An Rx8 like you have never seen before!
04-16-2010 | 01:31 AM
#76
I'm an insurance appraiser and this is the basic on modifications.
First things like exhaust, steering, suspension ect... the vehicle has to have these items to operate. It is assumed when determining a value on a vehicle that these things were in working order prior to the accident. There for they do not add any value to the vehicle because it must have these things to be in average condition which means operational.
Second modifications are pro-rated from the date they were installed. Meaning if you have modded the vehicle you will have to gather receipts with dates and prices. Since you got use from the parts you installed they are not worth what you paid for them. Think of this like a battery that has a warranty but is pro-rated because you have gotten use from it.
Third and most people do not realize this 99% of the time the OEM parts are worth more then aftermarket parts. That bad *** exhaust, or wheels, or ect... that you put on your car cost's less thus are worth less then the stock OEM parts.
You may should get some extra money from the modifications. You will not however get full value that you paid for those mods because of the above reasons.
Best thing to do if you decide to modify your car beyond basic bolt on parts, I'm talking a heavily modified car that you've dumped like 10k$ plus in is get a stated value policy. Basically you go to your insurance agent. Disclose everything you've done to the car and what it's use is, and advise them you've invested 10k$ into your 10k$ car and you want a policy that will cover the vehicle for 20k$ in case it is a total loss.
Also almost no insurance company uses KBB or NADA ect.. One of these reasons is that these companies can have outside influences. Several years ago KBB was involved in a huge law suit. The reason was that there main investors were car dealers and they were manipulating the prices, example lowering the trade in value, and increasing the retail value. So anyone saying they want KBB or NADA prices for there vehicle isn't what true market value is.
True market retail value of a vehicle is what people are buying them for. The company I work for uses a company that is nation wide (CCC Valuescope) to obtain values for vehicles. I report the mileage, options, and condition of the vehicle (Poor, Typical, Better then average). They take this information and start at the owners zip code and work there way out from there to get a good cross section of vehicles with the same options, condition, and mileage to determine a value. They however use there own information for these purposes. This company has real people who search used car lots, dealership lots, Autotrader, News papers ect... to see what the vehicles are actually selling for.
Just thought I would share how some of this process works.
First things like exhaust, steering, suspension ect... the vehicle has to have these items to operate. It is assumed when determining a value on a vehicle that these things were in working order prior to the accident. There for they do not add any value to the vehicle because it must have these things to be in average condition which means operational.
Second modifications are pro-rated from the date they were installed. Meaning if you have modded the vehicle you will have to gather receipts with dates and prices. Since you got use from the parts you installed they are not worth what you paid for them. Think of this like a battery that has a warranty but is pro-rated because you have gotten use from it.
Third and most people do not realize this 99% of the time the OEM parts are worth more then aftermarket parts. That bad *** exhaust, or wheels, or ect... that you put on your car cost's less thus are worth less then the stock OEM parts.
You may should get some extra money from the modifications. You will not however get full value that you paid for those mods because of the above reasons.
Best thing to do if you decide to modify your car beyond basic bolt on parts, I'm talking a heavily modified car that you've dumped like 10k$ plus in is get a stated value policy. Basically you go to your insurance agent. Disclose everything you've done to the car and what it's use is, and advise them you've invested 10k$ into your 10k$ car and you want a policy that will cover the vehicle for 20k$ in case it is a total loss.
Also almost no insurance company uses KBB or NADA ect.. One of these reasons is that these companies can have outside influences. Several years ago KBB was involved in a huge law suit. The reason was that there main investors were car dealers and they were manipulating the prices, example lowering the trade in value, and increasing the retail value. So anyone saying they want KBB or NADA prices for there vehicle isn't what true market value is.
True market retail value of a vehicle is what people are buying them for. The company I work for uses a company that is nation wide (CCC Valuescope) to obtain values for vehicles. I report the mileage, options, and condition of the vehicle (Poor, Typical, Better then average). They take this information and start at the owners zip code and work there way out from there to get a good cross section of vehicles with the same options, condition, and mileage to determine a value. They however use there own information for these purposes. This company has real people who search used car lots, dealership lots, Autotrader, News papers ect... to see what the vehicles are actually selling for.
Just thought I would share how some of this process works.
04-16-2010 | 02:04 AM
#77
Registered
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 236
Likes: 0
From: Portland, OR
A good towing company always comes prepared. My car was also 1.6" lowered when I had it towed, the guy pulled out some small boards that he placed right front of the front tires. So, the tires hit the boards and raised the car about 2-4" before the front bumper scrapped the flatbed and cleared it fine. They have methods of doing it properly, if it's a good towing company. Some of the new cars (Mercedes, BMW etc.) will not be able to tow any other way but with flatbed as there airbags will deployed (tow truck driver explained that to me).
04-16-2010 | 06:29 AM
#78
Not bashing you or anything but most ppl think car insurance is designed to pay for any and everything. To some insurance companies mods add no value to a vehicle but the ones who are willing to pay usually won't do so unless you can provide proof of the aftermarket items on the vehicle. I deal with this kind of stuff everyday and it kills me to see what ppl try to pass off on insurance companies. Don't get me wrong I'm all for insurance compaines paying what they owe but they have to draw the line somewhere.
Car looks like a total loss in the pics.....good luck.
Car looks like a total loss in the pics.....good luck.
04-16-2010 | 01:48 PM
#86
There was a Ferrari that recently rolled off the back of a flatbed in my area. It only hit the back end with the front still on the flatbed and yet it was still totalled. Once you lose the integrity of a uni-body construction frame that's all she wrote.
OP: Regrets, and all the best for a satisfactory settlement.
OP: Regrets, and all the best for a satisfactory settlement.
04-16-2010 | 05:19 PM
#89
Registered User
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Doctor,
I work in insurance but i'm not an adjuster, so keep that in mind, but I'm not sure I entirely agree.
Wouldn't it make a difference that he'd be making a liability claim against the towing company and not an auto claim on his own?
The limits in question would then be the towing company's on their liability policy. Commercial Liability policies do not work the same way as personal auto policies. If you make a claim against the towing company, their insurer would have to pay you for the replacement cost of the car as it was.
The towing company's insurer would then go after the insurer covering the woman who hit the truck.
Not sure how all this actually works out in practice, but if you can prove all the mods and their value and whatnot I think you should be able to recover on the total value (less depreciation) from the towing company's insurer.
I might be wrong but just thought I'd throw that out there.
I work in insurance but i'm not an adjuster, so keep that in mind, but I'm not sure I entirely agree.
Wouldn't it make a difference that he'd be making a liability claim against the towing company and not an auto claim on his own?
The limits in question would then be the towing company's on their liability policy. Commercial Liability policies do not work the same way as personal auto policies. If you make a claim against the towing company, their insurer would have to pay you for the replacement cost of the car as it was.
The towing company's insurer would then go after the insurer covering the woman who hit the truck.
Not sure how all this actually works out in practice, but if you can prove all the mods and their value and whatnot I think you should be able to recover on the total value (less depreciation) from the towing company's insurer.
I might be wrong but just thought I'd throw that out there.
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04-17-2010 | 02:40 PM
#92
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
First of yes I think it's a total loss. Every state has a threshold to determine a total loss. The threshold is a % of the value of the vehicle. Where I live the threshold is 75% meaning if my estimate reaches or exceeds 75% of the value of the vehicle it's a total loss, this is not a decision on the insurance company or me, it's a law. Some states are as low as 60%.
IF the woman is at fault for running a redlight and hitting the tow truck/car then her insurance will be liable if she has insurance. If she doesn't it falls back to the owner of the vehicles insurance to cover it if they have collision insurance. If neither party have insurance then the best bet would be for the owner to sue the person responsible.
Even under commercial insurance policy's everything and the loss is to a road going vehicle then that claim is regulated by state guidelines which 99% of what I do is regulated. Meaning it would be handled like any other auto damage claim.
It boils down to who is deemed at fault for the accident, in this case it looks like the lady that hit the tow truck/car. Even if the tow company did something wrong and caused the loss then there insurance would still handle it like an auto damage claim, because they have auto damage liability being they are operating road going vehicles (tow trucks) it would be the same as if a another car hit them. At least that's what I think. I've written estimates and handled claims that our insureds were commercial policy's but the cars that were damaged in the accident were handled as I would normally handle any other car accident claim.
I also don't think the frame is damaged.
See this picture:
The yellow lines are where the frame rails are, very in board I don't think they are damaged.
The white lines are not the frame, they are just floor pan reinforcements not meant to take much force except for reinforcing the floors. This is why many uni-body cars people put sub frame connectors in them for racing purposes to keep the floor pan from flexing.
This picture:
The white is the upper frame rails/inner fenders/aprons they just support the upper front structure of the car and help absorb impact's to deflect the energy through the roof of the car.
The yellow lines are the firewall, pillars, and roof rails of the car. This is the strongest bit's of the car it's high strength steel in most cars, and keeps the passenger compartment safe during and accident. The cars are designed to crush in any area outside this "cage". You will see most cars that score poorly on off set front crash tests the hinge pillar portion (where the front door hinges attach to the car) collapses.
The red in both pictures (the rockers) are part of the "cage" portion of the vehicle, but not a frame rail.
The way a unibody/monocoque care is built there is no real frame. There are crush structures but just about the entire car is the structure of the vehicle. The Front lower and upper frame rails, the fire wall, the pillars and roof rails, the roof, the floor, the quarter panels, and the rear frame rails, rockers, and even the glass in certain cases is part of the structural rigidity of the vehicle.
Frame rails on these types of vehicles are nothing more then sheet metal bent and shaped to add strength and are easily repaired in most cases unless they are absolutely crushed.
Doctor,
I work in insurance but i'm not an adjuster, so keep that in mind, but I'm not sure I entirely agree.
Wouldn't it make a difference that he'd be making a liability claim against the towing company and not an auto claim on his own?
The limits in question would then be the towing company's on their liability policy. Commercial Liability policies do not work the same way as personal auto policies. If you make a claim against the towing company, their insurer would have to pay you for the replacement cost of the car as it was.
The towing company's insurer would then go after the insurer covering the woman who hit the truck.
Not sure how all this actually works out in practice, but if you can prove all the mods and their value and whatnot I think you should be able to recover on the total value (less depreciation) from the towing company's insurer.
I might be wrong but just thought I'd throw that out there.
I work in insurance but i'm not an adjuster, so keep that in mind, but I'm not sure I entirely agree.
Wouldn't it make a difference that he'd be making a liability claim against the towing company and not an auto claim on his own?
The limits in question would then be the towing company's on their liability policy. Commercial Liability policies do not work the same way as personal auto policies. If you make a claim against the towing company, their insurer would have to pay you for the replacement cost of the car as it was.
The towing company's insurer would then go after the insurer covering the woman who hit the truck.
Not sure how all this actually works out in practice, but if you can prove all the mods and their value and whatnot I think you should be able to recover on the total value (less depreciation) from the towing company's insurer.
I might be wrong but just thought I'd throw that out there.
Even under commercial insurance policy's everything and the loss is to a road going vehicle then that claim is regulated by state guidelines which 99% of what I do is regulated. Meaning it would be handled like any other auto damage claim.
It boils down to who is deemed at fault for the accident, in this case it looks like the lady that hit the tow truck/car. Even if the tow company did something wrong and caused the loss then there insurance would still handle it like an auto damage claim, because they have auto damage liability being they are operating road going vehicles (tow trucks) it would be the same as if a another car hit them. At least that's what I think. I've written estimates and handled claims that our insureds were commercial policy's but the cars that were damaged in the accident were handled as I would normally handle any other car accident claim.
I also don't think the frame is damaged.
See this picture:
The yellow lines are where the frame rails are, very in board I don't think they are damaged.
The white lines are not the frame, they are just floor pan reinforcements not meant to take much force except for reinforcing the floors. This is why many uni-body cars people put sub frame connectors in them for racing purposes to keep the floor pan from flexing.
This picture:
The white is the upper frame rails/inner fenders/aprons they just support the upper front structure of the car and help absorb impact's to deflect the energy through the roof of the car.
The yellow lines are the firewall, pillars, and roof rails of the car. This is the strongest bit's of the car it's high strength steel in most cars, and keeps the passenger compartment safe during and accident. The cars are designed to crush in any area outside this "cage". You will see most cars that score poorly on off set front crash tests the hinge pillar portion (where the front door hinges attach to the car) collapses.
The red in both pictures (the rockers) are part of the "cage" portion of the vehicle, but not a frame rail.
The way a unibody/monocoque care is built there is no real frame. There are crush structures but just about the entire car is the structure of the vehicle. The Front lower and upper frame rails, the fire wall, the pillars and roof rails, the roof, the floor, the quarter panels, and the rear frame rails, rockers, and even the glass in certain cases is part of the structural rigidity of the vehicle.
Frame rails on these types of vehicles are nothing more then sheet metal bent and shaped to add strength and are easily repaired in most cases unless they are absolutely crushed.
Last edited by Doctor7474; 04-17-2010 at 02:59 PM.
04-20-2010 | 10:09 AM
#96
Good to hear everything is being paid for.
If the car is declared totaled do you have gap insurance on your car. Assuming you got a loan to get it?
Are you coming back to the rotary family or moving on?
If the car is declared totaled do you have gap insurance on your car. Assuming you got a loan to get it?
Are you coming back to the rotary family or moving on?
04-20-2010 | 10:24 AM
#97
Registered User
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 42
Likes: 0
From: Converse Texas
Omg
I would have been on the scene and there would have been pics of me kicking the tow truck drivers @ss up and down the street...lol
I am so sorry this happened to your car. Looks like a towing company is going to be either fixing or buying you a new car!!
Not all women drivers are bad, and there are some pretty stupid male drivers out there too!!...LOL!!!
I am so sorry this happened to your car. Looks like a towing company is going to be either fixing or buying you a new car!!
Not all women drivers are bad, and there are some pretty stupid male drivers out there too!!...LOL!!!
04-20-2010 | 01:51 PM
#99
Thread Starter
Turbo SR20deT Son!
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 790
Likes: 0
From: North. dallas(Texas)
Not sure yet they are sending their guy to go out and look at the car and declare the damage as well as set up my rent car. If they total it out I will either try to find another one , or just buy a DD and save up for something else.
04-28-2010 | 10:19 AM
#100
Thread Starter
Turbo SR20deT Son!
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 790
Likes: 0
From: North. dallas(Texas)
Police report came out and proved by camera , which I couldn't get a copy of it, that the tow guy ran the light and that's why my car was hit. They have declared the car a total loss and I should hear something today for a settlement offer.