also someone mentioned that AWD is heavier and extends your braking distance, and that is why AWD is not as safe. There are 2WD cars just as heavy as AWD cars. While your braking distance increases, weight is not necessariily a bad thing in the winter. It is like how thinner tires are better than really wide in the winter. It may actually help you get more traction by having the tires bite down harder through the snow. Very light cars will have more traction problems.

BlueAdept

I agree... and would go so far as to say that in really poor conditions, no car is really safe or really unsafe... it's all a factor of the driver having respect for the capabilities of the vehicle and the conditions.

Many cars are very forgiving, even hard to loose control of in good conditions... but ice takes no prisoners and you can't expect to get things wrong and not pay for it!

TybeeRX-8

That's true...they are utra high performance summer rubber. But, that's not the problem alone in snow and ice. The wheel size prohibits buying the kind of tire necessary for winter performance driving. The rally cars switch to narrow wheel and tire combinations to use knobbies and or studs depending on the road surfaces. The STi comes with 17x7.5" wheels (and the Evo with 17x8"). Without question, the STi will prove superior with the right tires in winter, but so is a Jeep. As others point out, stopping is more of an issue. Put Blizzaks on the RX-8 and with all the electronic devices, it won't present a problem with a good driver. I drove a 325e all though upstate NY in winter for 2 years, and with proper tires, never got stuck. And it was not all slow motoring either. Remember, there was a time when 4wd/fwd was a novelty and everyone got around with rwd...or maybe you're why too young to recall.

ed hall

I drove an EVO last week and its rubbish. It rattled and spurted and coughed at idle. The first speed hump I drove over I thought my spine would go right through my butt.

But, boy does it go! And the grip is unbelievable. Is it a real car in the real world? NO. After an hour in the thing, I was tired. Could you use every day to work and back? NO.

Like the STI, it has this huge wing on the back. Sorry people, both look like Toyota Corollas with wings on the boot and holes in the bonnet.

As a performance machine, it's great, the motor makes it. The suspension adds to the fun. And that is all that these cars are. God help you if you carsh them....

MarkW

Why were you driving an Evo then? If you want a nice soft comfortable ride, try a Merc, Lexus, Jag etc.

The Evo and some extent the STi are all out performance and handling oriented at the expense of comfort and ride.

Point to Point there are no everyday cars that will beat them for sensible money, and on the right sort of roads they will bring a huge smile to your face.

Many people are prepared to live with this compromise, as the rewards can be so great.

AbusiveWombat

It all depends on what you want from a car. I bought the EVO because of the huge grin on my face. I like the tight suspension and the raw all out performance. Who said you can't use it to and from work? I absolutely love going to and from work now. There's a couple of "S" turns that I can wizz through both ways that is heaven. I could go on and on but it really comes down to what you value in a car. The EVO is not for everyone just like the RX8 is not for everyone.

TJRX8

Speak for yourself. What is "perfect" for me may not be perfect for you.

BTW My son owns a 03 WRX and I see nothing I like about it....except the color.