R&T's "12 best enthusiast cars under $30K"
11-04-2006 | 08:05 PM
#1
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R&T's "12 best enthusiast cars under $30K"
in the latest December issue.
No RX8!
well, Phooooey!! <takes ball and goes home>
while I think an argument can be made that the RX8 belongs on such a list, the fact that it's in its 4th model year with no real improvements hurts its perceived relevance. the other cars on the list are either recently released or gradually improved.
p.s. MS3, MX-5, and 350Z are on the list.
No RX8!
well, Phooooey!! <takes ball and goes home>
while I think an argument can be made that the RX8 belongs on such a list, the fact that it's in its 4th model year with no real improvements hurts its perceived relevance. the other cars on the list are either recently released or gradually improved.
p.s. MS3, MX-5, and 350Z are on the list.
11-05-2006 | 05:03 PM
#2
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11-05-2006 | 09:34 PM
#4
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I honestly don't blame them
it gas mileage is not exactly great and neither is the pick up.
granted its a pleasure to drive, but you have to baby this car, and the avg person doesnt have the time/ ambition for that.
If mazda got an extra 10 mpg out of this baby, it would def be in the top 5 imo.
it gas mileage is not exactly great and neither is the pick up.
granted its a pleasure to drive, but you have to baby this car, and the avg person doesnt have the time/ ambition for that.
If mazda got an extra 10 mpg out of this baby, it would def be in the top 5 imo.
11-06-2006 | 10:05 PM
#9
I sent the following letter to R&T:
R&T-
Your “12 best cars under $30k” feature was a big disappointment. No surprise the most expensive car wins, when the addition of one option... any option... even floor mats... pushes it over the $30k mark. Same with the Evo RS and Solstice GXP. Not a very fair analysis, if you ask me. You should have tested more cars that are thousands, not hundreds, under the $30k mark. The average guy with $20k to $25k to spend would have found your article almost entirely useless. Where was the Mazda RX-8, which starts at $25k for the base model, but with current incentives can be had for far less? (Not to mention has one of the best-tuned chassis on the consumer market and received high praises in your long-term test). And where was the Hyundai Tiburon, which just got a facelift and is a direct competitor to the Civic and the Scion? And what about the Acura TSX, a competent handler with the same rated horsepower as the Cobalt SS? I don’t know if I can speak for anyone else, but I am tired of reading about the 350z and the Mini Cooper every month. Your test sorely needs a wider range of cars that fall thousands, not hundreds, of dollars below the $30k mark.
R&T-
Your “12 best cars under $30k” feature was a big disappointment. No surprise the most expensive car wins, when the addition of one option... any option... even floor mats... pushes it over the $30k mark. Same with the Evo RS and Solstice GXP. Not a very fair analysis, if you ask me. You should have tested more cars that are thousands, not hundreds, under the $30k mark. The average guy with $20k to $25k to spend would have found your article almost entirely useless. Where was the Mazda RX-8, which starts at $25k for the base model, but with current incentives can be had for far less? (Not to mention has one of the best-tuned chassis on the consumer market and received high praises in your long-term test). And where was the Hyundai Tiburon, which just got a facelift and is a direct competitor to the Civic and the Scion? And what about the Acura TSX, a competent handler with the same rated horsepower as the Cobalt SS? I don’t know if I can speak for anyone else, but I am tired of reading about the 350z and the Mini Cooper every month. Your test sorely needs a wider range of cars that fall thousands, not hundreds, of dollars below the $30k mark.
11-07-2006 | 02:15 AM
#11
Blue By You
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 8,717
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From: Milwaukee
Originally Posted by Rootski
I sent the following letter to R&T:
R&T-
Your “12 best cars under $30k” feature was a big disappointment. No surprise the most expensive car wins, when the addition of one option... any option... even floor mats... pushes it over the $30k mark. Same with the Evo RS and Solstice GXP. Not a very fair analysis, if you ask me. You should have tested more cars that are thousands, not hundreds, under the $30k mark. The average guy with $20k to $25k to spend would have found your article almost entirely useless. Where was the Mazda RX-8, which starts at $25k for the base model, but with current incentives can be had for far less? (Not to mention has one of the best-tuned chassis on the consumer market and received high praises in your long-term test). And where was the Hyundai Tiburon, which just got a facelift and is a direct competitor to the Civic and the Scion? And what about the Acura TSX, a competent handler with the same rated horsepower as the Cobalt SS? I don’t know if I can speak for anyone else, but I am tired of reading about the 350z and the Mini Cooper every month. Your test sorely needs a wider range of cars that fall thousands, not hundreds, of dollars below the $30k mark.
R&T-
Your “12 best cars under $30k” feature was a big disappointment. No surprise the most expensive car wins, when the addition of one option... any option... even floor mats... pushes it over the $30k mark. Same with the Evo RS and Solstice GXP. Not a very fair analysis, if you ask me. You should have tested more cars that are thousands, not hundreds, under the $30k mark. The average guy with $20k to $25k to spend would have found your article almost entirely useless. Where was the Mazda RX-8, which starts at $25k for the base model, but with current incentives can be had for far less? (Not to mention has one of the best-tuned chassis on the consumer market and received high praises in your long-term test). And where was the Hyundai Tiburon, which just got a facelift and is a direct competitor to the Civic and the Scion? And what about the Acura TSX, a competent handler with the same rated horsepower as the Cobalt SS? I don’t know if I can speak for anyone else, but I am tired of reading about the 350z and the Mini Cooper every month. Your test sorely needs a wider range of cars that fall thousands, not hundreds, of dollars below the $30k mark.
What part about under 30k do you not understand, every one of our test cars was under 30k. If we had tested more cars thousands less than 30K we would have had to call it the "Best Enthusiast Car Under 27K" and that just doesn't have as nice a ring to it.
Last we checked an RX-8 starts at almost 27k and we do not judge cars based on what they sell for, rather what the MSRP is. It's not our problem Mazda can't move the RX-8 and has to offer big incentives.
The Tiburon isn't on the list because it was not available for testing at the time of our test. Did you just say TSX, did you read the title of the article, It says "Enthusiast Car" we may have been reacing with a couple cars already, adding the TSX would have lost us all credibility.
More of our readers care about the 350Z, and Mini, and we'll keep testing them as things keep getting improved on those models. The RX-8 hasn't had a damn thing done to it in over 3 years. In other words, RX-8 owners can suck it!
Sincerly,
Road and Track
11-07-2006 | 10:17 AM
#12
That time of the month, then, Ike?
If by "getting improved" you mean "getting fatter" then the Z has made great strides since the '05's. And do they not say in the article "We couldn't get our hands on the upcoming 2nd-gen Mini"? Well then, we'll plow about in the John Cooper Works even though we just tested it two months ago and not much has changed in that time.
And let me tell you, if I was looking for a fun front-driver (though I can't imagine why I would) I'd take a harder look at that TSX than I would the Civic Si.
And, well, one of my points is that they should account for what the cars actually sell for, because you won't get a Z for under $30k and there are some over-30k cars (RX-8 included, yes) that really aren't. It's supposed to help people buy cars, why can't they come up with some real world numbers?
Once again you've just proven why you have 6,900* posts on this forum alone, and not a deal actually writing letters for R&T. There's no way anyone would pay to read what you write.
*6857 at the time of this writing, but I figure you'll say "fanboi" at least 43 times before you read this.
If by "getting improved" you mean "getting fatter" then the Z has made great strides since the '05's. And do they not say in the article "We couldn't get our hands on the upcoming 2nd-gen Mini"? Well then, we'll plow about in the John Cooper Works even though we just tested it two months ago and not much has changed in that time.
And let me tell you, if I was looking for a fun front-driver (though I can't imagine why I would) I'd take a harder look at that TSX than I would the Civic Si.
And, well, one of my points is that they should account for what the cars actually sell for, because you won't get a Z for under $30k and there are some over-30k cars (RX-8 included, yes) that really aren't. It's supposed to help people buy cars, why can't they come up with some real world numbers?
Once again you've just proven why you have 6,900* posts on this forum alone, and not a deal actually writing letters for R&T. There's no way anyone would pay to read what you write.
*6857 at the time of this writing, but I figure you'll say "fanboi" at least 43 times before you read this.
11-07-2006 | 11:40 AM
#14
My Rex goes to 11!
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 773
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From: Arlington, VA
i think a previous poster said it best, they put the mx5 and mazdaspeed 3 on the list- putting the 8 would make 3 Mazdas and they probably liked the 5 and 3 better since they are newer.
the only car i was annoyed to see was the Scion TC. But other than that, its not waaay off. I do think the 8 should be on there, but also wouldn't mind a miata and a mazdaspeed 3 either.
the only car i was annoyed to see was the Scion TC. But other than that, its not waaay off. I do think the 8 should be on there, but also wouldn't mind a miata and a mazdaspeed 3 either.
11-07-2006 | 11:52 AM
#15
second time around
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 974
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From: Allentown, PA
Originally Posted by Tirminyl
Oh noes. Teh RXEight is not on another best list. The wurld is gonna die!
Seriously. I mean... granted, some of those cars are "ehh" at best but we've all got to realize that we're going to be partial to our car... I'm sure R&T had a good reason for not putting the 8 on there and I'm pretty sure that reason wasn't to just **** us off. Besides, if you're upset because you use these articles as confirmation of how great the 8 is, take it out for a quick little spin and remember exactly what it is that makes you love your car. I can promise it's not a magazine article.
11-07-2006 | 01:10 PM
#17
RX8 and a Truk....
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,658
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From: OKC
Originally Posted by Ike
So you don't have to wait for the response from R&T...
What part about under 30k do you not understand, every one of our test cars was under 30k. If we had tested more cars thousands less than 30K we would have had to call it the "Best Enthusiast Car Under 27K" and that just doesn't have as nice a ring to it.
Last we checked an RX-8 starts at almost 27k and we do not judge cars based on what they sell for, rather what the MSRP is. It's not our problem Mazda can't move the RX-8 and has to offer big incentives.
The Tiburon isn't on the list because it was not available for testing at the time of our test. Did you just say TSX, did you read the title of the article, It says "Enthusiast Car" we may have been reacing with a couple cars already, adding the TSX would have lost us all credibility.
More of our readers care about the 350Z, and Mini, and we'll keep testing them as things keep getting improved on those models. The RX-8 hasn't had a damn thing done to it in over 3 years. In other words, RX-8 owners can suck it!
Sincerly,
Road and Track
What part about under 30k do you not understand, every one of our test cars was under 30k. If we had tested more cars thousands less than 30K we would have had to call it the "Best Enthusiast Car Under 27K" and that just doesn't have as nice a ring to it.
Last we checked an RX-8 starts at almost 27k and we do not judge cars based on what they sell for, rather what the MSRP is. It's not our problem Mazda can't move the RX-8 and has to offer big incentives.
The Tiburon isn't on the list because it was not available for testing at the time of our test. Did you just say TSX, did you read the title of the article, It says "Enthusiast Car" we may have been reacing with a couple cars already, adding the TSX would have lost us all credibility.
More of our readers care about the 350Z, and Mini, and we'll keep testing them as things keep getting improved on those models. The RX-8 hasn't had a damn thing done to it in over 3 years. In other words, RX-8 owners can suck it!
Sincerly,
Road and Track
:D
11-07-2006 | 04:03 PM
#18
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 38
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From: San Diego, CA
Originally Posted by kimberly lynn
Seriously. I mean... granted, some of those cars are "ehh" at best but we've all got to realize that we're going to be partial to our car... I'm sure R&T had a good reason for not putting the 8 on there and I'm pretty sure that reason wasn't to just **** us off. Besides, if you're upset because you use these articles as confirmation of how great the 8 is, take it out for a quick little spin and remember exactly what it is that makes you love your car. I can promise it's not a magazine article.
Seriously, though, KL, thanks for interjecting some perspective. I just bought '05 for $27K out the door and I know I could have shopped longer, picked at my decision, considered yet another car, etc..., but the bottom line was I loved the car and that was a totally agreeable price to pay for it.
Maybe I'll find another car tomorrow that's less expensive, better performing, ...whatever. Today, I'm in my RX8 and my commute is not only without pain, but seriously fun.
Last word: I've got a BMW R 1150 RT, a great bike that's fun, comfortable, and beautiful, but I keep choosing to drive my RX8. It's just a great ride.
11-20-2006 | 10:09 AM
#19
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Posts: 1,453
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From: Georgetown
Originally Posted by BAM0027
Cute, smart, and reasonable. Ahhh... I'm starting a Kimberly Lynn fan club (not creepy, I promise!!!)
Seriously, though, KL, thanks for interjecting some perspective. I just bought '05 for $27K out the door and I know I could have shopped longer, picked at my decision, considered yet another car, etc..., but the bottom line was I loved the car and that was a totally agreeable price to pay for it.
Maybe I'll find another car tomorrow that's less expensive, better performing, ...whatever. Today, I'm in my RX8 and my commute is not only without pain, but seriously fun.
Last word: I've got a BMW R 1150 RT, a great bike that's fun, comfortable, and beautiful, but I keep choosing to drive my RX8. It's just a great ride.
Seriously, though, KL, thanks for interjecting some perspective. I just bought '05 for $27K out the door and I know I could have shopped longer, picked at my decision, considered yet another car, etc..., but the bottom line was I loved the car and that was a totally agreeable price to pay for it.
Maybe I'll find another car tomorrow that's less expensive, better performing, ...whatever. Today, I'm in my RX8 and my commute is not only without pain, but seriously fun.
Last word: I've got a BMW R 1150 RT, a great bike that's fun, comfortable, and beautiful, but I keep choosing to drive my RX8. It's just a great ride.
11-20-2006 | 10:12 AM
#20
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,453
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From: Georgetown
R&T lost all credibility with me. On their site, the editors stated that they didn't include the 8 because they already had two Mazda's in the test. Huh? They are testing the "best cars" under 30 grand, so what does that have to do with anything?? 
What's crazy is that the 350Z won. Just two years ago, they tested the 8 against the mechanically identical G35 coupe and proclaimed the 8 as the superior car. Go figure!
What's crazy is that the 350Z won. Just two years ago, they tested the 8 against the mechanically identical G35 coupe and proclaimed the 8 as the superior car. Go figure!
11-20-2006 | 02:01 PM
#21
more then a Mazda
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 509
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From: VIRGINIA
this is like a fashion show some will like it others will not .i did not buy my 8 for the reviews,the commercials,the girls standing on them ,in them or even on top of them.i bought it because this car said I AM YOURS!!!and on that first look i knew i need not ask anyones right to be or not.even with our recalls crazy up and down gas eatter's i am one happy camper for i can stand next to anyone's car and be glad as hell i have what i want and no can take that feeling away.i drive it like i own it and even my neighbor who has three corvette's has a thumbs up when i drive by.that alone makes me happy for my choice not R&T OR ANYONE FOR THAT MATTER!!thanks and enjoy your car it's your's and nobodyelse!!! 
11-20-2006 | 03:56 PM
#22
TEBOW FOR HE15MAN
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,027
Likes: 0
From: Gainesville, Florida
Originally Posted by Ike
So you don't have to wait for the response from R&T...
What part about under 30k do you not understand, every one of our test cars was under 30k. If we had tested more cars thousands less than 30K we would have had to call it the "Best Enthusiast Car Under 27K" and that just doesn't have as nice a ring to it.
Last we checked an RX-8 starts at almost 27k and we do not judge cars based on what they sell for, rather what the MSRP is. It's not our problem Mazda can't move the RX-8 and has to offer big incentives.
The Tiburon isn't on the list because it was not available for testing at the time of our test. Did you just say TSX, did you read the title of the article, It says "Enthusiast Car" we may have been reacing with a couple cars already, adding the TSX would have lost us all credibility.
More of our readers care about the 350Z, and Mini, and we'll keep testing them as things keep getting improved on those models. The RX-8 hasn't had a damn thing done to it in over 3 years. In other words, RX-8 owners can suck it!
Sincerly,
Road and Track
What part about under 30k do you not understand, every one of our test cars was under 30k. If we had tested more cars thousands less than 30K we would have had to call it the "Best Enthusiast Car Under 27K" and that just doesn't have as nice a ring to it.
Last we checked an RX-8 starts at almost 27k and we do not judge cars based on what they sell for, rather what the MSRP is. It's not our problem Mazda can't move the RX-8 and has to offer big incentives.
The Tiburon isn't on the list because it was not available for testing at the time of our test. Did you just say TSX, did you read the title of the article, It says "Enthusiast Car" we may have been reacing with a couple cars already, adding the TSX would have lost us all credibility.
More of our readers care about the 350Z, and Mini, and we'll keep testing them as things keep getting improved on those models. The RX-8 hasn't had a damn thing done to it in over 3 years. In other words, RX-8 owners can suck it!
Sincerly,
Road and Track
11-21-2006 | 01:43 PM
#24
Registered User
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 539
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From: Montreal
Road and track can even spell "Nissan" properly. Why would you take their word for anything. Geez, get a spellcheck.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=4212
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=4212
