interest in how to cool your engine thread?
08-09-2010 | 12:50 PM
#26
I divide by zero
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,192
Likes: 0
From: Spring Hill, FL
I think that is part of the reason I've not had temp problems even with a top mount. Air flows pretty freely through my engine bay. Everyone always sees where my tubo is and says "wow your engine must get HOT!" but it really doesnt.
08-09-2010 | 01:33 PM
#27
3-wheeler
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,734
Likes: 0
From: Phoenix
Interesting, I have a chance to openly disagree with Ray.
I feel the oil temperature data is just as important as the water temperature given the unique role that oil pays as both a lubricant and a cooling device in the RENESIS. It's assumed that oil follows water temperature at a fairly linear matter but that certainly is not always the situation. The oil temperature can certainly exceed water temps rather quickly depending on the available airflow and operating conditions of the car.
With race track situations your oil temperature will typically follow your water temps due to the increased amount of airflow to the oil coolers. However, in situations where speed drops it's not unusual for your oil system to become saturated while your water system remains under control. The difference comes down to having fans on your radiator vs. not having them on your coolers. That's not to say that excessive oil temperatures at low speed/low load are dangerous but that airflow is what makes the difference.
Water temps also fall much faster than oil temperatures due to the physical properties of oil.
That all being said, I believe that if you're going to have an exterior water temperature gauge then you should also have an oil pressure and temperature gauge. All three give you a firm understanding of the condition of your motor while water temperature only tells one part of the story.
I've ran all 3 gauges for over 3 years in my own RX8 and found the data very valuable.
I feel the oil temperature data is just as important as the water temperature given the unique role that oil pays as both a lubricant and a cooling device in the RENESIS. It's assumed that oil follows water temperature at a fairly linear matter but that certainly is not always the situation. The oil temperature can certainly exceed water temps rather quickly depending on the available airflow and operating conditions of the car.
With race track situations your oil temperature will typically follow your water temps due to the increased amount of airflow to the oil coolers. However, in situations where speed drops it's not unusual for your oil system to become saturated while your water system remains under control. The difference comes down to having fans on your radiator vs. not having them on your coolers. That's not to say that excessive oil temperatures at low speed/low load are dangerous but that airflow is what makes the difference.
Water temps also fall much faster than oil temperatures due to the physical properties of oil.
That all being said, I believe that if you're going to have an exterior water temperature gauge then you should also have an oil pressure and temperature gauge. All three give you a firm understanding of the condition of your motor while water temperature only tells one part of the story.
I've ran all 3 gauges for over 3 years in my own RX8 and found the data very valuable.
08-09-2010 | 01:40 PM
#28
Interesting, I have a chance to openly disagree with Ray.
I feel the oil temperature data is just as important as the water temperature given the unique role that oil pays as both a lubricant and a cooling device in the RENESIS. It's assumed that oil follows water temperature at a fairly linear matter but that certainly is not always the situation. The oil temperature can certainly exceed water temps rather quickly depending on the available airflow and operating conditions of the car.
With race track situations your oil temperature will typically follow your water temps due to the increased amount of airflow to the oil coolers. However, in situations where speed drops it's not unusual for your oil system to become saturated while your water system remains under control. The difference comes down to having fans on your radiator vs. not having them on your coolers. That's not to say that excessive oil temperatures at low speed/low load are dangerous but that airflow is what makes the difference.
Water temps also fall much faster than oil temperatures due to the physical properties of oil.
That all being said, I believe that if you're going to have an exterior water temperature gauge then you should also have an oil pressure and temperature gauge. All three give you a firm understanding of the condition of your motor while water temperature only tells one part of the story.
I've ran all 3 gauges for over 3 years in my own RX8 and found the data very valuable.
I feel the oil temperature data is just as important as the water temperature given the unique role that oil pays as both a lubricant and a cooling device in the RENESIS. It's assumed that oil follows water temperature at a fairly linear matter but that certainly is not always the situation. The oil temperature can certainly exceed water temps rather quickly depending on the available airflow and operating conditions of the car.
With race track situations your oil temperature will typically follow your water temps due to the increased amount of airflow to the oil coolers. However, in situations where speed drops it's not unusual for your oil system to become saturated while your water system remains under control. The difference comes down to having fans on your radiator vs. not having them on your coolers. That's not to say that excessive oil temperatures at low speed/low load are dangerous but that airflow is what makes the difference.
Water temps also fall much faster than oil temperatures due to the physical properties of oil.
That all being said, I believe that if you're going to have an exterior water temperature gauge then you should also have an oil pressure and temperature gauge. All three give you a firm understanding of the condition of your motor while water temperature only tells one part of the story.
I've ran all 3 gauges for over 3 years in my own RX8 and found the data very valuable.
08-09-2010 | 01:53 PM
#29
Turbos blow!!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,584
Likes: 0
From: my engine bay
My temps were lowered pretty good when I removed my battery and bottom tray as well.
08-09-2010 | 02:24 PM
#30
I am one of those in the well over 90 and no humidity class. I have run out of room for cooling mods so I will just post what I do have and tell you what I experience. My 8 is a s/c 4port a/t.
Mazmart thermostat
Mazmart water pump
BHR radiator for the a/t
Pettit secondary cooler
Cobb AP for early fan turn on
I finally got all the coolant mods installed and decided to do a very spirited run in the late afternoon with the highest temp for the season (so far). Now the ambient is 119 degrees F humidity level of 6% and my water temps are no higher that 223.
I have two oil coolers (one more than stock for a 4 port a/t) and my oil temperature is running in the 218 - 225 range (Easy_E1 just tested that)
The BHR radiator has a built in tranny cooler (similar to stock but much bigger) and my tranny temps are one to two degrees higher than my water temp.
My after cooler temps are running much cooler since Ray (BHR) put on custom cold air intake. The temps vary so much that I am not really able to give those but the seem to be about two degrees above ambient.
I am finally happy with the water and air intake temps.
Mazmart thermostat
Mazmart water pump
BHR radiator for the a/t
Pettit secondary cooler
Cobb AP for early fan turn on
I finally got all the coolant mods installed and decided to do a very spirited run in the late afternoon with the highest temp for the season (so far). Now the ambient is 119 degrees F humidity level of 6% and my water temps are no higher that 223.
I have two oil coolers (one more than stock for a 4 port a/t) and my oil temperature is running in the 218 - 225 range (Easy_E1 just tested that)
The BHR radiator has a built in tranny cooler (similar to stock but much bigger) and my tranny temps are one to two degrees higher than my water temp.
My after cooler temps are running much cooler since Ray (BHR) put on custom cold air intake. The temps vary so much that I am not really able to give those but the seem to be about two degrees above ambient.
I am finally happy with the water and air intake temps.
08-09-2010 | 02:28 PM
#31
Interesting, I have a chance to openly disagree with Ray.
I feel the oil temperature data is just as important as the water temperature given the unique role that oil pays as both a lubricant and a cooling device in the RENESIS. It's assumed that oil follows water temperature at a fairly linear matter but that certainly is not always the situation. The oil temperature can certainly exceed water temps rather quickly depending on the available airflow and operating conditions of the car.
With race track situations your oil temperature will typically follow your water temps due to the increased amount of airflow to the oil coolers. However, in situations where speed drops it's not unusual for your oil system to become saturated while your water system remains under control. The difference comes down to having fans on your radiator vs. not having them on your coolers. That's not to say that excessive oil temperatures at low speed/low load are dangerous but that airflow is what makes the difference.
Water temps also fall much faster than oil temperatures due to the physical properties of oil.
That all being said, I believe that if you're going to have an exterior water temperature gauge then you should also have an oil pressure and temperature gauge. All three give you a firm understanding of the condition of your motor while water temperature only tells one part of the story.
I've ran all 3 gauges for over 3 years in my own RX8 and found the data very valuable.
I feel the oil temperature data is just as important as the water temperature given the unique role that oil pays as both a lubricant and a cooling device in the RENESIS. It's assumed that oil follows water temperature at a fairly linear matter but that certainly is not always the situation. The oil temperature can certainly exceed water temps rather quickly depending on the available airflow and operating conditions of the car.
With race track situations your oil temperature will typically follow your water temps due to the increased amount of airflow to the oil coolers. However, in situations where speed drops it's not unusual for your oil system to become saturated while your water system remains under control. The difference comes down to having fans on your radiator vs. not having them on your coolers. That's not to say that excessive oil temperatures at low speed/low load are dangerous but that airflow is what makes the difference.
Water temps also fall much faster than oil temperatures due to the physical properties of oil.
That all being said, I believe that if you're going to have an exterior water temperature gauge then you should also have an oil pressure and temperature gauge. All three give you a firm understanding of the condition of your motor while water temperature only tells one part of the story.
I've ran all 3 gauges for over 3 years in my own RX8 and found the data very valuable.
That's it, do you monitor intake temps?
08-09-2010 | 02:49 PM
#32
Thread Starter
Registered
iTrader: (3)
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,828
Likes: 38
From: macon, georgia
Phil---thats a good result for your world ---folks take note please!
WHile i will agree that removing stuff from behind the radiator (oem cooling system requires the air to almost take two 90 degrees turns--one coming in and the other going out!) will result in coolant temps decreasing, people need to be aware that underhood engine bay temps will rise. That may not be a good thing. The heat has to go somewhere and air movement in the engine bay is not good.
But, it is, imho, an important note to those that choose to install a more efficent radiator. Air has to get through that radiator for it to help.
WHile i will agree that removing stuff from behind the radiator (oem cooling system requires the air to almost take two 90 degrees turns--one coming in and the other going out!) will result in coolant temps decreasing, people need to be aware that underhood engine bay temps will rise. That may not be a good thing. The heat has to go somewhere and air movement in the engine bay is not good.
But, it is, imho, an important note to those that choose to install a more efficent radiator. Air has to get through that radiator for it to help.
08-09-2010 | 02:55 PM
#33
Turbos blow!!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,584
Likes: 0
From: my engine bay
I do. I constantly monitor intake and coolant temps amongst a couple other things. Prior to the battery relocation and tray removal my intake temps were about 17 degrees above ambient and my coolant temps were around 210-220 whole cruising in 90 degree weather. Now my intake temps are about 5 degrees above ambient and coolant never sees 200. The highest I've seen coolant is a few days ago at 194 with it being 96 degrees out. My intake sits directly behind my intercooler.
My engine bay temps cool too after a good drive. I can touch the intake and charge tubes without discomfort. I have the tien hood dampers which slightly raise the hood a bit and gives it a ghetto cowl induction.
My engine bay temps cool too after a good drive. I can touch the intake and charge tubes without discomfort. I have the tien hood dampers which slightly raise the hood a bit and gives it a ghetto cowl induction.
Last edited by Cattywampus; 08-09-2010 at 03:00 PM.
08-09-2010 | 03:03 PM
#34
I do. I constantly monitor intake and coolant temps amongst a couple other things. Prior to the battery relocation and tray removal my intake temps were about 17 degrees above ambient and my coolant temps were around 210-220 whole cruising in 90 degree weather. Now my intake temps are about 5 degrees above ambient and coolant never sees 200. The highest I've seen coolant is a few days ago at 194 with it being 96 degrees out. My intake sits directly behind my intercooler.
My engine bay temps cool too after a good drive. I can touch the intake and charge tubes without discomfort. I have the tien hood dampers which slightly raise the hood a bit and gives it a ghetto cowl induction.
My engine bay temps cool too after a good drive. I can touch the intake and charge tubes without discomfort. I have the tien hood dampers which slightly raise the hood a bit and gives it a ghetto cowl induction.
That's impressive considering you are FI. I can see coolant temps above 200F if I drive even a little bit hard on the highway.
08-09-2010 | 03:10 PM
#35
Turbos blow!!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,584
Likes: 0
From: my engine bay
I plan on heat wrapping my intercooler piping that exits the turbo to see what effect that has. I heat coated my intake tube but it was before the relocation and tray removal so I don't know if it helped. When I upgrade the turbo I will install the bhr radiator.
08-09-2010 | 05:15 PM
#36
I divide by zero
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,192
Likes: 0
From: Spring Hill, FL
I think Police34 and I have to credit some cooling advantage to the Florida humidity. I have to thrash it hard and sit at a light for a couple minutes to see 200, but as soon as I move its gone. Stock cooling system, stock(non ms) bumper.
Last edited by Mawnee; 08-09-2010 at 05:21 PM.
08-09-2010 | 05:26 PM
#37
This amazes me with the heat and humidity I see here in South Texas. I lived in Sarasota for years and the temps are comparable. I can hit 200F easily with just a redline or two. Any hard driving of more than a couple of minutes will get my coolant temps to the low 200's.
08-09-2010 | 05:35 PM
#38
Turbos blow!!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,584
Likes: 0
From: my engine bay
The humidity does help quite a bit. I rarely see intercooler sprayers here because of hot wet the air is here. When it got into the 40s during our winter I did a wot and saw my intake temp the same as ambient. Only could do it once but it was pretty cool to say the least. When I visited ray in AZ it wasn't bad heat just 0 humidity.
08-10-2010 | 12:20 PM
#39
Thread Starter
Registered
iTrader: (3)
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 10,828
Likes: 38
From: macon, georgia
Ok cooling discussion/hints.
1- make sure all foam is around the radiator and that it is sealed well. You can also tape up the undertray ports if you want
2- ensure your coolant is good. a lot of people are running a 70/30 blend of water to coolant with 1 bottle of water wetter, or my favorite ---DEI Charge cooler. THE DEI will NOT foam. The redline stuff WILL.
3- upgrade water pump--Mazmart has the one. The oem will cavitate above 6K? Best info I have. Cavitation will get air into the system and hotspots will be hotter and overall temps will increase.
4- upgrade thermostat--again Mazmart. Their thermostat is fully open at 180F whereas oem is 212F.
5- get fans to ativate at 180F. You can do this in varying ways. From using the Cobb, racing Beat Flash, installing override switch etc.
6- upgrade radiator--- the oem rad is pretty doggone good. DO NOT USE THE KRYSHO (sic). If you do a rad upgrade-do whatever you can to get more air through it. Radiator upgrades are a little expensive and require a little work getting to the dang thing. But, it is very doable.
Personnally I have not seen a upgraded radiator reduce temps. I HAVE seen how quick they recover once you slow down, or remove the load, or speed up if you are stuck in traffic. Twice as fast, i would say!
7- Secondary radiator --- this works. This works mainly because you can place the radiator into a strong airflow position. The downside is that it can work too good. During the winter months most have to unplug it. Usually just a five minute job of reconnecting the two hoses.
8- you can redirect airflow so that the flow to the radiator is increased. The shape of the grill/air intake area cause a swirl affect in the top 1/3 of that area. This is usually only present during high speed running--like track. Various foils and things have been used in an attempt to straighten that flow. It has not been a popular thing to do and the affects of such have not been shared--that I am aware off. This swirl affect can be reduced by modifing the oem grill (drilling some of the diamond shaped areas)
9- remove blockage from the rear of the radiator.--- relocate the battery tray, the air box etc.
Some say this helps them. This should increase the engine bay temps as the hot air will now be channeled toward the engine bay and not under the car as before. Still a fair number of people report good results.
10- the 09 cars have stronger fan motors that are interchangeable with the earily model. They do use the same blades. I dont know of anyone that have swapped those out.
If anyone has anthing else?
We could post the value of each cooling mod according to their individually known affectiveness?
OD
1- make sure all foam is around the radiator and that it is sealed well. You can also tape up the undertray ports if you want
2- ensure your coolant is good. a lot of people are running a 70/30 blend of water to coolant with 1 bottle of water wetter, or my favorite ---DEI Charge cooler. THE DEI will NOT foam. The redline stuff WILL.
3- upgrade water pump--Mazmart has the one. The oem will cavitate above 6K? Best info I have. Cavitation will get air into the system and hotspots will be hotter and overall temps will increase.
4- upgrade thermostat--again Mazmart. Their thermostat is fully open at 180F whereas oem is 212F.
5- get fans to ativate at 180F. You can do this in varying ways. From using the Cobb, racing Beat Flash, installing override switch etc.
6- upgrade radiator--- the oem rad is pretty doggone good. DO NOT USE THE KRYSHO (sic). If you do a rad upgrade-do whatever you can to get more air through it. Radiator upgrades are a little expensive and require a little work getting to the dang thing. But, it is very doable.
Personnally I have not seen a upgraded radiator reduce temps. I HAVE seen how quick they recover once you slow down, or remove the load, or speed up if you are stuck in traffic. Twice as fast, i would say!
7- Secondary radiator --- this works. This works mainly because you can place the radiator into a strong airflow position. The downside is that it can work too good. During the winter months most have to unplug it. Usually just a five minute job of reconnecting the two hoses.
8- you can redirect airflow so that the flow to the radiator is increased. The shape of the grill/air intake area cause a swirl affect in the top 1/3 of that area. This is usually only present during high speed running--like track. Various foils and things have been used in an attempt to straighten that flow. It has not been a popular thing to do and the affects of such have not been shared--that I am aware off. This swirl affect can be reduced by modifing the oem grill (drilling some of the diamond shaped areas)
9- remove blockage from the rear of the radiator.--- relocate the battery tray, the air box etc.
Some say this helps them. This should increase the engine bay temps as the hot air will now be channeled toward the engine bay and not under the car as before. Still a fair number of people report good results.
10- the 09 cars have stronger fan motors that are interchangeable with the earily model. They do use the same blades. I dont know of anyone that have swapped those out.
If anyone has anthing else?
We could post the value of each cooling mod according to their individually known affectiveness?
OD
Last edited by olddragger; 08-10-2010 at 12:26 PM.
08-10-2010 | 02:58 PM
#40
Turbos blow!!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,584
Likes: 0
From: my engine bay
I have pondered many times over about the use of a secondary radiator. After visiting Ray in AZ and hanging out with Jeff I really liked the way he had his set up. I may try it within the next month if I can find a good DIY.
OD- Have you drilled the front grill holes and found the swirl affect to be minimized or do you use an aftermarket bumper?
OD- Have you drilled the front grill holes and found the swirl affect to be minimized or do you use an aftermarket bumper?
08-10-2010 | 03:23 PM
#43
08-10-2010 | 04:06 PM
#44
7- Secondary radiator --- this works. This works mainly because you can place the radiator into a strong airflow position. The downside is that it can work too good. During the winter months most have to unplug it. Usually just a five minute job of reconnecting the two hoses.
OD
OD
08-10-2010 | 04:09 PM
#46
Turbos blow!!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,584
Likes: 0
From: my engine bay
08-10-2010 | 06:27 PM
#48
How are people putting in the secondary radiator, plumbing wise?
My track temps have been fine when NA but we will see now that I have added the supercharger.
I would consider going to a single more effecient oil cooler on the left side and putting a secondary radiator in place of the right side oil cooler.
My track temps have been fine when NA but we will see now that I have added the supercharger.
I would consider going to a single more effecient oil cooler on the left side and putting a secondary radiator in place of the right side oil cooler.
08-10-2010 | 06:48 PM
#49
The secondary will plumb into the heater hose. You can get one with a fan or without. I chose a model without a fan that will go where my factory oil coolers was on the passenger side. I may add one with a fan later but we will see. This is the unit I am going with:
