AlexCisneros

Thank you all very much for showing. It was a great pleasure to meet all of you. We will be doing this again

evilmiata

We had an awesome time, Alex. I'm glad we met and got a chance to talk about tires.

jwitzer

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

This was such an awesome event. It was great to see how many Rotaries showed up and that everyone had a good time.

Don't make assumptions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

It started off nicely but then due to lack of communication some nine 7's didnt make the green light and we got separated from the pack. That is why I stress the importance of having two way radios and just Man keeping an eye on the pack so we can Caravan together. It was Chaos !

Gee, I thought you said you were so much better at caravans than RX8Honey was. And you couldn't keep one together for such a short trip?

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

There were some RX-8's from FLRX8CLUB already there like KYLiquid, Jeff 'DeltaV', DamnYankee, Mantis showed up a little later, Raymull I believe was there who I wanted to say Hello to but couldnt find him. Scott from Central Florida, Kevin from Central FL and some other RX-8 owners. Sadly enough our local RX-8 owners did not show which would have been great to have them be a part of this event. All in all there were about 10-12 RX-8's and I tried my best to meet all of them.

KY and DamnYankee arrived earlier, but Mantis, Evil8, others, and myself arrived, en masse and parked in formation. I think we made a decent impression on the BMW crowd as we entered. Interesting that our little, amateur club from so far away was able to bring 7 of those RX-8's.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

All the cars were parked in their respective categories ,, that is the 1st gens, 2nd gens, 3rd gens, and RX-8's. We had a chance to get to know one another but as it always happens the groups are somewhat divided where the 8's kept with their pack and 7's with theirs. I try at least with my crew to deter that kind of attitude because after all we are all Rotaries and as such we are of the same community so please let's all try to get to know each other and be a Rotary family.

Did I not come hunting you down to greet you and spend a bit of time expressing my hope for a good event?

Did I not introduce you to our membership?

Did ANY of your "crew" make any effort to welcome us?

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

The Parade Lap took place at approximately 5:36 PM with all the Rotaries in order of years starting with the 1st gens to the RX-8. It was one lap although it left me with the desire to take a second one. I believe the exciting part for me was the first part where if you didnt keep your car going fast enough it would drop down closer to inner track area. Just leaning like that on the outer bank was a great feeling. Its too bad that we werent allowed to go any faster ... really too bad. But all in all getting a chance to be on the track and showing off the Rotaries in front of the people sitting in the grandstands was great.

It is very easy to get real track time at facilities like Homestead, Sebring, Moroso, etc. Please do so to avoid another example of the "8 year olds who found a Playboy" (ooh, there's a BOOBY!) behavior, next time. Perhaps I expected too much.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

We headed out to Applebees ... well rather some of us and had a great time there to end the day.... I passed the word around to all Rotary owners that we would be going to Applebees in Homestead just outside of the Speedway after the event. Sadly none of the 8's showed up.

You did NOT "pass the word to all rotary owners". This is the first I am hearing about this invitation. Please, your attempts at pretending to be the good guy are becoming tiresome. I had attempted to mend the rift via my previous (long) post. I attempted to play the mediator at the track. I attempted to visit with your "crew". I attempted to see your side of the rift you created. I believed that you were interested in resolving the issues your attitude created. How foolish of me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

We only actually had one complaint within the rotary group. I addressed the issue and we moved on. I cant really expect that everyone is not going to behave... most of us did but at times It is just something that we cant avoid. So I ask of all of you to please try to behave so we dont **** anyone off as it was the case with one of the Rotary owners. I am not going to mention the individual who lodged the complaint and brought it to my attention because I dont want any Sibling Rivalry amongst the Rotaries. At least lets try on any future events to just get along and behave accordingly.

I stand by my complaint. I have never been as angry and embarrassed to be associated with such an infantile group of human beings in my life. I am not prone to hyperbole. I couldn't even assemble a coherent statement during our "discussion" of the events.

I said in my previous post:

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwitzer

Now I'd bet that the demographic [of the RX-7 crowd] tilts towards a far younger crowd who grew up with the Fast and the Furious as the model for proper car club mentality. I’m not sure I’d fit in as well anymore. The RX-8 club feels more like the RX-7 club did back then… and I relish the friends I have made here. Perhaps it is telling that almost all of my close friends from the RX-7 Big List days have moved on to other vehicles.

How sadly correct I was. The immaturity of several of the FD drivers in your "crew" was astounding. They turned the honor of a parade lap into an outlet for stupid pubescent bravado. Driving ridiculously slowly through the corners for the sole purpose of creating a gap so burnouts and "high" speed could be performed is something I would expect from ricers (and I use that term in the most derogatory way possible). Children, any amateur can stomp on the throttle. Burnouts in the tunnel? C'mon!

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

One last note... to end the Drama between the 8's and the 7's as I attempted to yesterday when I approached Mantis from Orlando area. I want to apologize for being harsh with my posts on the RX8 forum. I tried locating Raymull to have a word with him as well and I did mention it to Jeff 'DeltaV' ? that I was looking for him. I dont know if he got that message but I would have liked for him to have approached me.

Again, don't try to play the good guy. Removing the knife you inserted in their backs deserves no recognition for honor. I had thought that their previous reactions were a bit excessive, now I wonder how they put up with this so long.

Mantis

Alex, a great event. Our group had a lot of fun driving down together and meeting up with you again. It was nice to see Chris and you and your beautiful 8s. There were 10 RX8s present which 7 were from out group that drove down from Orlando and Tampa. It was so much fun to drive the track, see the race 8s in action and just be around so many beautiful rotarys.

Preacher or SoFlaguy, what can I say. There would have been no drama if you hadn't created it. I know you think that there is no harm in talking about how our group sucks, but that won't get you more involvment. You dont have to slander a person to offend them. Our group is about the enthusiast. We dont have a lot of patience for nit picking about how a caravan was driven or complaining about a meet you organized that didnt have any 8s compared to an event for rotarys that took over 3 months to plan.

We went to this event for the event, and to spend time with our fellow enthusiasts. That is probably why you didnt have a lot of drama at the event or a lot of discussion. We dont care about that stuff.

As for your invite to us for Applebees, are you kidding?

Alex, we had a blast and would welcome any meets in the future.

evilmiata

HaHaHa! All the way to Miami for Applebees? Preach, you have no idea how good you have it down there! We hit a local Cuban diner for some AWESOME food.

Razpewton

I wish I would have gone now, if for nothing else, to meet Alex. He seems to be a genuinely righteous dude who goes out of his way to do things for people. I respect that. THAT to me, is really what it's all about.

Mantis

Oh, what was that place called? It was soooo good.

SOFLA RX CLUB

Did you not have a good time? I felt that the general feeling was positive. Alex himself told me that the people he spoke with felt really positive about this venue and the coming together of rotaries.

I never referred to your club as being amateur.. and I genuinely was pleased that many RX-8's made it to the event. I get excited when i see as many rotaries together.


Yes Jeff... you did come over and approach me to talk to me and that gave me a good feeling. You also told me to overlook Raymull's comments because you felt that he just gets too emotional. I can understand it. I wanted to meet him to talk to him but I didnt see him and you didnt convey my interest to him about wanting to meet either. For that I am surprised because I felt it was your interest as well for us to patch things up.



The only person out of your group that I remembered mentioning going to Applebees after the event was an Asian guy in your RX8 group. I wasnt around much after talking to him in the Chalet tent. I spent a lot of time over at the Speedsource pit talking to Carlos Lopez CLR Motorsports who happens to be in my club. He is supporter of my club as well and works on my vert motor and Weber Carb that he installed in my RX7 Convertible.

I remembered seeing how upset you got but I also asked you to point out who it was that you saw driving crazy. The first rule is to confront and voice it out instead of just keeping it in the dark. I addressed the issue right after we spoke but it was as important for you to come over and address it as well less any hostility. No one was going to throw down.... but you needed to step up to the plate and confront that person directly in my presence. Everyone is entitled to that to convey as well as recieve. As I attempted with Raymull but that boy never showed his face to me.

I know the general rule was to have at least 3 car lengths between the cars. Some of the 1st gens if you walked over and saw the Dyno stats were at 437 RWHP and the Red 1st gen was at 476 RWHP. We had an FD with 512RWHP and you cant expect for someone who is out there on the track to not want to display that. One of the guys happens to be in his mid 40's. You drive a more serene rotary that I believe has 237HP to the flywheel and 217 RWHP. It's too bad that our local Miami RX8 guy didnt make it out to this event because his 8 has a turbo putting out about 300HP. Burnout in the tunnel ? I dont know anything about that but regardless of that get over it man... You had your chance to voice it on Saturday and that is exactly what you should have done instead lashing it out on the forum like an internet thug.

Ok.. fine... you say I inserted the knife... ok .. now what was I prepared to do about it ? I told you when i spoke with you ... and I approached that pretty looking Baby Doll Mantis...She told me exactly how she felt about it and about me.. I had a lot more respect for Mantis at that point because she did what i would have expected a person to do and that is to step up to the plate... but where was Raymull ? You know well that I told you that I wanted to talk to him and be a man about it and step up to the plate right ? You were aware of it... and you said that it would be a good idea.. did you not ? I asked you to point him out but you didnt do that.. so I asked you to let him know that I am looking for him... all you said was not to worry about it because he has the tendency of getting too emotional.. remember telling me that ? In all the time that I was there in your presence on Saturday I was waiting for Raymull to step up to the plate and talk to me... even if he wanted to tell me off.. well you know what ? I would have recieved it and listened to what he had to say... I was open to it... but he wasnt able to do that... I wonder why ... all i wanted was just to talk but he didnt ... was he too afraid ? what was the problem... two adults cant talk things over.. I was prepared for that Jeff and you knew that.

swoope

iTrader: (5)

alex,
i dont think i got to meet you, but you guys did a great job. i had a great time... would love to do it again.

my only suggestion would be a jumbotron in the turn one entrance to the road course. as most of the road course is blocked from veiw by the haulers...

beers

WYSIWYGKahuna

JWitzer,


A number of incidents took place on this past saturday at Homestead Motor Speedway which have troubled many members of the Rotary community. To organize my discussion, I suggest that we take one step back in the casual chain and shelter initially unpopular truths from suppression, enabling them to ultimately win out through competition in the environment of Rotorheads.

I find JWitzer's fulminations symptomatic of a dangerous but spreading mentality. Am I aware of how JWitzer will react when he reads that last sentence? Yes. Do I care? No, because I have a message for him. My message is that, for the good of us all, he should never caricature and stereotype people from other cultures. RX7 people are the true lovers of the wankel motor whereas the RX8 is the poster child look nice car for the Yuppie inbreed types of which I met this past saturday at HMS. JWitzer should never even try to do such a pouty thing. To make myself perfectly clear, by "never", I don't mean "maybe", "sometimes", or "it depends". I mean only that JWitzer wants to control your bank account, your employment, your personal safety, and your mind. It gets better: He believes that all major world powers are controlled by a covert group of "insiders". I guess no one's ever told him that his criticisms have never successfully disproved a single fact. Instead, JWitzer's criticisms are based solely on his emotions and gut reactions. Well, I refuse to get caught up in his "I think … I believe … I feel" game.

One of the goals of Bonapartism is to render meaningless the words "best" and "worst". JWitzer admires that philosophy because, by annihilating human perceptions of quality, JWitzer's own mediocrity can flourish. Although it requires risk, commitment, and follow-through to expose his teachings for what they really are, he maintains that doing the fashionable thing is more important than life or liberty. Perhaps it would be best for him to awaken from his delusional narcoleptic fantasyland and observe that he possesses no significant intellectual skills whatsoever and has no interest in erudition. Heck, he can't even spell or define "erudition", much less achieve it.

Just like dirty clothes on the floor and cluttered closets, JWitzer's mess won't go away if we simply look the other way. JWitzer's goal is to scar little children's self-image. How rabid is that? How overweening? How blasphemous? When his sophistries are challenged, JWitzer stages an outpouring of phony emotion in order to look good to the public. Of course, this sounds simple, but in reality, the real issue is simple: I am fed up with his snarky and unscrupulous behavior. All in all, I realize that this letter has seemed incredibly bleak. However, expecting the worst from JWitzer means we will never be disappointed. If we're wrong and he does not try to guarantee the destruction of anything that looks like a vital community, we'll be relieved. If we're right and he does, we'll be prepared.


Omarian
'93 FD Black 523RWHP
'05 RX8 Black GReddy Turbocharged 317HP

jwitzer

Omarian,

Thank you for injecting levity into the discussion! That was a real treat... :-)

Where did you get the boilerplate?

Mantis

It seems weird to post your car stats after that speech.

Now Preacher, it would be the appropriate time to conclude this pissing contest. It seems that we will get no where fast with this kind of talk. JWitzer is very reserved by nature but ferociously loyal to his friends.

jwitzer

I did until the parade lap.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

Yes Jeff... you did come over and approach me to talk to me and that gave me a good feeling. You also told me to overlook Raymull's comments because you felt that he just gets too emotional.

What I said was that he was passionate and was protecting the ones he cares about. Please be careful when you quote me as you changed the meaning of my statement.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

I can understand it. I wanted to meet him to talk to him but I didnt see him and you didnt convey my interest to him about wanting to meet either. For that I am surprised because I felt it was your interest as well for us to patch things up.

Your request to meet Raymull was passed. Whether he was willing or able to find you is beyond my control. Do not question my original motives to heal the rift. I would not have been so let down had I not cared so much about the rotary community as a whole. I could have easily distanced myself from the FD crowd following their antics, but I am, at heart, a passionate and involved 3rd Generation RX-7 developer and fan.

Do you see my avatar?

Is it an RX-8?

I would love to build another 3rd gen, but being a man who loves his baby daughter and not being a rich yuppie (despite accusations in another forum), I cannot afford a track-day-only car. The RX-8 is the best answer for my current needs. It handles as well (perhaps a bit better) than a stock 3rd gen, its interior is far superior (my main complaint about the 3rd gen - which was built for a different purpose), and it still has the soul of a rotary. I recognize, and have mentioned often within the RX-8 community (who probably wish I would stop) that this car is about 80 to 100 hp down from where I believe it should have been. With time, I hope to resolve this issue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

The only person out of your group that I remembered mentioning going to Applebees after the event was an Asian guy in your RX8 group.

Please describe this gentleman more precisely as I do not recognize any member of our group by that description.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

I remembered seeing how upset you got but I also asked you to point out who it was that you saw driving crazy. The first rule is to confront and voice it out instead of just keeping it in the dark. I addressed the issue right after we spoke but it was as important for you to come over and address it as well less any hostility. No one was going to throw down.... but you needed to step up to the plate and confront that person directly in my presence.

My intent was not to call out or punish individuals, but to advise you as their leader that it might be in your (our) group's best interest if you brought up the issue at a later date. I'm sure these individuals would have misconstrued my concerns as a continuation of the Preacher v FLRX8Club battle, which never involved me directly. I also thought that it was best that you heard it from me rather than an HMS track official denying any future request to participate. As our groups' elder statesmen, I thought it would be best relayed via the off-line summit meeting I initiated at your table rather than a direct, fix-it-now challenge in the middle of the crowd.



I fail to see how the horsepower of a car and the maturity of the driver are linked. If you have ever had any sufficient track experience, you would know that horsepower alone rarely produces good lap times. I was beating Hennessey Viper 650s and 480 Hp 911TTs with my (then) sub-400 Hp 3rd gen at venues that somewhat reward horsepower (Sebring, Road Atlanta). I've also had my hat handed to me by lower powered vehicles (albeit, driven by SCCA regional champions - I won't mention the car to save my own embarassment). I didn't see ANYONE taking proper lines. All I saw was some very slow driving mixed with a drag racing mentality. How one-dimentional.

And, again, it was a PARADE lap. Parades are slow. Ever see a rooster tail at Macy's? Didn't think so. You want the topless girls at Mardi Gras to go flying by? Not me.

Save your (not you specifically, Preacher) Schumacher imitations for driver-education and track days, which are easy to find and cheaper and more effective than those big wings, big tires, and (who the hell needs them) big stereos.


I wonder how I would fare against your burn-out-bretheren in 10 laps. Perhaps not as badly as you think...

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

It's too bad that our local Miami RX8 guy didnt make it out to this event because his 8 has a turbo putting out about 300HP. Burnout in the tunnel ? I dont know anything about that but regardless of that get over it man... You had your chance to voice it on Saturday and that is exactly what you should have done instead lashing it out on the forum like an internet thug.

I was going to let it drop until I read your self-promotion. I have always had trouble leaving injustices and untruths lie. Perhaps it is the latent superhero in me



Mantis is first-class all the way. No doubt. She has had more to do with the success of this club than any other individual, and there is a very strong second tier helping her out, working their butts off, because we all want this to succeed. I should warn you, though, that she has a killer right hook to the forehead and doesn't seem too fond of being refered to in the diminutive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOFLA RX CLUB

but where was Raymull ? You know well that I told you that I wanted to talk to him and be a man about it and step up to the plate right ? You were aware of it... and you said that it would be a good idea.. did you not ? I asked you to point him out but you didnt do that..

How could I point him out if he wasn't there when you asked?

[references to Raymull deleted as the issue was answered above]

Bottom line... I was trying to help you identify individuals in your group to be mentored or weeded out as you saw fit. This is why a pre-lap clarification is usually given by the organizer. "You will stay in line. You will not pass. You will not exceed XX mph. Please have fun. Please be safe." I understand HMS did not do this. Perhaps we should have taken this as our responsibility. Next time, I hope you'll join me in making greater strides to ensure everyone's enjoyment, safety, and responsibility.

I'm done with this issue.

evilmiata

WYSIWYGKahuna,

Allow me the honor of giving you a brief lesson in WYSIWYGKahuna's many amoral attributes. First, the misinformation: WYSIWYGKahuna suggests that a plausible excuse is a satisfactory substitute for performance. Where the heck did he come up with that? Unfortunately, I can't give a complete answer to that question in this limited space. But I can tell you that I have to wonder where he got the idea that it is my view that he can ignore rules, laws, and protocol without repercussion. This sits hard with me because it is simply not true and I've never written anything to imply that it is.

What, then, does "phytopaleontological" mean? It means considerably more than any dictionary is likely to say. WYSIWYGKahuna will damage the debate about this issue, because we will have to spend lots of time correcting misunderstandings that are directly attributable to his analects. Sometimes, insensitive lounge lizards are so mawkish, they merit special attention. But don't take my word for it; ask any inhumane hooligan you happen to meet. Even his least psychotic lapdogs supplement their already-generous incomes by selling contraband on the black market. I could write pages on the subject, but the following should suffice. WYSIWYGKahuna has never gotten ahead because of his hard work or innovative ideas. Rather, all of WYSIWYGKahuna's successes are due to kickbacks, bribes, black market double-dealing, outright thuggery, and unsavory political intrigue.

WYSIWYGKahuna's reasoning is circular and therefore invalid. In other words, he always begins an argument with his conclusion (e.g., that we have too much freedom) and therefore -- not surprisingly -- he always arrives at that very conclusion. If one could get a Ph.D. in Autism, WYSIWYGKahuna would be the first in line to have one. Let me close by reminding you that WYSIWYGKahuna has an utter disregard for human life.

SOFLA RX CLUB

I did notice a yellow FD in your avatar.

I was talking to Alex today and he was telling me of how well the 8 handles so I am with you there on it. I test drove it when it first came out.. even though it didnt have the power that I am used to in the 7's , the interior was beautiful and aesthetically it was pleasing to the eyes as well. The 8 is roomy and I felt safe in it. I was just disspointed in the power that it did not have. Otherwise it felt nice.
Last month I bought a '94 FD for less than 5 grand. Its a project track and drift car for the club. My love is for the FC and with the Weber motor built by Carlos Lopez is more than enough. I also have an '88 Porsche 928S which will have a 3 rotor in the next couple of months. This car has a Gembala wide body kit and sports 335-30-18 tires. My FC Vert will have a 480 HP motor single turbo T70 with .68 back housing which should spool up quicker.







All I remember is that he was one of the three persons that were there when I got there.. hissilver 8 and back window had some white letters "O.F. ____" .. I am not able to remember the rest and he was wearing black with prescription glasses.

I did just that Jeff... I did have a meeting with them at the very beginning about behaving and the rules as they were read by one of the officers of the club named Abel. I usually do talk to everyone prior to and during to remind them but I cannot babysit them... Yes, Jeff I would like for there to be Harmony between the rotaries and perhaps in time some will overlook what has transpired within the last couple of weeks and most especially at this weekend's event at HMS. Ono another note.. I didnt mean any disrespect when I referred to Mantis as a baby doll.... I was just simply attempting to convey that I found her to be an attractive woman... simply that. Its great that she has worked to make your venues as successful as they have been. Out here I have been a one man show in trying to get the meets to pan out and getting things organized. I didnt always have the support of my peers and involvement from its members, It has gotten better and its representative in the number of persons that have made it out to my events. So I am with you in making greater strides to ensure everyone's enjoyment, safety, and responsibility. Be well.

AlexCisneros

ok, here is my two cents. I had a great time, met great people (all of you), and was able to share a "track experience" with people who were able to bring back the memories I had when I first stepped on to the track (I'm a bit jaded )

HMS didn't lay out the rules, because they trusted me to do it. I failed in that department (they mostly wanted us to have fun, safely). I know that I mentioned it somewhere, but I really can't remember where as there were three forums I was bouncing around (not to mention being in contact with some of the other car clubs to get participation up so we could do this again).

All in all, HMS was pleased. They were mainly concerned about us having a good time. The incident... pfft... It was unfortunate, but barely noticed (you have no idea the crap I've seen there by other people). I don't want to make assumptions as to why it happened, but sheer excitement might have had a hand in it.

*cough* I did * cough* but then I brought up the rear and can run HMS with my eyes closed


so... with that said, I think I will leave this thread on a positive note.

It was very nice meeting all of you! I had a blast! and now I'm going to make sure the thread stays positive as I am locking it. (one of the perks of being a mod )