m477

The power of a 3-liter 6-cyl is plenty, if they can keep the weight down.

The new G37 coupe weighs almost 3700lbs according to Edmunds. 3700 lbs!
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=120061

Subaru and BMW have both managed to introduce new generation cars which were *lighter* than their predecessors. I see no reason Mazda wouldn't be able to do the same (assuming the new 8 isn't significantly bigger). With a little more power and a little less weight, Mazda won't be giving up anything to their competitors in terms of power:weight ratio, in a car which handles better, brakes better, and costs less. And while the rotary may never have the mainstream appeal of a V-6, I think Mazda can easily expand the fan base with each generation if they play their cards right.

rotary crazy

that depends what type of engine you compare it to, if it is American 3 liters is not much but european and japanesse is a diferent history

my opinion is that it will be around 300hp

Tirminyl

270-300hp and 2800lbs is good enough for me.

djgiron

I still think the best idea for improving on any rotary vehicle will some sort of hybrid. Electric assisting motors will help with any torque shortcomings which will also improve city mpg. If you think about how much R&D $$ Ford (and the industry in general) are going to dump into battery technology, that will be the largest breakthrough in the automotive world. The weight of the batteries will go down while their efficiency will go up. (I recently read an article, cant remember where, about batteries that will take a charge and will discharge as fast as capacitors, but will hold the charge for long periods of time) Now think about Nissan having to couple a weak 4banger to that electric drivetrain to attempt to keep the weight down, while Mazda only has to make minor improvements to the fuel economy of a motor with enough hp already. Or, how smooth/small will a single rotor generator be inside a vehicle to keep the batteries charged compared to a similar sized piston engine? Now add to those 2 scenerios the fact the rotories will need minor improvements to run on hydrogen if that is in fact where we are headed. I actually see a bright future for the rotary, it just may not be in the next 3 years. Long term I believe Mazda is making a wise decision in its continuing development of the rotary.

refugeefrompistons

i hope u guys noe that the reason for most of the weight gains in vehicles today is caused by yes, features such as the nicer more comfortable seats and engines, but most importantly safety features. The requirement of safety features adds a tremendous burden on the carnot from just the air bags but also the structural support in the roof and sides and crumple zones to dissipate the energy.

Endgame

Certainly true, but what is the weight of a rotary compared to the weight of a 3.5 V6??

cavemancan

The weight of the Renisis is around 280lbs with accessories. The only motor that is lighter (that I am aware of) is the Hyabusa 4 cylendar which I think is around 200lbs. Maybe other motorcyle 4 cylendars are lighter but definately no car engines.

The Renisis engine is the lightest production street car engine based on my knowledge. I believe the next "significant" performance engine that weighs in the neighborhood of the Renisis are the LS series motors from GM (i.e. LS1, LS2, LS7). I believe they weigh around 390lbs which is incredible for a v8.

Basically, mating the Renisis to a turbo system will still give you a lighter car. If Mazda were to look into different metal alloys for the chasis and suspension I believe they could shave 200lbs easy. An Rx8 at 2700lbs with a turbo would be significant.

rotary crazy

what does the s2000 engine weight?

cavemancan

Not sure but I am almost positive it weighs more. It may even weigh as much or more than the LS2 vette engine.

rotarygod

Don't only think about total engine weight but also where it is distributed. The rotary is a very compact package. It's weight is concentrated within a small area. Even a 4 cylinder spreads it's weight out over a longer and taller distance.

cavemancan

Yeah I was just thinking that too. Its probably one of the main reasons I am against the use of a LS series GM motor in the 8. Even though it is supper light it carries its weight higher up then the 3 rotor.


BTW the Honda S2000's engine F20C1 - weighs 386lbs without the tranny

rotary crazy

one of this days Ill get my lazy but and weight all this engines, next to my work theres a use parts store that has all this engines and I have a presicion scale

rotary crazy

imagine and all aluminun renesis

cavemancan

I just found the weight of the 3 rotor 20B (bare engine...no accessories)

143kg or 315.26 lbs

Lighter than an LS1 and only about 35lbs heavier than the renisis (with accessories)

So I would assume the 20B with accessories would probably wiegh in about 370lbs. With a turbo maybe 420 lbs but the weight will be down way lower (as in closer to the drive line where you want weight to be) than any piston engine is capable of.

rotarygod

With aluminum end and intermediate housings, you could shave 75 lbs off of the engine.

rotary crazy

I just wieghted mine last week and you are very close, mine was 367lbs, with a few little parts off

rotary crazy

so a renesis would weight about 200lbs with accessories, thats got be an amazing power to weight ratio

LIGHT MAZDA YOU GOT TO THINK LIGHT!!! (renesis kabura please)

cavemancan

You have a 20B?????????

I hate you!

Edit: Just checked your profile and I hate YOU TIMES 1 BILLION . I want your toys!

rotary crazy

https://www.rx8club.com/general-automotive-49/just-started-my-20b-fd-proyect-109624/

actually I got another 20b this monday, I sold it to a guy from Puerto Rico, needed funds for my fd proyect, and it was an early built one # 619 I think

when Im done with my fd the plan is to put a Pport 20b into my rx-8

cavemancan

Can I be your man servant...

Mazda should really work on the 20B and make it more fuel efficient and put it in the new Rx8. The more I think about it...It's the right fit.

Edit: In fact Mazda should research the duel Hydrogen/gas fuel technology using the 3 rotor 20B. That way power will not be as much of an issue cause the consumer can use gasoline when they want.

rotary crazy

I think the right way for mazda to go is a light weight renesis equip car, 2600lbs and 280+hp with a 22/30 mpg rating

BaronVonBigmeat

Yeah because if you go with a 3 rotor renesis, then you have to go with a beefier (heavier) transmission, probably a T-56 or something. And probably other parts in the driveline need upgrading too. A light car with a 2-rotor is the way to go IMO.

Along with an all-aluminum engine, I'd like a new RX made using fiberforge's carbon fiber. Supposedly it's much cheaper than existing CF methods.

mikeyfuzz

They could definitely get around the emissions problems by making it a hydrogen engine.

gtorx7

I dont think it would be too bad. A stock TII or FD transmission is the same weight as the Rx-8, yet will handle much more power. A n/a 3-rotor will only add roughly 80lbs (2.8%) to the car, yet add 50% more power.

cavemancan

Not to mention there are other areas of the car that can be switched with lighter/stronger alloys.