oosik

I was a semi-regular on these forums right after spending the $31,600 on my blue 8 in October '03, dealing with the initial power and mpg issues, getting the venerable canzoomer mod(which is collecitng dust if anyone wants it). Having it serviced at Mazda dealerships during the course of its 4 year span so far, for no other reason that if I had to sell it or trade it, there would be maintenance trail for anyone to see that it was taken care and had everything done to it that was necessary.

At the start of '03 when I saw my first pic of the 8 in some car rag, I knew I was going to have one some day....that day came a lot sooner as I got side-swiped in my suv. Dropping $10k as a down payment, I was a happy man.

Has that changed after 4 years? yes and no. I still love the car and the way it looks. Living in northern NC for the past 3 years I have had some opportunity to run it out on back country roads, a lot of fun. Also living in the area I am in now, after 3 years, it's still the only RX8 in the area. Every once in a while, I'll see a brethren 8 roaming about, but I stake claim to my territory and run them off. It's definitely a niche car to say the least.

That said, there are some glaring issues that I haven't been able to get over. The occasional full-on stalls at traffic lights, the extremely noticeable power loss after long drives or when its very hot outside minus the air conditioner. And most of all, probably my biggest complaint and major annoyance that seems to go hand in hand with the hot-air-reduced-power-issue, that "bearings in a can sound". Sorry, I don't care if it's normal, I don't care if all 8's do it, it's horrendous and unacceptable for a $30k+ car. Last but not least, knowing it's not any kind of 0-60 car, the lack of umph! Believe me, I know all about the high revs and power range, I occasionally find myself tooling around town in 3rd gear alone just for that reason. But I've dealt with it and moved on. The mpg is still quite pitiful. The car has stalled on me about 6 times over the past 4 years.....6 times too many in my book.

The only major thing I have had to do so far is change the tires. Purchaing a full set of Avons, based on ratings vs price, they have held up well, though not performing as well as the OEM set, they've done what I needed them to do. Though I see my first brake job coming soon.

Never at any time, even when the car stalled at lights and didn't want to start back up, even when the ratteling marble can was at max volume, did I regret buying it. I love it! BUT, I would never recommend this car to anyone based on my experiences versus price, it's not worth it. The money I spent wasn't worth what I got in the end, but again, I don't regret it. I have enjoyed it and I guess that's what matters.

So I am now 3 months away from it being payed off, finally I can start saving money again. My 8 will stay with me for as long as I deem necessary. I see now that there are butt load of mods and DITY threads, maybe I can give them a shot.

If anything I would suggest someone get a pre-owned as I don't think it's worth buying new.

Old Rotor

I have had a problem with Detonation or MIAC (Marbles In A Can - sound). I went to mid-grade or prem gas and the problem went away. The other day I tried a very simple way to stop coolant from going threw the Throttle Body and now I can run reg-87oct again without detonation! I was surprised this simple one min-fix worked so well! I did what "dsmdriver" suggested on this page he's #52.

https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-do-yourself-forum-73/diy-throttle-body-bypass-mod-36389/page3/

oosik

Spent 2 years in Alaska, so yes, that is where oosik came from. As a matter of fact I have one...........................sitting on my mantle with an eagles head carved into one end.

The "teething problems" were not a real concern as I knew they would eventually be ironed out......except they haven't. I still get that horrid sound and there is definitely a power problem when the engine gets hot that no dealer will touch unless there is an associated CEL.

Don't get me wrong, I still love the car and the thing still turns heads, even when it's dirty.........if they were able to fix these problems with the '07/'08 models why am I still having to deal with them?

New Yorker

OMG, those problems are NOT "normal" for any modern car, including the 8! Who told you they were?!? Most 8 owners have never experienced any of them, including me. (Well, actually there IS one place where those problems would be called "normal"—the odd world known as "RX8Club.com"! )

mysql101

The issues oosik described sound like classic symptoms of needing a new engine.

mdw1000

Yeah, might want to try out a different service department to get their opinion on it. Try to look for suggestions from others in your area for which ones are good/bad.

oosik

Yup...it just stalled on me the other day, not what, 2-3 days after my original post...it took me 4 attempts at grinding away on the starter to get it running again and once running i had to keep on the gas pedal slightly just to make sure it didn't do it again. I was 1.5 miles from home.

I'm taking it to Mazda tommorrow for routine maintenance, I"m going to try and put them on the spot again. The service center in Chespeake that I use have been quite forgiving in a lot of areas and have been very respectful. Their 8 tech has always been willing to chat with me when I had questions, so i have nothing against them.

i also read that thread about the idel vibrations.....I noticed them right after the last flash. All this time I just attributed it to crappy idle that I've had the majority of the time.....maybe I shouldn't be so non chalant about it.

a question for anyone that reads this far............in regards to TSP's......once the drivetrain warranty is up in 5000 miles, will I have to pay for TSP fixes?

dmc27

TSB's are usually for specific complaints and will contain end dates +/- mileage limits to be fixed for free, so it can vary from one TSB to the next. Chances are they won't want to do any of them free after warranty, and you'll have very little leverage to get them free.

More important is the stalling & power loss issues you have. You need to request (demand) that a compression test be done on your engine. MySQL is right - the problems you describe are the same ones that have resulted in engine replacements for members here. The compression test *should* have been done when you had the recall done last year (which it sounds like you did), but they would only have done this test if you had previously complained about powerloss/rough idle +/- stalling (also sounds like you did - but maybe they ignored or just told you that it was normal). Sounds like you should seriously consider a different dealership and do it before you are out of warranty!!

Raptor75

You obviously haven't heard that the RX-8 engines aren't breaking down and all these stories of engine replacements were started by a jealous Honda owner. They never occurred, all those member on this list who claim they have had engine failures are under some type of mass hallucination. RX-8 just don't break down especial the engines.

Raptor75

Have you brought the car in for the engine replacement recall. Oops sorry I forgot the engines aren't really failing, I mean the emission recall?

NoRotorNoMotor

I've had zero issues w/ mine.

But it's funny --- I just experianced the " marbles " thing for the first time ever over the weekend!!! And oddly enough it was the ONLY time I accidently filled the car up with 87.... I was at a gas station that I had to stop at ... or risk running out of gas ... and they were waaayy overpriced ... so I was only going to put a few gallons in... got a phone call ... and well the tank filled up. ARRRGHHH!!!

New Yorker

Where do you get this ****? Some RX-8 engine are being replaced. Just like a handful of BMW M3 engines, and Toyota engines, and Nissan engines. If you took a chance and bought an RX-8 the very first year it came out—the '04 model—your probability of having engine problems, or any problems, are pretty good. Brand new cars tend to have teething problems; any idiot knows that. (Oops, did I say "any idiot"?? I stand corrected. )

LionZoo

Do a search for marbles in a can folks. It's been well discussed and it seems there are a variety of different causes.

Raptor75

It's called observation and common sense, give it a try some time.

So you suddenly have the inside information on the number of engine failures from the cars makes you mentioned compared to the RX-8, excellent! Please share with us if you would, most of us have been unable to obtain this information. I guess you have an inside track to this information because I know you not the type of guy to ramble on blindly with out any proof.

Any new model will have teething problems and then there are problems that go beyond your basic teething problems. The amount of traffic on this board relating to engine problems has been higher then any others car make I have seen in recent time. Perhaps you can show me one that is higher, but I really don't think so. There is very good reason to believe that carbon build up will continue to take out RX-8 engines as time goes on. Maybe I'll be proved wrong with time but your foot stamping and ranting isn't going to change the reality of carbon build up. This guys post is another example, his engine problems could be a poster child for the symptoms of RX-8 engine replacement.

Sorry to keep popping your bubble, reality's a bitch isn't it.

Razz1

Replace your plugs, replace the battery, check the CAT

Rx Eight 7s

I bought my 04 in August of 03 and had ZERO problems with it beyond one flooding incident. I ran mostly 87 octane gas and never heard the marbles in a can symptom that some have reported. I drove my car 12 months a year and the winters are pretty harsh here in the Adirondack mountains of northern New York State. I had all the reflashes and got the new plugs and starter (which seemed to have cured my flooding issue very well). My car never stalled - Hell, it never even idled erratically.

Last month I took my 04 (with 35,000 miles) in to Mazda for a scheduled oil change (mine are free due to the false hp/free maintenance issue) and shortly after I left the dealership my low oil light came on. Of course I pulled over immediately, but when I checked the dipstick it showed no oil level. I had the car towed back to the dealer and they found a "broken" oil line going to the oil cooler. Ironic that it just happened to break immediately after leaving the dealership after an oil change

Long story- short, I decided the safe move would be to trade in my 04 for a new 07 and got a great deal so I'm happy again. I have been driving the 07 for about a week now and I have noticed a couple of small differences, but nothing remarkable. The car rides more quitely than the 04 (new tires), stops more quickly (new brake pads), and smooth clutch engagement is a bit easier (new clutch) (does anyone know if Mazda refined the tip-in programming?).

I have not filled up yet, but I suspect the mileage will be the same (18 to 20 mpg) I always got. Basically, this 07 is as good or slightly better than the 04, but I can't complain about either car.

My point is that the problems you are having are NOT normal. You get a skewed perspective on RX-8Club since this is where everyone goes to complain, but the vast majority of folks have not had the problems you have had. Make Mazda fix your car so it runs perfectly. Letters and emails and phone calls to MNAO do get listened to and if you are reasonable and professional about it they will work with you to fix your car.

Good Luck and Happy Rotoring

kersh4w

iTrader: (3)

the problems you've been having are not normal. and if the dealer refused to service/look at your engine just because there as no cel, looks like you've got something even if your car is past warranty. complain to mazda of north america, and maybe you can get these problems fixed, and quite possibly a new engine.

also, start going to a different dealership. i dont know how much choice you have.

dmc27

um, can you two maybe contain your bickering to one thread?

oosik

Thanks for taking the time to read and advise, here's my update on my service today.

Told them what was up with teh stalling and hard start issue the other day and that this is about the 6th time over 4 years that the car has stalled. I also mentioned power loss issues,once again. Then the the other routine stuff, ie.e oil change and such.

The service manager said he noticed the idle right off the bat when I pulled in, he could hear and 'see' it.

Time goes by...........

I go back to pick it up:

They changed the oil for FREE. They said it was pretty gunked up and made sure I understood that I stick with the 3000 mile change, at least. I always understood, but living 45 miles from the service center and having to take a day off work just to get it done doesn't always cut it. (Could I do it myself, YES. But during the course of being under warranty I'd rather have a service center do it so there is always a record of it being done...no question). But I did keep up with having it topped off as necessary.

Engine mounts! I had thought about this, but never mentioned it to them. They have 2 on order. They said that the mounts have a tendency to resolve a bunch of issues, that 'maybe' it could fix a power-loss & idle issues. No guarantee, but worth a shot. The rx8 tech apparantly suggested, as a last resort (so not today), to consider getting new trailing plugs installed @ $275.00. He didn't want me to spend the money today as they are not 100% sure it would resolve anything and don't want me to waste the money if it's not necessary, but said, if the plugs are badly fouled that could be a reason why and should be considered.

Myself and the manager had a lengthy discussion about this engine and the possbility of needing a new one. He said he just changed 2 this week and that it is possible. So they are not against doing just that. As I would expect, and as I have done in my job, take care of things incrementally, if that doesn't do it then go for the big guns.

So what they want me to do is, get the mounts installed when they come in. Drive it around for little bit and see how things go. If it didn't resolve any power-loss/stall/idle issues, break down and spend the $275 for the trailing plugs. Then if it's still an issue, look towards the big guns of it being a bigger issue, i.e. engine change. The manager said, "Do I think you will have bigger problems down the road based on what has happened so far? Yes. But let's work to that point and see if we can't find a simpler solution along the way. I'd rather we spend Mazdas money first before your money and before we do anything drastic." I'm not totally against this logic so I'm willing to wait it out. ESPECIALLY, since they informed me that my drivetrain warranty is good to 60,000 miles, as opposed to the 50,000 miles I thought it was. My biggest fear originally, was have the car crap out at 50,500 miles, be out of warranty and have to fork over cash for a new engine. So I'm a little bit relieved for now.

Like i said in an earlier post, this service center has been very professional and courteous and I"m confident they are not looking to screw me. The manger even suggested taking it to another Mazda service center to get another opinion, if I so desired.

5miles away from the service center, I could feel the lag in power, I cut teh a/c off and it was still there....so I'm going to wait it out a bit as I still have time on the warranty. I'm not even putting 1k miles on my car a month, though I will be doing a bit of driving to NJ in the short term.

anyway, thanks for reading if you actually read though this whole thing! We'll see what happens.

dmc27

Right. The 4206F "emissions" recall extended the warranty to 5 years \ 60k.

Did you discuss the compression testing? Sounds like they're being ok, or at least straightforward with you. But there's just no reason NOT to do the compression test while they have the car in there. While it's great for you to get the mounts done and some other stuff, it makes no sense to wait on compression testing.

I don't think anyone else mentioned it - check out the TSBs here. The 8th one down is the warranty info you should have got in the mail.

dmc27

Oh, and don't let Mazda rape you. It would be cheaper to buy a jack, jackstands, and plugs - and you'd still have $$ left over for tons of beers to drink when you're done. There's a DIY in the tech section on how to do it. If nothing else, find a local shop and get a quote there - it'll probably save you a ton of $$$$$.

shaunv74

Also $275 for trailing plugs is a ridiculous price. They should be less than 1 hour labor and $30-$40 per plug and you have 2. At the most it should be $130.

dmc27

dats what I was talkin bout, yo.

shaunv74

^^For some reason your last post didn't show up when I wrote mine. +1 for doing it yourself and having more money to drink beer.

oosik

I didn't even think about the compression testing at the time.

In the case of the plugs.....I'll look it up and see what's up, thanks. I'll push the comression check when I go in for the mounts.


edited: I just checked a thread on the changing the plugs, but guess what, no one ever distinguishes the part number difference between the two plugs and someone refers to the leading but provides info on the trailing.....makes no sense.

SO, if someone can just provide the correct p/n info for the trailing plugs, you will simply my life instead of me guessing what ppl are referring to.