US RX-8 sales (not good)
#352
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Originally Posted by 9291150
Are YOU serious?
#354
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turbo engines are made to make low power NA because they emphasize durability, they use stronger heavier parts that can wistand a lot of boost. vs a non FI engine that emphasize light wieght parts that can rev higher and make as much hp as possible NA at the expense of toughness. its a pointless comparison to compare vs the NA form of a FI engine thats designed to make very little power NA by defualt.
#355
i pwn therefore i am
Originally Posted by 9291150
Are YOU serious?
https://www.rx8club.com/rx-8-discussion-3/fyi-rotary-displacement-clear-up-84388/#post1268746
#356
I feel this is wrong..since you could say the same thing for the FD. Flagship car, company image, most people still think of the 7 when they think Mazda, even though the miata has outsold them all. Sounds like they are having problems like the 7, without the price of the car skyrocketing like the FD did in the mid 90's due to exchange rates going nuts. Early blown engines in the auto's, even if blown out of proportion by this forum and the panic mode it went through.
Although it's glad to see that the 8 has sold better than the FD, which sold around 15K over the 3 years we could get them.
Tim
05 RX-8
93 RX-7
91 RX-7
89 RX-7 TII
yeah, I love the rotary RX cars
Although it's glad to see that the 8 has sold better than the FD, which sold around 15K over the 3 years we could get them.
Tim
05 RX-8
93 RX-7
91 RX-7
89 RX-7 TII
yeah, I love the rotary RX cars
Originally Posted by Roaddemon
Like the Vette is for Chevy, the rx8 is the halo car of Mazda. It's a good car and I doubt it matters in sales,if they are flying off the shelf. Mazda will keep producing them and improving them as years go by. The overall Mazda sales will carry the 8. The rx8 draws attention to the whole mazda lineup and helps put Mazda in the forefront. The 8 is good PR for the linup and makes Mazda look good.
#359
Don't forget that Mazda has a new and unique manufacturing technology. They can build either the Miata or the RX-8 in the same factory. They can literally say we need 10k more RX-8's and have the factory start cranking them out in a day or two. When their done, a day or two later they can crank out Miata's again. It's a pretty sweet setup.
#360
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Originally Posted by spieder
Don't forget that Mazda has a new and unique manufacturing technology. They can build either the Miata or the RX-8 in the same factory. They can literally say we need 10k more RX-8's and have the factory start cranking them out in a day or two. When their done, a day or two later they can crank out Miata's again. It's a pretty sweet setup.
#361
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Originally Posted by spieder
Don't forget that Mazda has a new and unique manufacturing technology. They can build either the Miata or the RX-8 in the same factory. They can literally say we need 10k more RX-8's and have the factory start cranking them out in a day or two. When their done, a day or two later they can crank out Miata's again. It's a pretty sweet setup.
And what are the chances of a Renesis ending up in a Miata?
#362
Originally Posted by 9291150
Whats your point Ike? The renesis won in 2003 and 2004, and only now did it finish 4th, but ahead of a Porsche.
By the way, this is kind of fitting on Oscar night, your Evo or STI wasn't even nominated...nor has it ever won. That damn acadamy must hate tubo fours.
By the way, this is kind of fitting on Oscar night, your Evo or STI wasn't even nominated...nor has it ever won. That damn acadamy must hate tubo fours.
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Originally Posted by Roaddemon
People cross shop here because the rx8 is a 4 passenger crossover sportscar.
Originally Posted by Roaddemon
If vehicle platform makes no difference, and they don't need a sportscar platform then the econobox platform sportscar like the STi may be for them.
Originally Posted by Roaddemon
The rotary catastrophically out performs an ordinary turbo 4 cylinder like your sti. The 1.3 is putting out 176 hp/liter compared to your 2.5 turbo 4 banger 120hp/liter. Even with your turbo and twice the displacement you can only squeeze out 70 more hp. Add the V10 like smoothness and drivability of the rotary and your STi is dead meat in any comaprison.
Originally Posted by Roaddemon
I compare my 8 to the Z350, S2000,z4, G35 and porsche boxer. All of them true sportscars created on sportscar platforms...That's what it's all about
#364
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Originally Posted by BlueEyes
How was that attempting to bash the 8? he, as I was, pointing out that if you're going to compare displacements with a pison engine, the Renisis has to be considered a 2.6L engine.
How was that attempting to bash the 8? he, as I was, pointing out that if you're going to compare displacements with a pison engine, the Renisis has to be considered a 2.6L engine.
Last edited by rotary crazy; 03-06-2006 at 07:32 AM.
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Originally Posted by sti_eric
So, then it's agreed. STi/Evo vs RX-8 comparisons are valid because of the number of people that cross shop them.
Platform does not make a difference. The only thing that makes a difference is the finished product. I would rather have the vehicle that is the superior finished product than the one that starts out better but in the end is a failure.
Ricer math will do you no good here. This is the kind of arguement supplied by riced-out Civic owners. The fact is, the STi has much more USABLE horsepower than the RX-8. For the RX-8 to have any power, you have to keep the RPMs above 7000. For this reason, the STi handily beats out the RX-8 in the driveability category.
I asked you to supply the list of cars that the RX-8 compares FAVORABLY to. The RX-8 is outperformed by all of these and is outhandled by all except the 350Z/G35. The only thing favorable about the RX-8 is that it isn't as much car as any of these, so it is much cheaper. Also, let me get this straight...other 4-door, 4-seat sports cars that are similarly priced (STi/Evo) are not in the same class as the RX-8, but 2-door, 2-seat convertibles that cost up to twice as much are? Get a clue. Oh, and it's Boxster, not Boxer. Boxer is the engine that is in all Subarus and Porsches.
Platform does not make a difference. The only thing that makes a difference is the finished product. I would rather have the vehicle that is the superior finished product than the one that starts out better but in the end is a failure.
Ricer math will do you no good here. This is the kind of arguement supplied by riced-out Civic owners. The fact is, the STi has much more USABLE horsepower than the RX-8. For the RX-8 to have any power, you have to keep the RPMs above 7000. For this reason, the STi handily beats out the RX-8 in the driveability category.
I asked you to supply the list of cars that the RX-8 compares FAVORABLY to. The RX-8 is outperformed by all of these and is outhandled by all except the 350Z/G35. The only thing favorable about the RX-8 is that it isn't as much car as any of these, so it is much cheaper. Also, let me get this straight...other 4-door, 4-seat sports cars that are similarly priced (STi/Evo) are not in the same class as the RX-8, but 2-door, 2-seat convertibles that cost up to twice as much are? Get a clue. Oh, and it's Boxster, not Boxer. Boxer is the engine that is in all Subarus and Porsches.
I disagree with all your stated stupidity. And Platform makes a huge difference or we'd all be driving sport eoconoboxes. Porsche would be out of bussiness. niether Subaru or mitsu make a factory sportscar platform. They don't have the resources, technology, engineering and $$$. They borrrow their econobox platform instead. When they make a real sportscar you buy one you can post all you want here. I doubt you'll be able to afford one anyway. Until then there's no comparison. Your just a basher here.
#366
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Originally Posted by spieder
Don't forget that Mazda has a new and unique manufacturing technology. They can build either the Miata or the RX-8 in the same factory. They can literally say we need 10k more RX-8's and have the factory start cranking them out in a day or two. When their done, a day or two later they can crank out Miata's again. It's a pretty sweet setup.
#367
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1.3liter=1.3liter. No way around it. How it makes it's power in that 1.3 liter makes no difference. You can't change the size to 2.6 even though it makes that kind of power or more. It's still a 1.3l in size. A 2.6L would not fit inside our cars. That's part of the rx8 formula that makes it such a great sportscar on par with much more expensive sportscars.
#369
I live in Orlando, and I've seen about 10 in my area. I guess the area has something to do with it. I havent seen any commercials for the RX8. Maybe if Mazda publicised it, sales would jump?
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Originally Posted by spieder
Don't forget that Mazda has a new and unique manufacturing technology. They can build either the Miata or the RX-8 in the same factory. They can literally say we need 10k more RX-8's and have the factory start cranking them out in a day or two. When their done, a day or two later they can crank out Miata's again. It's a pretty sweet setup.
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Originally Posted by saturn
I thought every RENESIS was built by hand. Can they really crank them out that fast?
#372
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Originally Posted by Tyblat
I live in Orlando, and I've seen about 10 in my area. I guess the area has something to do with it. I havent seen any commercials for the RX8. Maybe if Mazda publicised it, sales would jump?
Yeah, the whole no commercial thing seems odd to me as well as many others. I'm not sure if that makes a big change in sales, but it's pretty clear that the 8 isn't known outside the automotive community all that well and commercials would help. Who knows -- maybe Mazda likes the air of mystic.
#373
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Originally Posted by sti_eric
The fact is, the STi has much more USABLE horsepower than the RX-8. For the RX-8 to have any power, you have to keep the RPMs above 7000. For this reason, the STi handily beats out the RX-8 in the driveability category.
I asked you to supply the list of cars that the RX-8 compares FAVORABLY to. The RX-8 is outperformed by all of these and is outhandled by all except the 350Z/G35. The only thing favorable about the RX-8 is that it isn't as much car as any of these, so it is much cheaper.
I asked you to supply the list of cars that the RX-8 compares FAVORABLY to. The RX-8 is outperformed by all of these and is outhandled by all except the 350Z/G35. The only thing favorable about the RX-8 is that it isn't as much car as any of these, so it is much cheaper.
So based on my experience, the RX8 is more fun and drivable in many ways (though, if I could get the STI for $24k, I probably wouldn't have an RX8 today).
Anyway, as far as "usable horsepower" goes, are you talking competition or everyday driver? Yep, on a track there are situations where you can get bogged down in a car with a narrow power band (and it's common knowledge that the STI will own the RX8 in almost any competition event). But on the street, I think the "useable" power issue is overstated.
First off, for every 3000 pounds worth of vehicle you hardly ever use more than 150 hp (if that) in every day driving. You only need 30-40 hp to maintain highway speed and accelerating around town doesn't require much either. I found that my wife's old Civic 5-speed had no trouble in city traffic while driving more powerful cars was usually just an example of excess. On the highway, if you're driving a high-revver like the ITR, S2k, or RX8, you simply downshift more.
Don't get me wrong... is it fun to step on it and get pushed back in your seat? Sure, and you don't get that in the RX8. And If you don't like needing to shift on the highway, clearly the RX8 is a poor choice. But it's misleading to say that "the STi handily beats out the RX-8 in the driveability category".
As far as favorability goes, are there any other non-FWD cars sold in the USA that have 4 seats while weighing less than 3000 pounds? (the base RX8 6MT is 2880) How about with 4 doors? Or 50:50 with low COG, low yaw moment, and nimble and balanced dynamics? Or a comfortable ride? Or tight steering? Smooth short-throw 6-speed? Responsive throttle? For less than <$25k? (common street price of RX8 6MT is $23k-$24k)
#374
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Originally Posted by Deslock
Every car is a compromise and extra cost is not the STI's only disadvantage. I've driven the 2005 STI and it was awesome: silly fast, excellent brakes, excellent grip and handling. However, it wasn't as balanced or responsive as the RX8, it understeered more (but not as much as I expected), its shifter was mediocre, and its ride was much stiffer (to be fair to the STI, I only had 20 minutes behind the wheel and I only took it up to 100 MPH - we did, however, go 130 when I was in the passenger seat).
So based on my experience, the RX8 is more fun and drivable in many ways (though, if I could get the STI for $24k, I probably wouldn't have an RX8 today).
Anyway, as far as "usable horsepower" goes, are you talking competition or everyday driver? Yep, on a track there are situations where you can get bogged down in a car with a narrow power band (and it's common knowledge that the STI will own the RX8 in almost any competition event). But on the street, I think the "useable" power issue is overstated.
First off, for every 3000 pounds worth of vehicle you hardly ever use more than 150 hp (if that) in every day driving. You only need 30-40 hp to maintain highway speed and accelerating around town doesn't require much either. I found that my wife's old Civic 5-speed had no trouble in city traffic while driving more powerful cars was usually just an example of excess. On the highway, if you're driving a high-revver like the ITR, S2k, or RX8, you simply downshift more.
Don't get me wrong... is it fun to step on it and get pushed back in your seat? Sure, and you don't get that in the RX8. And If you don't like needing to shift on the highway, clearly the RX8 is a poor choice. But it's misleading to say that "the STi handily beats out the RX-8 in the driveability category".
As far as favorability goes, are there any other non-FWD cars sold in the USA that have 4 seats while weighing less than 3000 pounds? (the base RX8 6MT is 2880) How about with 4 doors? Or 50:50 with low COG, low yaw moment, and nimble and balanced dynamics? Or a comfortable ride? Or tight steering? Smooth short-throw 6-speed? Responsive throttle? For less than <$25k? (common street price of RX8 6MT is $23k-$24k)
So based on my experience, the RX8 is more fun and drivable in many ways (though, if I could get the STI for $24k, I probably wouldn't have an RX8 today).
Anyway, as far as "usable horsepower" goes, are you talking competition or everyday driver? Yep, on a track there are situations where you can get bogged down in a car with a narrow power band (and it's common knowledge that the STI will own the RX8 in almost any competition event). But on the street, I think the "useable" power issue is overstated.
First off, for every 3000 pounds worth of vehicle you hardly ever use more than 150 hp (if that) in every day driving. You only need 30-40 hp to maintain highway speed and accelerating around town doesn't require much either. I found that my wife's old Civic 5-speed had no trouble in city traffic while driving more powerful cars was usually just an example of excess. On the highway, if you're driving a high-revver like the ITR, S2k, or RX8, you simply downshift more.
Don't get me wrong... is it fun to step on it and get pushed back in your seat? Sure, and you don't get that in the RX8. And If you don't like needing to shift on the highway, clearly the RX8 is a poor choice. But it's misleading to say that "the STi handily beats out the RX-8 in the driveability category".
As far as favorability goes, are there any other non-FWD cars sold in the USA that have 4 seats while weighing less than 3000 pounds? (the base RX8 6MT is 2880) How about with 4 doors? Or 50:50 with low COG, low yaw moment, and nimble and balanced dynamics? Or a comfortable ride? Or tight steering? Smooth short-throw 6-speed? Responsive throttle? For less than <$25k? (common street price of RX8 6MT is $23k-$24k)
GOOD ONE
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Originally Posted by Deslock
They are built by hand (or at least they were as of 2 years ago). However, the engine is very easy to assemble compared to a piston engine.
I thought only the very early models were hand built. I'm pretty sure it's all assembly line now.