SPORTY but not SPORTS?
09-07-2007, 11:40 AM
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SPORTY but not SPORTS?
Some of the people tell me that RX8 is a sporty looking car but not a sports car because it has low torque. I dont know if I should tell them that they dont know what it takes to be a sports car.
Many cars that give a lot of "push back" have a big difference between their torque peak and their torque lows. The RX8 has very little drop in its torque from its peak @5500 rpm and @8500 rpm, its highest power.
Even though a lot of torque is fun, its not what defines a sports car. A sports car should continuously deliver high power to weight ratio so that you can be really fast at the same time you should be able to handle your car really well. Considering that(with a 160 pound-foot torque) RX8 does very well in a quarter mile in only 14.5 sec, where as cars with 280 foot pound torque can get as good as 13.5 sec. But take the race to little bit more than a quarter mile and a little curves on the road and you know who the winner is!
Talking about being a SPORTS CAR
For more information on why torque should be sustained there is a popular link
http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html
Many cars that give a lot of "push back" have a big difference between their torque peak and their torque lows. The RX8 has very little drop in its torque from its peak @5500 rpm and @8500 rpm, its highest power.
Even though a lot of torque is fun, its not what defines a sports car. A sports car should continuously deliver high power to weight ratio so that you can be really fast at the same time you should be able to handle your car really well. Considering that(with a 160 pound-foot torque) RX8 does very well in a quarter mile in only 14.5 sec, where as cars with 280 foot pound torque can get as good as 13.5 sec. But take the race to little bit more than a quarter mile and a little curves on the road and you know who the winner is!
Talking about being a SPORTS CAR
For more information on why torque should be sustained there is a popular link
http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html
09-07-2007, 11:51 AM
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Drag racing has never been one of the criteria for a sports car. In the real golden age of sports cars in the 50s and 60s, the criteria included two seat, open top, no roll-up windows. And, more than anything else, something that could be raced. Not that you had to race it, but that it could be raced.
And racing in that sense was road racing. SCCA. LeMans. Mille Miglia.
Creature comforts were accepted through the 60s. It was OK to have roll-up windows, a roof, carburetors and electrics that worked. Small back seat was OK. But the basic criteria of a sports car being something that can be road raced - or feels like it could - remains.
There are a lot of people who say "sporty car" instead of "sports car." The important thing is to not drive something that can be called a "sport's car."
Ken
And racing in that sense was road racing. SCCA. LeMans. Mille Miglia.
Creature comforts were accepted through the 60s. It was OK to have roll-up windows, a roof, carburetors and electrics that worked. Small back seat was OK. But the basic criteria of a sports car being something that can be road raced - or feels like it could - remains.
There are a lot of people who say "sporty car" instead of "sports car." The important thing is to not drive something that can be called a "sport's car."
Ken
09-07-2007, 12:01 PM
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Just ask them if they think a lotus exige is a sports car. When they say "yes", which they will, tell them the torque specs are the same. Then tell them they're an idiot, and shouldn't breed.
09-07-2007, 12:24 PM
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The misses was at a car show last week when a couple of the highy tanned neck persuasion walked up, "A lot of those in the midwest", looked at the placard on her windshield and told her that her car was no sports car. Even the guys with the Dodge Challenger parked next to her bust out laughing. 
09-07-2007, 01:17 PM
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I would classify the rx8 as a sports car, thats how it was marketed...
But i guess i missed the brochure that said its main purpose was carting kids to soccer practice and loading the huge trunk with groceries. The high performance engine and near 50/50 weight distribution with 4 wheel huge disc brakes are just to look cool when you're parked at the supermarket. And the 9000rpm redline was just a sticker you could order to make it look faster. And they used carbon fiber for the driveshaft because there was a back order on their first choice of concrete.
But to be honest you own a mazda rx-8, you shouldn't talk to people that drive a car worth less then yours, let alone people that drive mini vans and civics. Their opinion doesn't count.
But i guess i missed the brochure that said its main purpose was carting kids to soccer practice and loading the huge trunk with groceries. The high performance engine and near 50/50 weight distribution with 4 wheel huge disc brakes are just to look cool when you're parked at the supermarket. And the 9000rpm redline was just a sticker you could order to make it look faster. And they used carbon fiber for the driveshaft because there was a back order on their first choice of concrete.
But to be honest you own a mazda rx-8, you shouldn't talk to people that drive a car worth less then yours, let alone people that drive mini vans and civics. Their opinion doesn't count.
09-07-2007, 01:26 PM
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09-07-2007, 01:28 PM
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A lot of people argue about what makes a sports car, but that is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Torque?
I can think of a vehicle with 2 seats, rear wheel drive, and more torque than a corvette -- a diesel pickup truck.
The bottom line is that most people know a sports car when they see it. The RX8 is a sports car. The only time the definition gets blurry for me is when I think about an EVO or STi or some BMWs. I won't commit either way with these types of cars.
Interestingly, though, I don't consider Camaros and Mustangs sports cars because they're muscle cars.
"Sporty cars", IMHO, are GTI, Mini Cooper S, Civic SI, Mazdaspeed3, etc.
I can think of a vehicle with 2 seats, rear wheel drive, and more torque than a corvette -- a diesel pickup truck.
The bottom line is that most people know a sports car when they see it. The RX8 is a sports car. The only time the definition gets blurry for me is when I think about an EVO or STi or some BMWs. I won't commit either way with these types of cars.
Interestingly, though, I don't consider Camaros and Mustangs sports cars because they're muscle cars.
"Sporty cars", IMHO, are GTI, Mini Cooper S, Civic SI, Mazdaspeed3, etc.
09-07-2007, 01:38 PM
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09-07-2007, 01:41 PM
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09-07-2007, 01:45 PM
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Power!!
The misses was at a car show last week when a couple of the highy tanned neck persuasion walked up, "A lot of those in the midwest", looked at the placard on her windshield and told her that her car was no sports car. Even the guys with the Dodge Challenger parked next to her bust out laughing.
09-07-2007, 05:23 PM
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The idea behind the RX-8 is that it handles so well you can take 90 degree corners at 40mph without so much as squealing the tires. If you can exit a turn without loosing significant velocity, you no longer need to punch the accelerator to get back up to speed.
There are a couple guys at work who have mustangs that they've tricked out pretty well. Whenever they ask me to race them, I say "sure, but we're doing it on a mountain road, not the straight aways behind the office."
None of them have taken me up on the offer. I wonder why...
There are a couple guys at work who have mustangs that they've tricked out pretty well. Whenever they ask me to race them, I say "sure, but we're doing it on a mountain road, not the straight aways behind the office."
None of them have taken me up on the offer. I wonder why...
09-07-2007, 05:34 PM
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"Sports car" is a term long contested over by people who all have their own definitions of it. You seem to have run into the kind of people that think a sports car has to be made in the US with a live rear axle.
09-07-2007, 06:47 PM
#20
the only true us sports car is the corvette.
that car is absolutely awesome. it is also the only american car i'd consider buying.
crossfire=mercedes, so not american
what about the pontiac solstice/saturn sky? does anyone here consider that a sports car? anyone here driven one? also, anyone ever noticed the absolutely horrible job they do the convertible tops? look near the back trailing edges of the next one you see. look closely at the trailing edge. http://blogs.edmunds.com/.ee94799/cm...edded..ee947a3
that car is absolutely awesome. it is also the only american car i'd consider buying.
crossfire=mercedes, so not american
what about the pontiac solstice/saturn sky? does anyone here consider that a sports car? anyone here driven one? also, anyone ever noticed the absolutely horrible job they do the convertible tops? look near the back trailing edges of the next one you see. look closely at the trailing edge. http://blogs.edmunds.com/.ee94799/cm...edded..ee947a3
09-07-2007, 07:12 PM
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Sports car (rx8, 350z, corvette, s2k, rustang, etc) =
-2 doors (rx8 still has 2-door looks)
-rwd or awd
-faster than the average car (better performance #s than more than half of other cars on road)
Sports sedan (evo, sti, m5, etc) =
-4 doors (rx8 still has 2-door looks)
-rwd or awd
-faster than the average car (better performance #s than more than half of other cars on road)
Sporty car (gti, ms3, cooper) =
-anything not in above categories but still faster than the average car (better performance #s than more than half of other cars on road)
-2 doors (rx8 still has 2-door looks)
-rwd or awd
-faster than the average car (better performance #s than more than half of other cars on road)
Sports sedan (evo, sti, m5, etc) =
-4 doors (rx8 still has 2-door looks)
-rwd or awd
-faster than the average car (better performance #s than more than half of other cars on road)
Sporty car (gti, ms3, cooper) =
-anything not in above categories but still faster than the average car (better performance #s than more than half of other cars on road)
09-07-2007, 08:49 PM
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