General Intake Info/Questions
12-29-2003, 05:14 PM
#179
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Looks awesome, great find! - Is that carbon fiber that they've used on the housing? Do you think the price would be reduced if they used another material? $1085 is some serious coin for an intake, IMO. Any hp numbers that you can share with us? Thanks in advance.
12-29-2003, 05:42 PM
#180
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I found that filter on corksport.com
http://www.corksport.com/main.php3?p...3Fcat%3D260821
no dyno chart, hp claims, nothing.
It looks like to me it is a carbon fiber housing.
Yes, I agree. $1085 for an intake is VERY EXPENSIVE.
http://www.corksport.com/main.php3?p...3Fcat%3D260821
no dyno chart, hp claims, nothing.
It looks like to me it is a carbon fiber housing.
Yes, I agree. $1085 for an intake is VERY EXPENSIVE.
01-01-2004, 03:53 PM
#181
The fact of this matter is that until we get some OBDII data logged for the MAP (Manifold Absolute Pressure) on a power run (i.e. dyno or street) then we can't actually say the stock intake is bad.
I have had the opportunity to try a so-called "CAI" on my car. It increased the induction noise "buzz" to what I would consider verging on rice.
My coitometer (my term for butt dyno) really can't detect a few kW at the wheels like the makers claim.
My eye and brain did inspect both the aftermarket and stock setups, and I report the following:
I also was privy to reading a RX-8 technical training manual. It made particular mention of replacement air intakes. It said if a vehicle was presented with a running/idling problem, and it had a non-standard air intake, then it should be replaced with the factory unit. I also mentioned that an aftermarket "wet" filter element could provide a false reading in the MAF.
When we get some valid MAP data, we can tell if there is a "restriction". The goal is to get as close to ATMO as possible inside the manifold.
Anyway - some information for everyone to digest, listen to, or ignore.
Cheers,
Hymee.
PS - my buddy did some scientific/controlled real world tests with a stopwatch. An acceleration run in his RX-8 at WOT from low RPM to high RPM in one gear, showed the aftermarket intake setup was 2 - 3% SLOWER than the stock one. This was the average result over 4 runs with each intake. Speaks volumes really!
I have had the opportunity to try a so-called "CAI" on my car. It increased the induction noise "buzz" to what I would consider verging on rice.
My coitometer (my term for butt dyno) really can't detect a few kW at the wheels like the makers claim.
My eye and brain did inspect both the aftermarket and stock setups, and I report the following:
- The standard air box is a true CAI. I have not seen better on a production car.
- The standard air box has VERY fine mesh screen to smooth the airflow over the MAF sensor. A smooth flow is essential for an accurate reading.
- The aftermarket setup did not have any devices to provide laminar flow to the MAF. When I removed the filter and just started the engine with the MAF tube only, the engine did not idle properly.
- The aftermarket tube did not have a lovely bell shaped opening like the stock setup.
- The aftermarket setup was NOT a CAI. It was open to HOT engine bay air. This is a definate no-no. Even though it was shielded, it was not sealed (or even close to being sealed. It was well manufacturerd, but the design was lacking.
- I did not measure the diameter of the tube, but if it differs from the stock one, then the PCM will calculate incorrect air flow. This is because the MAF signal is based around velocity of air, with a known cross-section of tube. If the cross-sectional area changes, then the true air-flow requirements of the engine are incorrect.
I also was privy to reading a RX-8 technical training manual. It made particular mention of replacement air intakes. It said if a vehicle was presented with a running/idling problem, and it had a non-standard air intake, then it should be replaced with the factory unit. I also mentioned that an aftermarket "wet" filter element could provide a false reading in the MAF.
When we get some valid MAP data, we can tell if there is a "restriction". The goal is to get as close to ATMO as possible inside the manifold.
Anyway - some information for everyone to digest, listen to, or ignore.
Cheers,
Hymee.
PS - my buddy did some scientific/controlled real world tests with a stopwatch. An acceleration run in his RX-8 at WOT from low RPM to high RPM in one gear, showed the aftermarket intake setup was 2 - 3% SLOWER than the stock one. This was the average result over 4 runs with each intake. Speaks volumes really!
Last edited by Hymee; 01-01-2004 at 03:56 PM.
01-01-2004, 10:17 PM
#182
So Hymee, what's your take on drop-in KN type "high performance" filters? Do you think this would be better than a replacement aftermarket intake or stock paper element filter or is it better to leave everything stock on this intake?
01-01-2004, 11:20 PM
#183
To be honest I was surprised when I read the training manual, and it discouraged the use of the "wet element" type filter.
I would have thought that they would be OK. I have a KingDragon replacement element left over from my previous LS1 powered vehicle. Not the correct size though - not surprising. But it is important to note that the element for the LS1 (a 5.7L engine) was SMALLER than the RX-8's element. So the RX-8 one would seem an adequate size.
I suppose I really want to see how the MAP figures shape up!
Cheers,
Hymee.
I would have thought that they would be OK. I have a KingDragon replacement element left over from my previous LS1 powered vehicle. Not the correct size though - not surprising. But it is important to note that the element for the LS1 (a 5.7L engine) was SMALLER than the RX-8's element. So the RX-8 one would seem an adequate size.
I suppose I really want to see how the MAP figures shape up!
Cheers,
Hymee.
01-09-2004, 09:05 AM
#184
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cai-needed?
I was wondering if someone could tell me if i need to upgrade my intake, when i upgrade the exhaust. Right now i have the money for both, but i could live with just the exhaust as then i could buy some other things like a valentine 1 radar det.
The problem that I'm thinking may happen is that when you free up the exhaust side it might put an extra pull on the intake side but I'm not sure. As you can tell I'm fairly new at this.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
The problem that I'm thinking may happen is that when you free up the exhaust side it might put an extra pull on the intake side but I'm not sure. As you can tell I'm fairly new at this.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
01-09-2004, 09:14 AM
#185
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No, the factory intake is actually pretty good. Results of intakes are varied, some claiming up to 10HP gain, but you won't lose anything to the intake if you just upgrade the exhaust.
Hope this helps.
Hope this helps.
Last edited by Omicron; 01-09-2004 at 09:17 AM.
01-09-2004, 09:15 AM
#186
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Originally posted by Omicron
No, the factory intake is actually pretty good. Results of intakes are varied, some claiming up to 10HP gain, but you won't lost anything to the intake if you just upgrade the exhaust.
Hope this helps.
No, the factory intake is actually pretty good. Results of intakes are varied, some claiming up to 10HP gain, but you won't lost anything to the intake if you just upgrade the exhaust.
Hope this helps.
Thanks,
Chris
01-10-2004, 06:39 PM
#190
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Wouldn't it be safe to say that the cars computer via the mass air sensor is only going to allow a certain amount of air anyway, regardless of what type of air inducton one has,due to the factory setting parameters, Does it work that way? Or is it, that if the car is getting more or denser airflow it will automatically compensate with more fuel and spark? Anyway I like the stock setup better, due to the fact it is totaly enclosed and is made of plastic which doesn't retain heat like metal, I think a better flowing filter element is all it needs!
01-13-2004, 03:31 PM
#198
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Re: cold air intake?
Originally posted by 2_furious
hom many horses does the leading Cold air intake give a stock RX-8 engine?
hom many horses does the leading Cold air intake give a stock RX-8 engine?
They sound great, though!
Regards,
Gordon
