US RX-8 sales (not good)
03-02-2006, 02:26 PM
#126
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i must say that what made me buy the 350z befor the rx8 was the z movie. i mean i remember it was a reguler day at the movie theater waiting for it to play. and then all of the sudden all what i read on the big screen is that " this video is made with no sound effects and the streets were closed" and all what i c is orange 350z flying through france for good five minutes. truely i was impressed 
one week later, i sold the wrx and got a 350z with the same color. mannnn i would never forget that video. but anyways now i have a rx8 and its wonder ful i love it ALOT. but you do need commercials, something that will make poepe know that it has an engine that is only found in future air planes.
one week later, i sold the wrx and got a 350z with the same color. mannnn i would never forget that video. but anyways now i have a rx8 and its wonder ful i love it ALOT. but you do need commercials, something that will make poepe know that it has an engine that is only found in future air planes.
03-02-2006, 02:57 PM
#127
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Originally Posted by Raptor75
While the competitors have been getting small increases in HP over the years the RX-8 has been going down. Originally 250 then 238 no 232.
03-02-2006, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Exegeses
Bascho.... I think you need to sell your 8 and get an Acura TL...
Also... As a doctor, studies have shown that the hand-free link does not decrease car accidents... (although it may increase the car's coolness factor)...
Also... As a doctor, studies have shown that the hand-free link does not decrease car accidents... (although it may increase the car's coolness factor)...
I hate Honda!!! and the 8 is nicer than a TL (my wife's friend has one and she always makes comments about how much nicer my Shinka is) The RL is waaay nicer than the 8.....but again, I would never own a Honda.
I don't hate the 8.....just the one I am leasing
but that is because of all the problems I've had. I am not putting down the 8 as a car.....I am angry with Mazda for not doing more with the 8 in 2006. Besides, if you're a regular around here, you'll know that once my lease is up I am getting a Shelby GT500.
03-02-2006, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by djseto
For the millionth time, the move from 238 to 232 is not a loss of HP. It was manufacturers moving to the SAE standard for how to calculate it. If you drive a 6sp right now, it has 232 not 238. A lot of other cars "lost" HP to this new standard. The 250 to 238 was an actual loss due to emissions restrictions
Perception of lost power is what hurts sales. People are not concerned with the details....only headlines. Perception is a bitch.....just ask Ford, GM and DCX. Ford is considered a greedy American carmaker obsessed with only selling gas guzzling SUV's ..........HA!!! Toyota has just as many SUV nameplates....they just don't sell as well.
03-02-2006, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by djseto
For the millionth time, the move from 238 to 232 is not a loss of HP. It was manufacturers moving to the SAE standard for how to calculate it. If you drive a 6sp right now, it has 232 not 238. A lot of other cars "lost" HP to this new standard. The 250 to 238 was an actual loss due to emissions restrictions
I was looking at the sticker on a 2006 S2000 and noticed the rated HP is now 237. I think it was 250 last year. It lost 13 hp just like that with the new SAE standard.
03-02-2006, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Roaddemon
I was looking at the sticker on a 2006 S2000 and noticed the rated HP is now 237. I think it was 250 last year. It lost 13 hp just like that with the new SAE standard.
That's because some Japanese automakers have been lying asshats trying to make it look like they make more hp then everyone else. You'll notice that many of the American brands saw hp improvements with the new system. The ZO6 went from 500 to 505 and the Shelby GT500 went from 450 to 475.
03-02-2006, 03:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Ryan13b
The weird thing is that nobody really reported on the HP changes.
For one, Toyota with their old 3.0 in the Camry lost a TON of power. From like 220 down to 182 or something. That means they were overstating their power by about 30.
For one, Toyota with their old 3.0 in the Camry lost a TON of power. From like 220 down to 182 or something. That means they were overstating their power by about 30.
The Japanese automakers pay the press to keep that **** on the DL. Just like when Toyota/Honda have a recall......3rd page into the paper in small print. Ford has a recall and it's front page in BOLD PRINT.
03-02-2006, 03:50 PM
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Can't say that I agree with much said in this thread.
1. Gas milage. A few people that obviously have issues with their car complain that they are getting 12mpg and now the 8 has bad gas milage? I get around 22 on average with mine, it goes down a little if I flog the heck out of the car but not a lot. Besides people don't look much at mpg when they buy a sports car! I also think a significant portion of us in the north store the car a third of the year anyway. I mean who is dumb enough to buy a rear wheel car with summer tires and try to drive it in the snow? It takes on an extra $400-700 right away for tires if you do that and people are worried about gas milage? $400-$700 is a lot of tanks of gas.
2. Rotary Engine. Well this one is obvious. If your an enthusiast then it's a plus, otherwise it's a BIG BIG BIG negative. The average person would have to be foolish to buy a rotary over a piston engine. You have regular maintenance issues, repair cost issues, finding anyone who can actually repair it or knows anything about it, and on and on.
3. Looks. The 8 is definately a look at me car, almost as much as an STI and an EVO. Most people are not bold enough to buy it in the first place. It isn't girly cute car, it's not a bug, it's not a mini, it's not a PT Loser, it's aggressive.
4. Design/Sports Car Issues. The trunk is small, the back seats are small, the tires are expensive, the ride is harder, it doesn't seat 7, it doesn't sip gas, it doesn't yell out "PRACTICAL". Most people are scared to have fun driving, they consider it a stressful chore.
5. Mazda. Mazda as a brand isn't that impressive to begin with. When people talk relaible cars it's honda/toyota, when people talk inexpensive it hyundai and kia, when people talk muscle it's all american, when people talk rice it's honda, mitsu, nissan, toyota, when they talk luxury it lexas, cadallac, infiniti, BMW, when they talk sports cars it's porche, ferrari, aston, corvette, viper. All mazda has that is notable is the miata and the rotary and the rotary is generally considered a negative by most people and the solstace and sky are better looking than the plain jane miata.
6. Torque? Americans have to have more!! Yah right, how much torque does a honda civic or a toyota prius have? Not much and they sell great in america.
7. Auto tranny. If you buy an auto tranny you should be slapped and your license taken away unless your handicap.
What does that leave you with? A niche car by a small manufacturer that sells about 1000 units a month. I wouldn't be suprised if the 8 was killed next year, I wouldn't be suprised if it was had some styling refreshes done. It would be foolish to take it back into the factory FI domain. It's not a halo car, it's not a flagship car. It's a mid-level sport coupe who's history is one of engines with poor reliability mostly in moderately performing sports cars.
In summary it's a tech geek with kid's sports car. That's a niche car if there ever was one but it fits the niche perfectly.
As far as Shinka goes the kids are not allowed to wear shoes in the car or eat in the car or eat before going in the car or bring crayons in the car or markers or..... They will sit nice straight and proper or else they wont get any more rides where they can yell "go faster dad, almost hit the tree again dad, make mom sick again dad, can I see 100 again dad?..."
Uh oh there goes my warantee...
1. Gas milage. A few people that obviously have issues with their car complain that they are getting 12mpg and now the 8 has bad gas milage? I get around 22 on average with mine, it goes down a little if I flog the heck out of the car but not a lot. Besides people don't look much at mpg when they buy a sports car! I also think a significant portion of us in the north store the car a third of the year anyway. I mean who is dumb enough to buy a rear wheel car with summer tires and try to drive it in the snow? It takes on an extra $400-700 right away for tires if you do that and people are worried about gas milage? $400-$700 is a lot of tanks of gas.
2. Rotary Engine. Well this one is obvious. If your an enthusiast then it's a plus, otherwise it's a BIG BIG BIG negative. The average person would have to be foolish to buy a rotary over a piston engine. You have regular maintenance issues, repair cost issues, finding anyone who can actually repair it or knows anything about it, and on and on.
3. Looks. The 8 is definately a look at me car, almost as much as an STI and an EVO. Most people are not bold enough to buy it in the first place. It isn't girly cute car, it's not a bug, it's not a mini, it's not a PT Loser, it's aggressive.
4. Design/Sports Car Issues. The trunk is small, the back seats are small, the tires are expensive, the ride is harder, it doesn't seat 7, it doesn't sip gas, it doesn't yell out "PRACTICAL". Most people are scared to have fun driving, they consider it a stressful chore.
5. Mazda. Mazda as a brand isn't that impressive to begin with. When people talk relaible cars it's honda/toyota, when people talk inexpensive it hyundai and kia, when people talk muscle it's all american, when people talk rice it's honda, mitsu, nissan, toyota, when they talk luxury it lexas, cadallac, infiniti, BMW, when they talk sports cars it's porche, ferrari, aston, corvette, viper. All mazda has that is notable is the miata and the rotary and the rotary is generally considered a negative by most people and the solstace and sky are better looking than the plain jane miata.
6. Torque? Americans have to have more!! Yah right, how much torque does a honda civic or a toyota prius have? Not much and they sell great in america.
7. Auto tranny. If you buy an auto tranny you should be slapped and your license taken away unless your handicap.
What does that leave you with? A niche car by a small manufacturer that sells about 1000 units a month. I wouldn't be suprised if the 8 was killed next year, I wouldn't be suprised if it was had some styling refreshes done. It would be foolish to take it back into the factory FI domain. It's not a halo car, it's not a flagship car. It's a mid-level sport coupe who's history is one of engines with poor reliability mostly in moderately performing sports cars.
In summary it's a tech geek with kid's sports car. That's a niche car if there ever was one but it fits the niche perfectly.
As far as Shinka goes the kids are not allowed to wear shoes in the car or eat in the car or eat before going in the car or bring crayons in the car or markers or..... They will sit nice straight and proper or else they wont get any more rides where they can yell "go faster dad, almost hit the tree again dad, make mom sick again dad, can I see 100 again dad?..."
Uh oh there goes my warantee...
Last edited by Umbra; 03-02-2006 at 03:53 PM.
03-02-2006, 03:57 PM
#134
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Originally Posted by Umbra
Can't say that I agree with much said in this thread.
1. Gas milage. A few people that obviously have issues with their car complain that they are getting 12mpg and now the 8 has bad gas milage? I get around 22 on average with mine, it goes down a little if I flog the heck out of the car but not a lot. Besides people don't look much at mpg when they buy a sports car! I also think a significant portion of us in the north store the car a third of the year anyway. I mean who is dumb enough to buy a rear wheel car with summer tires and try to drive it in the snow? It takes on an extra $400-700 right away for tires if you do that and people are worried about gas milage? $400-$700 is a lot of tanks of gas.
2. Rotary Engine. Well this one is obvious. If your an enthusiast then it's a plus, otherwise it's a BIG BIG BIG negative. The average person would have to be foolish to buy a rotary over a piston engine. You have regular maintenance issues, repair cost issues, finding anyone who can actually repair it or knows anything about it, and on and on.
3. Looks. The 8 is definately a look at me car, almost as much as an STI and an EVO. Most people are not bold enough to buy it in the first place. It isn't girly cute car, it's not a bug, it's not a mini, it's not a PT Loser, it's aggressive.
4. Design/Sports Car Issues. The trunk is small, the back seats are small, the tires are expensive, the ride is harder, it doesn't seat 7, it doesn't sip gas, it doesn't yell out "PRACTICAL". Most people are scared to have fun driving, they consider it a stressful chore.
5. Mazda. Mazda as a brand isn't that impressive to begin with. When people talk relaible cars it's honda/toyota, when people talk inexpensive it hyundai and kia, when people talk muscle it's all american, when people talk rice it's honda, mitsu, nissan, toyota, when they talk luxury it lexas, cadallac, infiniti, BMW, when they talk sports cars it's porche, ferrari, aston, corvette, viper. All mazda has that is notable is the miata and the rotary and the rotary is generally considered a negative by most people and the solstace and sky are better looking than the plain jane miata.
6. Torque? Americans have to have more!! Yah right, how much torque does a honda civic or a toyota prius have? Not much and they sell great in america.
7. Auto tranny. If you buy an auto tranny you should be slapped and your license taken away unless your handicap.
What does that leave you with? A niche car by a small manufacturer that sells about 1000 units a month. I wouldn't be suprised if the 8 was killed next year, I wouldn't be suprised if it was had some styling refreshes done. It would be foolish to take it back into the factory FI domain. It's not a halo car, it's not a flagship car. It's a mid-level sport coupe who's history is one of engines with poor reliability mostly in moderately performing sports cars.
In summary it's a tech geek with kid's sports car. That's a niche car if there ever was one but it fits the niche perfectly.
As far as Shinka goes the kids are not allowed to wear shoes in the car or eat in the car or eat before going in the car or bring crayons in the car or markers or..... They will sit nice straight and proper or else they wont get any more rides where they can yell "go faster dad, almost hit the tree again dad, make mom sick again dad, can I see 100 again dad?..."
Uh oh there goes my warantee...
1. Gas milage. A few people that obviously have issues with their car complain that they are getting 12mpg and now the 8 has bad gas milage? I get around 22 on average with mine, it goes down a little if I flog the heck out of the car but not a lot. Besides people don't look much at mpg when they buy a sports car! I also think a significant portion of us in the north store the car a third of the year anyway. I mean who is dumb enough to buy a rear wheel car with summer tires and try to drive it in the snow? It takes on an extra $400-700 right away for tires if you do that and people are worried about gas milage? $400-$700 is a lot of tanks of gas.
2. Rotary Engine. Well this one is obvious. If your an enthusiast then it's a plus, otherwise it's a BIG BIG BIG negative. The average person would have to be foolish to buy a rotary over a piston engine. You have regular maintenance issues, repair cost issues, finding anyone who can actually repair it or knows anything about it, and on and on.
3. Looks. The 8 is definately a look at me car, almost as much as an STI and an EVO. Most people are not bold enough to buy it in the first place. It isn't girly cute car, it's not a bug, it's not a mini, it's not a PT Loser, it's aggressive.
4. Design/Sports Car Issues. The trunk is small, the back seats are small, the tires are expensive, the ride is harder, it doesn't seat 7, it doesn't sip gas, it doesn't yell out "PRACTICAL". Most people are scared to have fun driving, they consider it a stressful chore.
5. Mazda. Mazda as a brand isn't that impressive to begin with. When people talk relaible cars it's honda/toyota, when people talk inexpensive it hyundai and kia, when people talk muscle it's all american, when people talk rice it's honda, mitsu, nissan, toyota, when they talk luxury it lexas, cadallac, infiniti, BMW, when they talk sports cars it's porche, ferrari, aston, corvette, viper. All mazda has that is notable is the miata and the rotary and the rotary is generally considered a negative by most people and the solstace and sky are better looking than the plain jane miata.
6. Torque? Americans have to have more!! Yah right, how much torque does a honda civic or a toyota prius have? Not much and they sell great in america.
7. Auto tranny. If you buy an auto tranny you should be slapped and your license taken away unless your handicap.
What does that leave you with? A niche car by a small manufacturer that sells about 1000 units a month. I wouldn't be suprised if the 8 was killed next year, I wouldn't be suprised if it was had some styling refreshes done. It would be foolish to take it back into the factory FI domain. It's not a halo car, it's not a flagship car. It's a mid-level sport coupe who's history is one of engines with poor reliability mostly in moderately performing sports cars.
In summary it's a tech geek with kid's sports car. That's a niche car if there ever was one but it fits the niche perfectly.
As far as Shinka goes the kids are not allowed to wear shoes in the car or eat in the car or eat before going in the car or bring crayons in the car or markers or..... They will sit nice straight and proper or else they wont get any more rides where they can yell "go faster dad, almost hit the tree again dad, make mom sick again dad, can I see 100 again dad?..."
Uh oh there goes my warantee...
I guess your entitled to your lousy opinion. I disagree with alot of it.
03-02-2006, 04:11 PM
#135
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you have to give it to mazda for sticking with the rotary engine, just because sales slump it doesn't mean that they're going to abandon it, most of their concepts feature a rotary in some form, and over 30 years after their first rotary car they still keep making them and perfecting the engine after everyone else gae up on it. That basically proves that they're not going to kill that line of cars just like that.
I see RX-8s at least once a day if not more, and the mazda dealer in my town doesn't have too much trouble selling them. I don't see them killing off the RX-8 because of lower sales, it's not like it's the third gen. RX-7 with it's reliability issues for the standard driver.
But I do think that the main reason it doesn't sell well is the engine, I mean I don't even know where I'd find someone who would know how to fix the engine. because any other way you look at it the RX-8 is an absolute deal: cheap, completely gorgeous and a lot more practical than most sports cars out there.
On another point, they're even selling the RX-8 in south america now (chile) where they never offered any of the RX-7s or any other rotary powered car for that matter, and people are buying them in equal numbers as the 350Z (Z cars have always been high selling in chile) even though there are probably ZERO mechanics that know how to fix them, so they'll depend on the dealer for all their services (bad idea)
I don't think we'll see the RX-8 die anytime soon, I just hope that that RX-9 concept never gets made because I'll have to hate mazda then... god it's hideous!
I see RX-8s at least once a day if not more, and the mazda dealer in my town doesn't have too much trouble selling them. I don't see them killing off the RX-8 because of lower sales, it's not like it's the third gen. RX-7 with it's reliability issues for the standard driver.
But I do think that the main reason it doesn't sell well is the engine, I mean I don't even know where I'd find someone who would know how to fix the engine. because any other way you look at it the RX-8 is an absolute deal: cheap, completely gorgeous and a lot more practical than most sports cars out there.
On another point, they're even selling the RX-8 in south america now (chile) where they never offered any of the RX-7s or any other rotary powered car for that matter, and people are buying them in equal numbers as the 350Z (Z cars have always been high selling in chile) even though there are probably ZERO mechanics that know how to fix them, so they'll depend on the dealer for all their services (bad idea)
I don't think we'll see the RX-8 die anytime soon, I just hope that that RX-9 concept never gets made because I'll have to hate mazda then... god it's hideous!
03-02-2006, 04:15 PM
#136
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Originally Posted by Soloseven
Total RX-8s sold in the US as of Feb 28, 2006: > 52,044 <
03-02-2006, 04:17 PM
#137
My Rex goes to 11!
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Originally Posted by Roaddemon
I was looking at the sticker on a 2006 S2000 and noticed the rated HP is now 237. I think it was 250 last year. It lost 13 hp just like that with the new SAE standard.
sae is now 237.
03-02-2006, 04:21 PM
#138
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I blame the media for the gas price craze. Too many people are too easily influenced by what the media says on a daily basis to really think for themselves. Do our cars get great gas mileage, no, are they better than most of these SUV's out there, YES.
I think the main problem is the day of the enthusiast car buyer are so far in the past that just about everyone has forgotten them. Look at cars like the Camaro, Firebird, GTO, etc. Gone, gone, almost gone. The Mustang is around partly due to the fact that Ford spends huge amounts of money advertising it, and always has. The fact that rental fleets eat up the base 6's and verts doesn't hurt either.
Too many buyers have no passion, they just buy the mainstream Honda's, Acura's, and Toyota's. It is pretty sad when Toyota has probably the most bland line-up of vehicles (mainstream, whatever you want to call it) and they sell the most vehicles. SAD, just SAD. I for one choose the 8 because of its uniqueness, partly because I am an enthusiast and I think there are others on this forum that fall into that category as well. I wish I had the money to be like Leno and have a collection of all the cars I am passionate about. I would still have the 8 and I would still drive it a lot. It begs to be driven and I for one thank Mazda for having the cajones to build it.
I think the main problem is the day of the enthusiast car buyer are so far in the past that just about everyone has forgotten them. Look at cars like the Camaro, Firebird, GTO, etc. Gone, gone, almost gone. The Mustang is around partly due to the fact that Ford spends huge amounts of money advertising it, and always has. The fact that rental fleets eat up the base 6's and verts doesn't hurt either.
Too many buyers have no passion, they just buy the mainstream Honda's, Acura's, and Toyota's. It is pretty sad when Toyota has probably the most bland line-up of vehicles (mainstream, whatever you want to call it) and they sell the most vehicles. SAD, just SAD. I for one choose the 8 because of its uniqueness, partly because I am an enthusiast and I think there are others on this forum that fall into that category as well. I wish I had the money to be like Leno and have a collection of all the cars I am passionate about. I would still have the 8 and I would still drive it a lot. It begs to be driven and I for one thank Mazda for having the cajones to build it.
03-02-2006, 04:43 PM
#139
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Originally Posted by Roaddemon
I guess your entitled to your lousy opinion. I disagree with alot of it.
03-02-2006, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Go48
Yup, just as you are entitled to your opinion. I happen to agree with most of what he said.
03-02-2006, 06:34 PM
#143
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I had a 2004 rx8 which I loved but the air conditioning could not be made to run cool enough. Gas milieage was never better than 17 around town but that was okay for the fun I had. Finally, sold it (got tired of sweating in North Carolina summer) and bought 2005 TL. Great sedan, absolutely perfect, comfortable, quiet, fast, decent handling great gas mileage. One problem, it didn't make me want to drive. Tested a few new rx8's and see that air conditioning seems to have been fixed. Sold the TL and now have another rx8. Not smart financially but I can afford it and now I want to drive again. A car either does it for you or it doesn't; not much else matters.
Last edited by stickman; 03-02-2006 at 06:46 PM.
03-02-2006, 06:47 PM
#144
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Originally Posted by Ryan13b
I get over 20 no matter how I drive. ~24 if I'm all highway.
They addressed and fixed the 'problem'
They addressed and fixed the 'problem'
I think the problem with people "getting" really low MPG is the fact that they are stupid and haven't the slightest clue how to calculate it, as evidenced by the numerous threads on here about MPG and how they arrived at their numbers. I think that, more than anything is the problem. User error. Pure and simple STUPIDITY.
03-02-2006, 06:49 PM
#145
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Originally Posted by BunnyGirl
I think the problem with people "getting" really low MPG is the fact that they are stupid and haven't the slightest clue how to calculate it, as evidenced by the numerous threads on here about MPG and how they arrived at their numbers. I think that, more than anything is the problem. User error. Pure and simple STUPIDITY.
<-- me
03-02-2006, 06:50 PM
#146
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Originally Posted by bascho
Boobies are nice.....but I actually enjoy the articles too.
When was the RX8 advertised in C&D? not recently that's for sure. I've only been a subscriber for about 13 months......so if Mazda advertised in C&D back in 2004 I wouldn't know. If you can, please provide the issue #......I'd like to check out what the ad looked like.
When was the RX8 advertised in C&D? not recently that's for sure. I've only been a subscriber for about 13 months......so if Mazda advertised in C&D back in 2004 I wouldn't know. If you can, please provide the issue #......I'd like to check out what the ad looked like.
I thought you were a butt man.
Anyways, I saw three different adds for them in Automobile at my mom's dentist's office. I also saw some in a different car magazine than that at a different doctor's office.
Gee, maybe they only advertise them in medical professional's waiting room magazines.
03-02-2006, 06:56 PM
#148
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Actually, you may be right about a lot of people not knowing how to calculate gas mileage, but I do. The early rx8's did have lower fuel economy. Of course it varied greatly depending upon how the car was driven. The good news is that on the new one I just bought my very first tank got 18mpg as compared to the first tank on my early 2004 which got 13 mpg. I fully expect to get into the 20's with this one as it breaks in.
03-02-2006, 07:05 PM
#149
Lowest mileage I've gotten in 268 on a tank. Best has been 308 miles. I'm averaging about 285 miles.
I could get an extra 100 miles with a Mazda 3, but I'd miss so much fun.
I could get an extra 100 miles with a Mazda 3, but I'd miss so much fun.
03-02-2006, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by BunnyGirl
I think the problem with people "getting" really low MPG is the fact that they are stupid and haven't the slightest clue how to calculate it, as evidenced by the numerous threads on here about MPG and how they arrived at their numbers. I think that, more than anything is the problem. User error. Pure and simple STUPIDITY.
Consumer reports and Autoweek's long-term tests of the car yielded 13.8 and 13 MPG. You think they don't know how to calculate it either?
Fact is that the 8 gets sh*tty gas mileage. You either live with it or not, but I'm tellin you for consumers who get 15 MPG, when they're expecting 20, they're paying an extra $5K per 100K miles. For those getting 12 MPG, they're paying an extra $10K and for the truly unlucky getting 10 MPG, they're paying an extra $15K. And if gas averages more than $3/gal over those 100K miles, then these numbers go up.
Now I don't know about you, but when I bot this car, I considered it a long-term keeper. I thought I'd put 200K miles on her and let her die on me in 10-15 years. I don't think I'll be doing that now. Not selling tomorrow, but I don't see keeping her past 50K miles.