DARKMAZ8

I get 25-27mpg all highway.

silverx8

There is a Z06 Corvette waiting for you. The Vette will be faster than anything anybody else will bring to the table. If that is the way that you feel about power, thats what you will end up in.

saturn

Yeah, but there's a difference between a $65k car and a $30k car. We're talking about wanting $3k-5k worth of more power -- not $35k more. I think a good portion of us would get FI, etc if we weren't scared about voiding the warranty.

I don't want to beat a dead horse, but if they could pull off FI and add that low end torque it's been missing, this car would be unstoppable. So many cars get bought instead of the RX-8 because of that one worry of power. It's got phenomenal handling, 50/50 balance (you just don't find that too often), 4 doors and seats, and looks like a Ferarri (at least according to the people in the "something stupid said" thread). I'm not saying it's not a great car, but if you can gain more power without sacrificing too much (and sacrificing a warranty is too much IMO) then how can you go wrong?

Raptor2k

My thoughts exactly, Saturn. The problem however is how to pull off reliable and emission-friendly consumer FI with a rotary engine. Also, it's difficult to measure pricing with FI. $3k-$5k for a supercharger, is it possible? How many more ponies can it give? Will we lose money? How do we approach the warranty? I have a feeling Mazda isn't even considering it, but I'd like to see what the aftermarket can deliver in the next year or so.

We are lucky enough that Mazda decided to produce another rotary.

Japan8

OK fellas...

I was going to wait until I could find some info in a second mag... try to confirm things more, but...

I was quickly flipping through a JDM mag last night and...

These guys have several inside sources which have confirmed several things.

Official development of the next RX-7 has begun during the last 6 months. If it has been going well or not... that's another story. No details about platform or what's under the hood... for God's sake... they just got started!

More power for the RX-8... from these sources there was talk of turbocharging, and then supercharging. There was talk of an increase in displacement through the use of wider rotors... but this was shot down because of the high retooling costs involved for production. Not sure what happened to the FI solutions... just kinda seemed to fade away. Then don't forget about the hybrid RE development... The magazine concluded that a power increase for the RX-8 doesn't look like it's going to happen.

Facelift... that's a definite. Most are talking about Oct/Nov 2006... MY2007 car it seems. This mag reports that the facelift will be "Kabura-like"...

Japan8

On another note... if Mazda wants to go FI... perhaps supercharging is the better solution... from a warranty/reliablility/etc. point of view. Not that T/C isn't reliable, but rather... as one person has pointed out on this forum... he likes to be able to just turn up the boost. From a corporate standpoint... that is a problem. A big one with the FD when it's system was overcomplicated and under-cooled. People just tossing on a boost controller and getting crazy without retuning the engine. Going with a supercharger wouldn't entirely stop this... just make it more difficult. Boost controllers won't help you here. Sure you can up the boost by swapping pulleys, but it's not as easy as a boost controller and just pushing a button. In terms of costs... well Ford does use both roots and twin screw S/C on various engines... the costs can be amortized across Ford Group if there is a parts bin S/C that'll fit the Renesis. A higher boost S/C could always be used on the next gen RX-7 too...

Gomez

Can't say I'll complain if the next RX-8 has Kabura-like features.....

brillo

Mazda has had a RX7 protoype ready for several years, now, I don't know what engine it would have, but I'd guess they already have a body style in mind.

Mazda could get by without any FI for the next RX7 if they would just spend the money lightening the platform. RX8 - 300lb = hold on to something. Not to mention better mileage and handling.

Weight is everything. Mazda needs to return to its roots for the 4th gen. simple, lightweight and cheap.

Japan8

^^ You'll get no argument from me on that one. I just wonder how they'd cut the weight if they use a RX-8/MX-5/Kabura platform as the base. Using exotic materials like Ti and CF would definitely help, but the costs would get a bit crazy. Something reasonably priced like the 1st gen was would be great, but a M3 killer wouldn't get any complaints from me either.

Raptor2k

I'm sure getting rid of the whole area that allows space for the back seats, and cutting the trunk in half, would make it lose a few pounds.

Actually, I'm not sure.

djgiron

I was thinking of something like say . . . an Elise with a rotary + a few more amenities would make a perfect Rx7.

zoom44

at 7stock one of the top Mazda Japan engineers said his wish right now is to put a Renesis in an Elise


i believe a new 7 (i think the protype done a couple of years ago has been dropped in favor of a new design) will be more like an elise

missinmahseven

I've been having visions of a 2-seat, M/R layout Rx for a few months now.. really, visions. I can *see* the layout (mine has a transaxle) in my head.

A 230 hp Renesis in a 2000-lb carbon-fiber 2-seat car would be just about right. :D

C'mon, mazda.. get daring.. but keep it affordable

Sapphonica

The blue-eyed devils at Ford won't let Mazda make a sporty car faster than the Mustang.

ASH8

I agree with what you say J8, i don't think we will see much improvement in the 8, re-HP.
The face lift 8 may though have some tweaking done to the tranny and diff ratio's...

I know I keep harping back, but, IMO Emissions are the first problem that Mazda have in anything Rotary Turbo, Supercharging, etc, then comes reliability?

An RX-7?, I don't think in name, perhaps an RX-9..

We all appear to be talking 2 Doors, again, why not a Rotary MX-5, or an MX-5 Hardtop with a rotary?, with outer sheet metal variant to the existing MX-5.

missinmahseven

I highly doubt that. IF that were the case, the Astons wouldn't be faster than the mustang -- and they are. By a long shot. That DB9 is race-worthy.

Besides, with the current state of things, I think Ford's in a position to *ask* mazda for advise, not dictate what Mazda can and cannot make

missinmahseven

As much as a Miata aficionado as I am, I just can't quite take the idea of a rotary miata to heart. Why? The miata is too big and heavy. (!)

Scratch-build a new 2-seat wankel car. Forget the 8, forget the miata. Build a 2000 pound car with an atmospheric Renesis. Forget FI. SUch a car would have better than 10hp/lb, would be immensely fun to drive, and the simpler it is, the cheaper and more reliable it'll be.

Which brings up this question... if the Wankel is so small, why on earth did the FD have the measurements it did, and why did it weigh 2700 pounds? I really hope the next 2-seater isn't like that.

I'm hoping for something *much* smaller and lighter. Really, a 2000 pound car with a 230 hp wankel. Man, that should just about do it. That should shut up every critic of the SA/FB, FC and FE. Hell, it'd probably make the FD boys look down at their shoes in shame. Without having to resort to squeezing the air in.

Size-wise, i'd be happy if it was a little smaller and lower than a miata. I really don't get why cars today are so.. portly. Do we have the Feds to thank for this?

Do we *need* all that heft in our sports cars?!

I mean really... a 2400 pound roadster? WTF?

(yes, I realize the miata's the lightest of the current roadster crop, yet I still have trouble swallowing the concept of a 2400 pound 'roadster'.. imagine how I feel about the stook, all 3000 pounds of it... or the Benz SLs.. those must be tickling two tons.. ugh.)

Japan8

You too huh? I keep having these thoughts of a mid-engine rear wheel drive rotary powered car. That'd be awesome.

As we've all be saying... drop it into the Kabura -based car... RX-3. Affordable rotary sports car. And the Elise killer... RX-7.

I'm sold on it (although I'd still buy an 8, because I like backseats).

Raptor2k

I can't stop drooling.

RX-Hachi

I'd take a 2400 lb sports car with 232 hp in a heart beat. I've forgotten what 2000 pounds feels like, except for one test drive of the Elise. But compared to the RX-8, the Miata does feel quite a bit lighter and even more nimble. If they really could make it 2000 lbs, so much the better.

I think modern safety, emissions, comfort and expected trim levels (a/c, stereo, electronic windows, alarm, leather, sun roof etc.) have all contributed to the weight gain of cars today. If one thinks the Miata is bad, then shoot, why does the S2K weigh 2800 lbs?

But while the Elise fits the bill, it's too extreme for me for its price. I thought seriously about getting one, but only as a third car. It's a 100% fun mobile, but that's all. If Mazda made something similar power/weight wise for half the Elise's price or less, it would be a hit with enthusiasts for sure. However, I wonder if it would still be too extreme for the public at large? Cars like that are meant to be driven hard, but as daily drivers, they get old really fast. (Or maybe I'm just getting old really fast.)

RX-Hachi

I was just in Tokyo last week on business. Flipped through a JDM mag (forgot the name) and they had a photoshop of a Kabura front end on a blue RX-8. As I'm not a fan of the Kabura's styling, the thing just looked horrid to me.

Japan8

^^ That was EXACTLY the article I was talking about.

Honestly... i didn't care much for that pic either (notice the current MS kit sides and MS Concept rear spoiler?). I'd rather stick with the current version...

Raptor2k

Can we get a scan?

RENESIS_NEENJA

I hope someone slaps some sense into them, I know there are quite a few people here who favor the Kabura, but I think it's Horrendous! maybe it will eventually grow on me but so far I am not impressed.. Hopefully they don't do anything that crazy to the 8

rx8wannahave

I stopped reading this thread a long time ago for no particular reason, but after coming back and reading this I once again (yes you have heard it a billion times) think a NA 3-rotor would be the best option.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the rotary engine gets pretty dang hot so why in the world would Mazda add FI to further complicate heat related issues with the Renesis? FI is probably the simple answer for HP gain but personally I think it would be a mistake...like if Mazda admitted they made a mistake giving the RX8 a NA rotary.

Keep it NA and add a rotor while giving the car better gearing and you would get all the power you needed without adding more heat to the engine or getting a 10/18mpg fuel economy rating.

Honestly, the main reason the RX8 gets such sub-par fuel economy is because of it's gearing. I mean...come on Mazda, our 6th gear is virtually useless. There is no way we should be hitting 4K at 75mph on the highway but more like 2.5K. I'd bet that would give us alot better fuel economy.

So, if they added a 3-rotor 350HP rotary while giving it better gearing we might even see an increase in fuel economy. I say that because I've seen online how people are able to get pretty respectable fuel economy numbers with 3-rotors what make HUGE HP.

Throughout this thread I see many idea's...some good, some I personally don't like but I honestly remain to see Mazda's desire to make our RX8 better. It's like they put the RX8 on the shelf some place and have given up on the car.

We all could be WAY OFF and Mazda might surprise us, but if they half-*** it with a 35HP Turbo I'd be upset.

By the way, the people who think the RX8 needs another 50HP at least don't love the 8 any less than those who are satisfied with the power it makes now. Personally, I'd love to see more power because this great car deserves it.

It's up to Mazda now to realize it instead of wasting our time with fluff body kits and fancy names (no offense to Shinka owners...I love your interior, but more power is what I personally prefer).

What ever they do...it better be worth...