23109VC

lots of cool porsche talk here..

my mainpoint was that the 911 was fun, had good power, but for how much it cost, given how oldit was, and being off warranty - i kind of felt like it was too much money for nto enough performance.

it would surely outrun an 8 - but i kindo f felt that for a daily driver car the 8 could be had a lot cheaper and would probably be a better commuter car.

used 911 w/50k miles = 35-40k

used rx8 with 10-15k miles ON warranty = 15-20k.

imput1234

iTrader: (6)

I disagree, our RX-8 is a very good sport cars. But the 911 is defiantly a better sports car all around, whether your looking at specifications on paper, or if you drive the car and look at the feeling the car gives you, I'm sure the 911 will be better. It is not all pure ego, I love sports cars and I love the feeling that cars give me, I don't look at 0-60 or 1/4 timing, I drive cars and see how they appeal to me. I've never driven the mighty 911, but from all the reviews and videos and listening to it live, I'm sure it will be a much more responsive car, and will be an all around much better car than ours. I consider the 911's especially the GT3 to be one of the best sports cars around.

tajabaho1

Well, my dad used to have a boxster S, and seriously, cool factor wise 2003 boxster pwns the rx-8 in the ***, well, but his car and mine is just as fast, but seriously, my point is that
if it comes to buying a porsche, or a mazda, I would alllllwayyys buy a porsche, its just.........a porsche.....

imput1234

iTrader: (6)

I'm not much of a Boxter fan, although I'm sure it is a great car, I would rather have an S2000 over it, the only Porsche I'm in LOVE with is the 911 and the Carreara GT (yeah the expensively ones, lol)

N10S

I was on a road trip this past weekend and came across a great looking late 80's vintage 911 on the highway. I have always been a fan of 911's since I was a youngster, and as I passed the 911 in my Rx8 I was thinking how I still need to buy one. One of my personal favorites is the late 80's 3.2 with the factory turbo-look body kit. Decent NA power and that raw fun-to-drive feeling you only get in certain cars. These cars still command a price in the $18k-30k range, but for me represent a great value in a fun-to-drive car that has a timeless cool factor that is tough to beat.

One other car I have owned and would consider owning again is a BMW MCoupe. For me the older 911's, MCoupe, and RX8 all represent no compromise sports cars that are all great values especially when weighing the cost against fun factor to own/drive.

Flynbri

iTrader: (1)

Not true at all. The '99 T/A produced 305 hp (310 after 2000) or 320 hp (325 after 2000) in the WS-6 "Ram Air" version The afforementioned and pretty rare Firehawk LT4 made by SLP and sold through Pontiac dealerships, had 330 hp (335 after 2000, 345 in late 2002 models. A 350bhp version of the Firehawk was produced but that was in '92 and only 25 were built. It also might be interesting to note that average quarter-mile elapsed times for the Fourth Generation Firebirds were reported as 15.2 seconds at 90 mph for V6-equipped vehicles , and 13.4 seconds at 106 mph for those with the V8. All V8 versions of the T/A from '93-'02 displaced ~350 cubic inches (or 5.7L) so perhaps thats what you were thinking.

Sorry, I know this was way off topic...didn't mean to threadjack you but if we're going to make comparisons, we should have good numbers...

CarAndDriver

Testarossa

Hyperborea

I used to own an '88 944 Turbo and the RX-8 is very comparable in performance and handling to it. When I test drove the RX-8 my first thought was that this was just like the 944T except new and with a warranty. The biggest performance difference is that the RX-8 has a more linear, smoother power delivery rather than the sudden kick in the back that the turbo gives. The back seats in the RX-8 are also really useable whereas those in the 944 are just for children and people that you dislike. The hatchback in the 944 though was really useful for hauling stuff.

The 944T was priced at ~$40K with the options mine had in 1988. When you take inflation into account that's about $70K in today's dollars. Today you can get the RX-8 with the same performance for ~$25K plus a lot better amenities and safety features (though the 944T had dual airbags and ABS in '88). Of course it's no longer one of the fastest cars in the world as it was when it debuted in '86. The price of performance continues to get cheaper and it's pretty much at the point that most people can buy a car more powerful and capable than the driver can handle or if they can handle it then more than they can sanely use on the street.

23109VC

the point of my thread wasn't really to say an RX8 is as good or as cool as a 911.

if someone said I could have a new RX8 or a new 911... c'mon, that's a no brainer.

my point was more that I got to test drive a 1999 911. I've never driven a 911 before until this one. I have driven a 2000 base boxster...and after driving both the boxster and the 911 - they seemed very similar to me. the 911 was NOT as fast as I was expectign it to be. given that the boxster i drove has only 217 hp..and the 911 is 295... i was expecting more thrust..but the 911 is also a few hundred pounds heavier than the boxster i drove... i honestly think the boxster I drove handled BETTER than the 911. the boxster i've driven a lot has 18s and the upgraded suspension...probably akin to what the S models have..but the motor is the 217 hp base engine.. the boxster is more tossable..

but the point being..this friend of mine paid $32k for this 911. and it has over 50k on the odometer. no warranty. it's fun...but not as much speed as I was expecting.

given that I could pick up a super low mileage RX8 for maybe $20k.... and still have warranty coverage..or a NEW one for 25-26k...loaded up with warranty... and i'd have to spend antoher $10k for a car that is yes..cooler...yes faster..but honestly, not as BAD or as FAST as you think it is.... and have probably piles of maintenance issues..that will cost you an arm and a leg...

my gut was that while my heart would want the 911...it sounds cool handled great and hey, it's a porsche... but if I really look at the big picture.. cost of the two cars, and the perormacne of each. and the FUN factor of each, i think i'd spend the money on teh RX8 and not the used 911....

my bottom line opinion is the late 90s 911 s aren't NOT worth the $$$ they cost. very cool cars..but for what you get, what you will have to pay in repairs, insurance, etc... compared to what you can get... it's ONLY worth it if you *have* to have a "porsche"... if your goal is fun factor and bang for the buck..it's not even close.

8 all the way. heck, even an S2000 would be more bang for the buck too.

tajabaho1

I guess it all depends on the driver and your values, if you like classy stuff, and got money to support your taste, go ahead, or if you thought it over and want to get a newer car, well go ahead, as for me, if I can sell my rx-8 for 23-24k I would go buy a boxster like my dad, I really love them

911SC

If all that matters is bang for the buck get a Neon SRT.

eforer

The M coupe was a lovely car! IMO there hasn't been a more desireable BMW made since. That car was awesome to drive, and reasonable to live with too. I wanted to get one so bad, but they are a bit too old now for it to be a good investment as a daily driver. I test drove one before I pulled the trigger on the 8. I hadn't driven one in 3 or 4 years, and it still felt as fast and lively as I remembered it.

Are you serious? I don't ever know how to respond to illogical unwavering brand loyalty like that. Unless car companies start paying me to drive there cars, I'm going to make decisions based on actual virtues of the vehicle and not the "cool factor." Yes, I'm sure your dad's boxster s "pwnd" your rx8, but bear in mind your rx8 is an auto, and that pretty much cuts what little sack the rx8 has right off.

Ike

I've actually been looking for a '01 or '02 M coupe the last couple weeks. If I can find a good one for a decent price I might pull the trigger. Problem is I don't think it's going to happen since what I'm looking for is pretty rare. It's all for the better though, I'm just going to want a new STI or Evo in a year anyhow.

eforer

The evo X looks promising. I think it will really bring the evo up a notch in terms of interior quality etc. I like the styling of the new lancer too. So it should look really sharp.

tajabaho1

yup, how much to convert to manuaL?

CarAndDriver

I love the 944 Turbo.

Carrera26

Obviously by my handle I am a big time Porschephile, but I am not going to go all fanboy on them either. They have some real quirks, especially with all that weight in the rear, and are therefore a more intimidating car to drive fast. It simply takes a better driver with some specific 911 experience to get the most out of a 911. In the hands of someone who doesn't know what they are doing it can feel like it just alternates between sulky understeer and sudden snap oversteer.

With the right driver, though, there isn't much that can keep up with a 911 on track. There's a ton of torque and superb top end, tons of feel, world-class braking, controls that are better metered than any other car I have ever driven, and peerless traction out of corners. Use that engine weight, set up the (911 specifc) right line and just romp on it coming out of a curve and you rocket down the straight.

As is often mentioned, probably the best feature of the RX-8 is it's ability to be driven fast very easily, and that is a fantastic quality to be sure. With the right driver in a 996, one who can unlock it's ability, good luck. There's a reason it's by far the most successful GT/production race car of all time.

eforer

While I agree the 911 has merits inspite of some inherient flaws (which have certainly been diminished to point of non-existent with the 996/997 cars), I would say that the argument that they are superior cars due to their sports and GT racing success is flawed. Porsche has always recognoized the marketing value of their racing programs, and has always supported their customer teams in a way that no other manufacturer has. I think there attitude and financial interests in sports/gt car racing has more to with their success than the merits of the car. Thats not to say the car isn't awesome, its just that their racing results are a product of many factors beyond just car.

I don't care what anyone says about the pre 996 cars though, the trailing throttle oversteer on those beasts is friggin' terrifying. Great street cars, but I'd like something I can trail brake with for the track.

eforer

You'd probably be better off trading it in on a manual. I'm sure there is someone out there who wants an auto the way you want the manual. Base MT cars go for a song now anyways, so if you have a GT or something you'll have some economic leverage there too.