Ike

All the dealers in my area are selling them for slightly below MSRP or at MSRP, as are many of the other dealers in the country.

Ike

cueball

For some reason I don't like the wagon with the newer front ends. They do look right.
I do like the older style wagons though. A kickass car with a ton of utility.

Ike

Yeah, I'm a bugeye guy myself, it made them a little more unique.

The Red One

That's a great deal IkeWRX.

NY has the most crooked dealers in the whole of USA. My Suby dealer had none for display in their showroom and gave me brochures. I've seen around half a dozen STis on the road now. The blue with gold rims is far the best looking with the black in a close 2nd.

Are you saying that the Sti is not selling well?

Ike

Well there aren't that many to sell, I would say demand and sales are pretty close. The dealers that I go to were selling them at MSRP even on prebuy when everyone knew if you didn't get the preorder it could be several months before getting one. They just took a stand that they didn't want to screw anyone over considering many of the people buying them were WRX owners and loyal customers. I was at my Suby dealer the day they came out and one of the owners of the first 3 was from Florida, he flew in just to pick up the car. I guess all the dealers in his area wanted 2-5k over MSRP so a $300 plane ticket didn't seem so bad. Have you seen a white one on the road yet, that is by far my favorite color for the STi. NY, Chicago area, Cali, and Florida seem to be the most common places where over MSRP is most common.

Ike

djantlive

Consumer Report knows **** about cars, that's all I gotta say.

STI has very good cornering actually and I would be watching out for those on the streets/tracks. It's got cheap interior but it does perform well.

mystrx8

That was me... Here is the thread.

Charles Cope

Hey mystrx8,

Did your emissions check include NOx, too?

newport8

Consumer Reports isn't 100% unbiased--they are subject to their own biases. CR has been a WRX lover for a while now. It doesn't surprise me that they would praise the STI even more.

Ike

How would them loving the WRX be a bias, the STi is basicly a WRX that handles better and has more power, it only seems to follow they would love the STi as well, not that it's based on a bias...

ChrisW

The RX-8 is very clean indeed, as is any car that meets the latest emissions regulations. Was this intended as a criticism of the RX-8's emissions performance or just an observation that it is harder to get rotaries to pass current regulations?

Perhaps, like many people, they got confused between noxious emissions (aka polution) which are regulated, and CO2 (which is not). But then if they were really talking about CO2 emissions then the word "clean" is not correct (CO2 is not "dirty").

rabinabo

According to edmunds.com, the 8 produces 5.3 - 6.3 pounds of smog-forming pollution per 15000 miles versus 12.3 - 12.9 for the Evo 8 and 12.3 - 12.9 for the Infinity G35.

New Yorker

My family's subscribed to CR since the '50's! Traditionally, they tended to have a rather "practical" bias when rating cars and would routinely downrate sports cars because of their "harsh rides", "noise", and "limited luggage capacity". In the last few years, however, they've rated sports cars as they should be, i.e. on how sporty they are. Yes, they rated the RX-8 second, but take it from a long-time reader - they loved it! Some excerpts:

"The RX-8 is a fun-to-drive sport coupe with a practical twist: two small rear-hinged back doors. It has excellent road manners, delivering both agile handling and the most comfortable ride in the group. The transmission glides from gear to gear, and the engine revs with equal smoothness, although fuel economy is the worst of the group."

"The RX-8 provides good isolation from bumps and impacts, and the highway ride is almost sedanlike. Despite its softer suspension, the RX-8 feels sure-footed, agile, and lithe, even in bumpy corners. The steering is quick and communicative, and it responds quickly to changes of direction. The car was stable and balanced at its limits on both our handling course and through our avoidance maneuver."

"A smooth-revving 238-hp, 1.3-liter rotary engine provides lively acceleration, but the car is not as quick as the STi, Evo or 350Z. The six-speed transmission shifts precisely. Expect only 18mpg overall. Braking performance is excellent."

putterwedge

I agree with Three37ny that Consumer Reports has gotten better at reviewing sports cars. I also feel that the positive comments add a great deal of credibility to the RX-8 amongst the general public.

It's a very crowded car market and this review will go a long way toward establishing the RX-8 as a lasting product.

Charles Cope

Can you provide a link to this? I can't find it.

bluesnowmonkey

I don't often read Consumer Reports, but isn't it targetted at people who are concerned with practicality and reliability? There certainly are a lot of magazines that are far "better" at reviewing sports cars, if that means evaluating performance and sex appeal.

Brian Goodwin

It was a pleasure to read the CR article....very positive comments on the RX8, its interior, ride, handling, etc. But, indeed it is hard to give CR much credit for knowing cars when the same issue ranks the Ford Focus about the RX8, EVO, STI, Z, etc...

Brian Goodwin
Good-Win Racing

red_rx8_red_int

Yes i was almost rofl when I saw the Ford Focus at the top of the list. I love CR, been a subscriber for over 20 years, and although I do believe their unbiased, they're not the gospel.

Ike

I'm still trying to figure that one out myself, the SVT focus is a great little car and all... but c'mon... I guess the large interior and practicality of it won them over.

RX-GR8

CR is not always right plain and simple.

Charles Cope

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, the miss statement about "emissions aren't as clean" needed to be dealt with. So I entered the following on CR's discussion forum..

I'd like to know the data behind the statement regarding the Mazda RX8.. "However it gets lower gas mileage and its emissions aren't as clean [as piston engines]. The mileage I can't argue with but I looked up all the cars in the article for emissions on the EPA site http://www.epa.gov/autoemissions/select.htm and the results were...

Mazda RX8 - 8
Chrysler Crossfire - 7
Nissan 350Z - 6
Mishubishi Lancer - 6
Subaru Impreza - 6

Higher score is lower emissions, measured in pounds of pollution per 15,000 miles. The Lancer and Impreza ratings are based on the standard cars, but it appears that this wouldn't make up a 6 pound difference in pollution.! Please advise! Does the RX8 deserve an apology for this overstatement?

Omicron

Yup, it does. They clearly based that comment on the older rotary engine. If you can push CR to publish an error/apology statement, it'll help the RX-8 in the public's eyes.

rxeightr

Charles, excellent find & inquiry back to CR. Please keep us posted of what response you get, if any.

I have subscribed to CR for 17+ years, and do use their testing as a basis for purchases of products. The RX-8 was viewed quite favorably in their review, and will serve to provide more sales for the RX-8 than without the review.

Certainly am glad they approved of my purchase of the RX-8 before I got as chance to hear what they had to say about it.

Charles Cope

Reply from CR:

"The comment in the introduction referred to Wankel engines in general and not to the RX-8 in particular. There isn't a single mention of it in the individual RX-8 page. If that's not clear enough, the onus is ours."

I wrote back that it seems that the fact that the RX-8 was the CLEANEST of the group, a correction is in order!

Rx-Appreci-8

I am a HUGE fan of Consumer Reports, but in this particular case I think their reply is absolutely lame.

I don't think they can really make the claim that they were referring to Wankels in general but not to the RX-8 specifically.

Here is the entire paragraph:
_________________________________

The Mazda RX-8, new for 2004, is a successor to the RX-7 two-seat sports car, which was introduced for 1979 and hasn’t been imported since 1995. It’s essentially a 2+2 coupe (with two front seats and two small rear seats), and it has the added convenience of small rear doors. Like its predecessors, the RX-8 uses a rotary "Wankel" engine, now the only production car to do so. The engine has a pair of three-sided rotors instead of pistons to create compression. It is smaller and lighter than other types of engines and revs exceptionally smoothly. However, it gets lower gas mileage, and its emissions aren’t as clean.
__________________________________


I don't think there is a single reader that would go away thinking they were ONLY referring to Wankel engines on OTHER cars.


Nice catch Charles!


I do think the overall tone of CR's article was very positive though. After all, CR did call out the RX-8 in the Best Of What's New article.