New Mazda 'WIDE' (15B) Rotary 2007
#126
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Originally Posted by Zokk's 8
With the new MazdaSpeed 6 out this fall with all wheel drive and over 270 turbocharged hp and Mazda developing a 1.5 Rotory for it's RX, I can't believe they would come out with a new rotory under 300 hp. IMO that just wouldn't make sense. They can't have their family sedan faster than their sports car. The car mags say new RX-7 out as an 07 model predicted 300 hp using the same chasis as the RX-8 and Miata, oops MX-5. No reason not to put it in the 8 too. I also read somewhere that although three rotors was prefered for torque, they couldn't make it pass emissions without the sideport. Hence the Renisis design.
Unless there has been a newer first drive since feb 2005?
#127
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I said a dual system side ports for low rpm, peripheral for hig rpm, are your emissions inspeccions of the entire rev rage or only at idle?
there are some tuners in japan doing this(I know its very diferent for the manufacturer to make it) if mazda can make this a 13b renesis can make more than 300 hp.
there are some tuners in japan doing this(I know its very diferent for the manufacturer to make it) if mazda can make this a 13b renesis can make more than 300 hp.
Last edited by rotary crazy; 10-20-2005 at 06:49 AM.
#128
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Originally Posted by PoLaK
It has not been determined that the MS6 will be faster in a straight line then the current Rx-8, 0-60 is slower at 6.2sec according to C&D, will probably be slower in the 1/4mile due to its weight although it will launch easier, and it will most definatly be slower around the track once again due to its weight.
Unless there has been a newer first drive since feb 2005?
Unless there has been a newer first drive since feb 2005?
#129
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OK OK OK....is this official? Will the RX8 get a 1.5L rotary with direct injection?
If it makes significantly more power and helps save gas too, I guess I just found my first mod once my 8 is paid off...lol.
If it makes significantly more power and helps save gas too, I guess I just found my first mod once my 8 is paid off...lol.
#131
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Food for your though:
Fact 1) As the Senku model is already equipped with a renesis 13b DI
Fact 2) as direct injection involves not a big change is components for the entire engine
Fact 3) Consequence of fact 2, production line will not change significantly (something very important for a low scaled produced car such us our beloved RX8)
Fact 4) Better fuel economy is nowadays something in almost any buyer´s mind (side effects of DI would be even better drivability/smoothness a bit of more power in all rpm band wich are again good commercial arguments)
Do you think as something reasonable that a 2007 RX8 can be equipped with a 13b renesis DI?
jird20
Fact 1) As the Senku model is already equipped with a renesis 13b DI
Fact 2) as direct injection involves not a big change is components for the entire engine
Fact 3) Consequence of fact 2, production line will not change significantly (something very important for a low scaled produced car such us our beloved RX8)
Fact 4) Better fuel economy is nowadays something in almost any buyer´s mind (side effects of DI would be even better drivability/smoothness a bit of more power in all rpm band wich are again good commercial arguments)
Do you think as something reasonable that a 2007 RX8 can be equipped with a 13b renesis DI?
jird20
#132
Originally Posted by jird20
Fact 2) as direct injection involves not a big change is components for the entire engine
#133
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Originally Posted by rotary crazy
I said a dual system side ports for low rpm, peripheral for hig rpm, are your emissions inspeccions of the entire rev rage or only at idle?
#134
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Originally Posted by tuj
This 'fact' is incorrect. Direct injection would invovle recasting at least two of the housings if not more. DI also doesn't offer significant fuels savings at load; when it runs in homogeneous mode its basically the same or worse than conventional injectors. Of course, the low load stratified operation is beneficial.
#135
Originally Posted by raspyrx7
well there are only 2 housings on 13B motors. Would be interesting to see gas mileage results tho, as other companies have increased gas mileage via DI... not sure about the stratified and homogen both gaining mpg.
The benefit of DI is to concentrate the fuel charge at the spark plug, so that the charge is locally rich, but overall would be a very lean mixture if it were homogenous. I'm not saying its a bad idea, just that its more complex than it may initially seem. Piston engines don't have to worry about seals passing over the passages to the injectors in DI.
#136
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but they already have done DI on a 13b motor as seen in the press releases about the concepts being shown. since this thread is about a possible future 15b they would already be making new castings. so they can cast the injector placement anywhere they like.
#137
They can take the castings from the 15A.
http://www.der-wankelmotor.de/Motore...mazda_15a.html
http://www.der-wankelmotor.de/Motore...mazda_15a.html
#138
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i dont think thedy can. my understanding of the A and B nomenclture is that it denotes a change in diameter size . correct me please if that is incorrect.
edit- translation of the page suggests this 15a was based on the 13b geometry just wider. hmmm..
edit- translation of the page suggests this 15a was based on the 13b geometry just wider. hmmm..
#139
It says that the design is based on the 13B. The chambers were widened to 90mm. The chamber volume was increased to 735 ccm. The engine delivered 135HP at 5750 rpm and it delivered a maximum torque of 196 Nm at 3500 rpm. He also says that this engine was a victim of the oil crisis in the seventies.
Well I don't know whether they could use anything of this design. But it's just interesting to note that Mazda already built a 'widened' rotary.
Well I don't know whether they could use anything of this design. But it's just interesting to note that Mazda already built a 'widened' rotary.
#141
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Originally Posted by globi
Well I don't know whether they could use anything of this design. But it's just interesting to note that Mazda already built a 'widened' rotary.
#143
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It still makes no sense. A larger 2 rotor will develop no more power than the current engine. It will just develop the same power at lower rpms. It's airflow limited to only what the current engine has. There is no room for more port area. No engineer can change that. The real truth is that we aren't going to see a larger rotary. It makes no sense. Direct injection can't change that. What's more likely is that we will see added power with a power adder on the current engine. I'm not sure who started the rumor of a 1.5L and why anyone would believe it but I don't believe they are developing one at all. It's not practical. If we are going to get into the "not yet" game, Chevy just hasn't released the supercharged 3 rotor C6 yet. It's not "never" and just as likely as a 1.5L rotary in an RX-8.
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Originally Posted by rotarygod
It still makes no sense. A larger 2 rotor will develop no more power than the current engine. It will just develop the same power at lower rpms. It's airflow limited to only what the current engine has. There is no room for more port area. No engineer can change that. The real truth is that we aren't going to see a larger rotary. It makes no sense. Direct injection can't change that. What's more likely is that we will see added power with a power adder on the current engine. I'm not sure who started the rumor of a 1.5L and why anyone would believe it but I don't believe they are developing one at all. It's not practical. If we are going to get into the "not yet" game, Chevy just hasn't released the supercharged 3 rotor C6 yet. It's not "never" and just as likely as a 1.5L rotary in an RX-8.
What would the difference be between a 1.3L vs a 1.5L that has been turbo'd or SC'd?
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what if the engine is not only wider but bigger in every sense? how much taller does it has to be an inch?
Last edited by rotary crazy; 10-26-2005 at 06:57 AM.
#146
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More hopes dashed....sadly...
Well, maybe Mazda should buy the Regi Tech "round" rotary engine or the whole company. They are building 40HP engines that are the size of (actually a little smaller than) a lawn mower engine.
I think what Mazda did with the Renesis should not be forgotten, without a turbo or SC the engine is making more HP than any other NA rotary engine...that I know about at least.
But I think it's almost a universal feeling that we all would like another 50HP with slightly better or the same fuel economy.
Well...I guess I"ll wait till the next "hype" thread...lol
Sounds interesting, but might be just hype also: Round Rotary
Well, maybe Mazda should buy the Regi Tech "round" rotary engine or the whole company. They are building 40HP engines that are the size of (actually a little smaller than) a lawn mower engine.
I think what Mazda did with the Renesis should not be forgotten, without a turbo or SC the engine is making more HP than any other NA rotary engine...that I know about at least.
But I think it's almost a universal feeling that we all would like another 50HP with slightly better or the same fuel economy.
Well...I guess I"ll wait till the next "hype" thread...lol
Sounds interesting, but might be just hype also: Round Rotary
Last edited by rx8wannahave; 10-26-2005 at 07:40 AM.
#147
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Originally Posted by rx8wannahave
More hopes dashed....sadly...
Well, maybe Mazda should buy the Regi Tech "round" rotary engine or the whole company. They are building 40HP engines that are the size of (actually a little smaller than) a lawn mower engine.
I think what Mazda did with the Renesis should not be forgotten, without a turbo or SC the engine is making more HP than any other NA rotary engine...that I know about at least.
But I think it's almost a universal feeling that we all would like another 50HP with slightly better or the same fuel economy.
Well...I guess I"ll wait till the next "hype" thread...lol
Sounds interesting, but might be just hype also: Round Rotary
Well, maybe Mazda should buy the Regi Tech "round" rotary engine or the whole company. They are building 40HP engines that are the size of (actually a little smaller than) a lawn mower engine.
I think what Mazda did with the Renesis should not be forgotten, without a turbo or SC the engine is making more HP than any other NA rotary engine...that I know about at least.
But I think it's almost a universal feeling that we all would like another 50HP with slightly better or the same fuel economy.
Well...I guess I"ll wait till the next "hype" thread...lol
Sounds interesting, but might be just hype also: Round Rotary
Those things are awesome. I sure hope they get bought out by some major car manufacturer, Mazda being at the top of that list.
#148
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So far, only the government is paying attention to them. It seems they don't have the money at the moment to make a full-scale car or something else that in similar size using the engine.
From the looks of their website, I think they are moving to other applications to raise the money so that in time they could make a car engine for it.
The government wants to use their engine to power spy or robot planes. I’m about to donate my car as a test vehicle so they can build me a 400HP engine that get’s 35mpg city…lol.
Time will tell what happens with their “round rotary”.
Till the next “hype” I guess…
From the looks of their website, I think they are moving to other applications to raise the money so that in time they could make a car engine for it.
The government wants to use their engine to power spy or robot planes. I’m about to donate my car as a test vehicle so they can build me a 400HP engine that get’s 35mpg city…lol.
Time will tell what happens with their “round rotary”.
Till the next “hype” I guess…
#149
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Originally Posted by rotary crazy
what if the engine is not only wider but bigger in every sense? how much taller does it has to be an inch?
hehe i was thinking about that last night. i am going to look for the formula to calculate the new diameter for 1.5 L
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Another thyn I was thynking about , can the engine injest air faster thru the same port size, I read some where that the speed of the air going in is what is important not the port size?
maybe some sort of ram air?
maybe some sort of ram air?