Rotarian...what's really funny is I posted my last post before reading your last post.

Since you have tried to change the system, it's quite ironic!

 

HaHa! I'm not a very fast typer I guess.

I refer back to one of my previous points. Most salespeople don't
control the pricing. A Manager (who gets paid on the overall department or dealership) normally does. I've seen customers "walked" at $1500.00 profit because it wasn't deemed at the normal or avarage amount!

 

Beaner, to answer your question, I'd sell any car for $300 under sticker but (and you there was a "but") whether the manager would is up to him, that's his call to make. Very few managers would let someone walk over a couple hundred dollars. If a salesmanager knows that tomorrow someone else will buy the same car for $300 more than you he might let you walk. At our dealership only a few of the 28 inbound RX-8s are still available, and several of the ones that are deposited on have backup deals written on them already in the event the original buyer falls through. That may not be the case everywhere.

By the way, you're all right that dealers haven't had all the most up to date information on the RX-8, which is one reason people like me watch this board. We do what we can. This site is probably the best source of information I have on the car, and it's because of this site I like to think I know more about the comings and goings of the RX-8 than any of the other salespeople at my dealership. Of the 8 RX-8s I have taken deposits on, I have called every customer repeatedly and sent mailers with every update we've had on the car. I even send mailers to the people that haven't put down deposits and just wanted up to date information on when the car would be available to see in person. Same with the rest of my sales staff.

My whole point with these posts was that salespeople and dealers aren't automatically out to screw customers. Car buying is supply and demand, prices vary. In this case, the demand outweighs supply, and people have to pay closer to that dreaded MSRP instead of closer to the beloved invoice price. Usually it doesn't work that way unless you're buying certain brands. No matter what you're buying though, find a good dealer and salesperson who you trust and you'll have someone willing to work with you and for you every time the chance arises. Sometimes the good customer/dealer relationship is worth more than the $50 you might save spending two days driving around to every dealer under the sun to compare prices, because here's another secret of car sales -- there's no price one dealer can give that another can't match.

 

JROB...thanks for your honest answer. Your sales manager is a butt then...he needs to learn the old saying "a bird in the hand is better than 10 in the bush."

I really don't think most customers want to screw you...but they do want to see that you are willing to give in a little. It just shows that you are not a greedy bastard who is trying to squeeze every penny out of them.

At least that's the way I am, I understand that the RX-8 is a hot car, and it would be stupid for me to come to you and ask for it for $300 over invoice. But I don't care if every dealer in the country is getting MSRP, I would still expect something off of MSRP, or you wouldn't get my sale. Even $100...it is really just a gesture of courtesy more than the actual value of the money. I am not ready to buy yet, but I know that my current salesguy would do that, just to maintain our relationship. (I am in there so much that I also have the same relationship with one of the sales managers, so that probably makes all the difference.)

I'm glad to see that you are like my current salesguy...you don't sweat the small stuff. Now if you can just talk a little sense into your sales manager...

 

Beaner, I think I misrepresented my salesmanager. I have seen him accept deals even I wouldn't have touched. That's why he's the salesmanager and I am not. Would he let someone walk over $100, $200, or $300 off sticker? I don't know, it depends on the situation and the customer. A general rule of thumb though is we're not going to lose a deal over a couple hundred bucks.

 

Many of you here are indeed young; as a 37 year-old my parents paid around $20,000 for the house I grew up in, brand new, in 1966...

 

i didnt read the replies but just seeing someone complain about msrp is just sad.

whats with all the cheap whiners?

everyone wants to get something for nothing i guess.

people are actually complaining about getting MSRP!?!? so let me get this straight, it is ok for us to buy cars below MSRP but it isnt ok for dealers to charge over MSRP? and now even MSRP is bad? get a life guys, if ur really that cheap then u really shouldnt be buying a car like this. go get ur self a civic or something and save 20g's and be happy.

 

Sorry, tribalazn2, but every single consumer guide (Consumer Reports, etc) suggests aiming for below MSRP. This is not people being cheapskates - it's part of the process of buying a car. It's up to the dealer to decide at what point to release the vehicle.

The question of this thread is whether or not we should all be mindlessly agreeing to the dealer's first offer (often MSRP), or whether we should play our part in the negotiations game... by negotiating.

 

Well, feel free to negotiate but also realize that as a hot car that most dealers have a waiting list for MSRP is a reasonable target given that unsavory dealers will likely be marking the car up $10K or more over MSRP (and really stupid people will pay it.)

In general after the car's been out a few years and everyone that wants one has one the price will go down.

A good example is the Honda S2000; for many years MSRP was the norm, if you could even find a dealer willing to sell you one for MSRP. Right now I can find one at at least four dealers in my area for at least $1500 off MSRP as a starting price...

 

Hey, pay what ever you want, I paid MSRP, filled out paper work, pick up tomorrow. Wait and pay below MSRP, what ever that will be in the future. I will have my car tomorrow. $5OO This way or that ain't going to matter in the end. $1 per month doesn't matter.:p

 

Now I know how I got to the 'ripe old age' of 50 without ever buying a new car.

I did try a couple of times, but was manipulated, tricked and flat out lied to.

I even thought that being on a dealers waiting list for 14 months, with a $1000 deposit down, would get me a fair deal. Then I get the inevitable call - "we have decided to sell them at $2400 over MSRP, take it or leave it."

Trust me, there wasn't a day of those 14 months went by I didn't think 'that was the stupidest thing I have ever done - put a deposit on a non-existent car, and wait for them to decide how much they are going to charge me".

Can I mention the dealers name one more time (Jarman Mazda, Edmonton) just in case anyone thinks they might fair better, and get the deal I was promised- "sure MSRP, maybe $850 for delivery and dealer prep, but bottom line will be MSRP!"

Thanks Steve, here's your generic vaseline back.
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doc

 

When you're shelling out the coin you earned, keep telling yourself - "MSRP is a bargain" "MSRP is a bargain".....

 

Are you actually paying for the car (or are not receiving assistance in one form or another from a family member)? If you are, why don't you get a good price and pay me the difference between that and MSRP? The following website has some good tips:

www.carbuyingtips.com

I've got three offers for the EVO (6,000-6,500 cars produced a year) at $1,000 BELOW MSRP plus financing that has beaten outside lenders by 1-1.5%. In addition, I have an offer from an out of state dealer for $500 over invoice (plus $350 for shipping/cost of driving/flying down). I am sure that within a month or two RX8s will be had for similar deals.

 

I have to say that I agree with you. I purchased my EVO at Dealer Invoice price (about $2,800 UNDER MSRP) at a time when the window sticker was going for $2,000+ OVER MSRP. So, it can be done. It does help to carry cash money and plop the check down on the table and say "that is all I am paying INCLUDING taxes, title, delivery, fees, etc. They just about fell all over themselves writing me a recipt and tossing me the keys.

Now that I have have the EVO for a month or so, I am tired of it and am reminded why I ordered an RX-8 in the first place. So, I think I might even trade in the EVO for the RX-8. Since my RX-8 will be here later this week, it is a good thing. I canceled my order, but I still got the book, all the e-mails and now the car in enroute. Still no buyer for it, so I will likley take it anyway. While I will likely pay MSRP as originally negotiated, I will likely let them make a few bucks taking the EVO off my hands.

The first cars of the boat look great. Let's hear some more about new owner experiences while the love affair is still hot.

 

That may be THEIR suggestion, to aim for below MSRP, but don't generalize, especially with vehicles (limited, first year, sought-after) like this. This is not a 2nd or 3rd year vehicle, or a vehicle like the Camry or some Honda that they are selling 100,000+ vehicles a year.

The dealer should charge what the market will bear. If it is above MSRP, then so be it. In many markets this seems to be the case. Frankly, I'm damn lucky that I'm paying only MSRP for mine. IMO, I didn't mindlessly agree to MSRP. I'm sure many others didn't either. I thought I was VERY smart. I knew the car could/would go for more, and I jumped at the opportunity to get it at MSRP.

Bottom line, if you want to play, you might have to pay.