I just got a brand new car (white), I actually watched them remove the white plastic covers from the body paneling, and as far as I could see the thing had not a swirl mark on it.

Two weeks later I give the car its first wash. I'm an avid Zaino user, and I follow their washing directions to a tee. I use their soap, with 100% cotton towels, air dried! I then dry the car with an electric leaf blower.

Tonight I'm coming out of WaWa, and under the lights you can see some swirling. I just don't get it. When I got my 8 it was black and covered with Swirls so I never knew if I was damaging the paint. This time I'm pretty sure I did the damage. Does anyone have any advice on how to wash the car without damaging the paint? Or is it just impossible to keep a car clean, and swirl free?

 

There's a website, something like autopia, or something like that. On there, they tell you how to get rid of the swirl marks, I tried it, but had no luck. I followed their suggestions to a tee, wax w/ Meguir's NXT (couldn't find Zaino), and damn, the paint looks great, but there are swirls all over the car. People say it actually looks kinda cool, because you see the Purple hues of the Black Cherry, and as you walk around the car, it looks like shifting/disappearing lines, if that makes any sense.

 

Maybe it's your technique. I use a Meguires sheepskin glove which I dip into the top of a full sudsy bucket of warm water. Never plunge to the bottom of the bucket, you'll pick up the grit you've just removed from the car. Dip into the bucket often....twice per panel, or more.

Oh, and rinse the car thoroughly with a high pressure water stream before taking your sponge/ glove to it. Wash from top to bottom. Use separate sponge for wheels, exhaust tips. Wash these last. My ten year old Ford still looks new.

Gomez.

 

Use a new sponge every wash.

Try to find some good cut and polish - I use scratch X from Meguire, they are in a tooth taste and need to hand polish. They work very well for my black car. Then I just machine polish it in 4 layers. You can zaino them if you want, but I am pretty basic with a resin polish machine buffed and a harder wax on top. I use AutoGlym.

P.S. I agree with Gomez re technique. I went to a good hand car wash place, they always make swirls for me afterwards, some more than others. If you mix your action at the bottom with the top part of the car - you will get swirls.

If you think your technique is sound, then my friend you just have to polish it more often :p

 

I dont know what I've been doing right or wrong but my Red 8 is still swirl-free. Bay Area RX-8s here always comment how I don't clean my car at the meets. The thing is, I use Zaino only with microfiber stuff. I also clay bar twice a year. I have moved from 4 hours (first time) to 45 minutes in wash/claybar/zaino process.

Maybe I'm just blind from seeing swirl marks? :D

 

My RX8 is one year old: No swirl marks.

Here is how I wash it(by hand):

Wait until the sun is setting so that none of it shines on the car, or park it under a tree, make sure the entire car is shaded, this will prevent waterspots.

Prepare these items: clean bucket, soft 100% cotton pure white rag about 1'x1' for washing, 2 soft 100% cotton pure white bath towels with all tags and seams removed for drying, soap.

1) get waterhose and give the car a squirt down. This is to moisten and loosen the dirt, washing off the heavies and making it easier to remove.

2) Now, mix your soap up, I use enough to make a nice and lathery solution, but not so thick with soap that the water feels really slimey when you run your hand through it.

3) Start from the top of the car, make sure any surface you are washing is moistened already! Or else you run the risk of mashing the dried particles along the surface with the rag!!! Gently drag the rag (DO NOT use force! Espically if the car is very dirty!) in one direction along the suface of the car. This side is now dirty, flip the rag over and do another nearby part, working in sections. Now you must rinse the rag! People make the mistake of not rinsing their rag enough! This is ESSENTIAL for cleaning a very dirty car! If the car is just dusty, I usually do 2 swipes per side then flip, then rinse rag.

You can usually tell if you are doing this correctly because when you look at the rag after a swipe, it will not look very dirty! I can usually do 1 drag over about 1&1/2 feet of the car surface. If you look at the rag and you can see a dark line of dirt along the leading edge after a swipe, then you are taking too long a swipe, all that dirt line is being dragged against your paint surface!

If you do not take your time, you will get swirl marks, and you will regret it!

For an extremely dirty car (winter salt) with caked on dirt that a blast from the hose will not budge, you must do a rolling swipe of the rag. Make your rag into about the shape of a large sponge, and gently roll the rag away from the car surface as you drag it along. You will know your car is extremely dirty, because the rag will come back being virtually all dirty and black after just one swipe! Rinse the rag after this! Hand washing an extremely dirty car like this takes a very long time! you can only do about 5-6" at at time! But you are guaranteed to have NO swirl marks at all!!!! Though the pros do not recommend it, I suggest if you do not have 2 hrs to spend washing your car, to use a pressure washer.

Pressure washing: Ideally, you should use your own. A sufficient one will set you back about $60-80. Try to get one that accepts a soap tube(some of the ones in this price range don't feature it), it will allow you to spray soap using the machine, just like at the self-serv car washes. Use the pressure washer to remove stuck on dirt, be careful about pressuring washing though, some car fanatics claim pressurewashing drives the dirt into the paint job.

If you must use the self-serv places, what I have been gulity of doing is only using the clean water spray (which isn't really clean at these places because they recycle their water, so you run the risk of spraying not so good of stuff on your car if someone's car has a fluid leak or someone has been illegally dumping waste). And only using it to do a pre-rinse and then final rinse on the car. I bring my own bucket, soap and towels and handwash at the place. If you have a nice wax job, then why would you want to spray their questionable at best soap mix on it?

---I can wash my car, just as described, in about 40 minutes for a normal wash(and dry), and upwards of 2 hours for an extremely dirty wash.

3) after the whole car body is washed, I like to use a wash mitt to do near the bottom of everything and the wheels. It holds a lot more dirt and water than a rag, which is exactly why I dont like using one for the car body, but do like using it for the lowers/wheels. Brake dust usually contains metallic particles. These usually stay in your rag!!!!! Brake dust will most certainly give you swirl marks! Make sure the wheels are the last thing you do!

4) To dry, I like to use one rag to drag across the surface of the car, I never lift it, I just hold it by two corners and drag the whole thing along behind. This will throughly soak the rag, but will squeege about 85% of the water off of the car. I use the other rag to finishing drying.

If you drop any rag, or towel. It is now dirty. Do not use it any more until it is washed. A pebble clinging to your rag will give you one hell of a bunch of swirl marks, espically if you are lazy and don't rinse your rag like I have said!

5) Open trunk, dry all visible water along the undersides of the trunk.
6) Open and slam all doors, this will prevent waterspots.
7) Detail your car as otherwise desired; I usually then use NEVR-DULL on my RB exhaust tips, hot shine on my tires if they need it, I wipe all the windows with Windex.

****Side note: I never use my windshield washers, or even my wipers. Unless I am caught in a downpour. I do not use them, because I do not want water stains on my glass along the wiper's path. I do carry windex and a roll of paper towels in my trunk at all times, in case something is annoying me on the window. My glass is usually perfectly clear. ****

8)Zaino! At the very least I apply 1 coat of Z-6, and 1 coat of Z-8.

My RX8 is only washed by me. Any carwash will give you swirlmarks, even the touchless ones have stupid highschool kids drying your car with dirty towels!!!! Unless of course you are paying for a premium detail job that includes a handwash. But those start at $25 and go to about $115, even then, these are questionable.

Good luck.

 

Most likely you are not rinsing your rag enough.

I just read the Zaino Carwash instructions, and if you are following them, then you are also probably using the same rag on your car that you just cleaned up brake dust with. Not good.

They say to do the wheels first because the car will dry with spots because the wash will take so long. This is why I work at dusk. If I notice the car drying too fast as I am working on it, I will start drying the upper panels.

I usually wash the top, then the hood and front, then the trunk, then the sides, then the wheels.

If I notice my car hood or top drying with waterspots on it (usually happens if I wash when its like 100 degrees out, or decide to wash in partial shade) I will dry my already washed portions of the car. Most of the time if it is drying quickly I will have the whole car clean and dry before I even start working on the wheels.

 

I appreciate the suggestions, but nothing new here. I’m just going to come to the conclusion that cars will get swirls no matter how careful you are. The only difference is that cars washed correctly have less. I have to admit that the swirls are minimal at this point, and can’t be seen in the sunlight. The imperfections are only visible at the correct angle, under nighttime parking lot lights.

Below is my step by step, perhaps someone can find an actual flaw, I should have been more specific when I started the thread, but I didn’t realize I would get such in depth analysis of my technique.

Ok here is my technique step by step:

1.I wash the wheels first. I use different towels that are never used on the rest of the cars paint. When I am finished I wash out the bucket.

2.I wash the car using two buckets. One for soap, and one for rinsing. My towels are 100 percent cotton, much nicer than the ones I use on my own body. Each towel is only used for one section of the car. One towel for the trunk, one for the roof, one for the hood, and one for each side of the car. If the car is really dirty I might use two towels for each side. I follow a top down procedure, rinsing the car after I complete each section.

3.I rotate the towels after each wipe, making sure to never wipe the car with the dirty side of the towel.

4.I always press lightly using the minimum amount of force to remove the dirt.

5.Finally, I dry the car with the leaf blower.

The only thing I could change are my towels. They are getting close to a year old, so perhaps they’ve lost their nap. I’ll have to take a trip to Bed Bath and Beyond this weekend because I was planning my first wax job.[list=1]

 

pk; might not be your washing technique at all; where do you live?; maybe its road salt and debris and dirt (which can cause swirls on the hood) sliding up your hood as you move down the road;

 

The two bucket method is the first step to preventing swirl marks. There is a great how to section (gave link below) that will help you with some points. Second link will help you get rid of the marks.
http://www.autogeek.net/exterior.html
http://www.autogeek.net/dual-action-polisher.html

 

You sound like you have a good system going on.

The only thing that I can think of that could be giving you swirl marks would be that your towels are scratching your car (It is possible). Either that or whatever you apply your wax with is scratching your car(has happened to me once before but I took the swirl marks out).

California Car Duster can give you swirl marks if it is dirty.

I dunno, how often do you wax? How often do you wash?

I wash at least once a week, and no swirl marks.

This is really puzzling me.

I got swirl marks once from waxing my car while it was slightly dusty. I used zaino z-5 and about 3 coats of it later the finish was back to perfection. I would try z5 before I used any abrasives on my car.

What brand were your towels? How much did you pay for them?

Sorry about the 10th degree, just trying to cover all the bases.

 

Seems kinda obvious, but worth mentioning:

Are you sure that you are the only one that washes the new car?

 

Really?! damn, was hoping to use this in between washes to get the dust off.

 

The dealership may have waxed/washed the car when they prepped it, but I don't remember seeing swirls between then and when I washed it this past Sunday. However, I don't think I really paid it close attention till the other night, so it is possible they were there already.

I paid about 20 buck a towel, go them in Macy's. Before I do any more work I am going to pick up some new towels this should eliminate the possibility that the towels have lost their nap.

In any case I find the situation a little perplexing and somewhat frustrating. However, a car is a car, and its going to get mess up.

I haven't waxed it yet, because I haven't had the time to do a good job. When I do get around to it, I will use a coat of Z5, and 2 of Z2. From that point on, I will apply Z-5 if necessary.

 

Swirl marks are caused by circular motions. Move fore/aft on horizontal surfaces, and up/down on vertical surfaces. You WILL scratch the paint anytime you touch it. You MUST keep these scratches approximating straight lines, so they are only visible from one angle, and look normal. The brain tends to ignore scratches that go in the direction the car travels, and vertical scratches on panels that are perpendicular to the ground. Hide the swirl marks you already have with Z5. Do the whole car. Wait 10 hrs. between coats. You may have to apply two coats of Z5. If not, follow it with Z2. Use Z6 to clean between coats. As per Zaino's instructions.

The "California Car Brush" is pretty good at minimizing scratches, but again, fore/aft on horizontal surfaces and up/down on vertical ones. DO NOT PRESS. Just drag the fibres over the car. I find going back and forth (or up and down) gets the dust in difficult spots.

Zaino recommends pure cotton bath towels. Trouble is, the stitching is not cotton. Also, I found the towel was so big I couldn't keep it from touching the ground. It picks up "stuff" that will scratch your car deeply from the ground. I use a "microfibre" towel now to dry the car. I use a pure cotton dish towel to clean off the dried Zaino. It's easier to control. Also, working over a grass surface is safer than over pavement.

Yes, I'm a fanatic. No, I don't make my swirl marks worse! Yes, my car has them. I cringe anytime I see people washing cars. Circular motions!!

"Can I wash your car, Uncle David?" "No, you don't know how to do it right. I'll teach you if you like." My relatives have learned!

 

Another thing I have learned is to NEVER run it through a car wash with brushes. Instant swirl marks b/c they hold the dirt from all the other vehicles that have been washed. Even if it is a Foam-Brite wash (which uses rubber or vinyl, not exactly sure) the marks will still come up. I always go through a touchless wash, which may not always be good because the chemicals are very acidic to draw the dirt away from the car. But I do that as long as I can, then gently wash it like has been discussed above, and wax it. Check with your local car wash and ask then if you can see the soaps being used. Most will not care one bit. Write down the chemicals in the soap, then look them up to see ph levels and so on. There is one near where I live that uses soap that is pH neutral (which is 7) but with the Eibach springs, my car is too low to go through it. Do a little research and it will pay off for you in the end. Brian

 

Rx-8 Friend,

How about when you're applying soap with your micro fiber mit? Circular motions not allowed there either??

Am I getting this right:

Sides of the car = left to right horizontal motions?
Hood, trunk, top= towards the back, towards the front (vertical) motions?

Man, I thought I knew it all when it came to washing cars... :o

 

my butler takes care of the messy aspecs of owning a car such as cleaning and refueling. I have yet to watch him do it yet the bird is never dirty.

 

Lol, this is a joke right?

Some people like the 'messy aspects' of owning a car. Washing and waxing this car gives you the opportunity to truly appreciate it.

 

I use clean cloth diapers (yes, those old fashioned ones before disposable came along) to dry after doing the cotton towel drag as mentioned before. And no, these were never used as real diapers before!!!

Also never use any type of fabric softener when washing/drying your towels. Cutting off the seams is a great idea, I never thought of that!

 

Mr. Clean Auto-Dry baby!

 

For hand-washing, try a hogs-hair brush

http://www.eastwoodco.com/shopping/p...yword=HOGSHAIR

The properties of the bristles help in 2 ways. First, they do a better job of lifting the dirt and keeping it away from the paint. Second, they make it harder to apply too much pressure, unlike a rag or mitt where it's easy to bear down. And, it encourages linear strokes. It's easy to rinse and will last forever. I'm not the most meticulous washer, but the hogs hair brush helps keep me out of trouble.

 

Nubo, that looks like it would scratch the hell outta the clearcoat. It doesn't?? is it super soft or sumpin?

 

Yeah, they're pretty soft and the bristles are a couple inches long. So you don't "scrub" with it,you pass it lightly over the surface. It's not like a hard nylon brush. You can run it across your face and it doesn't scratch; it will just tickle your nose.

 

Do you use fabric softener? It leaves a residue on towels that will scratch your paint. Also, some so-called 100 percent cotton towels have nylon backing or nylon edges. Try Cannon or Fieldcrest (same company, different brands).

Or bette yet, try a lambs wool mitt. I've been using one since I got my 8 last September and don't have any swirls.