Tigger

iTrader: (3)

Hello,

I realize that there has been considerable discussion of the "L" flash and that the engine needs to be run in certain rpm ranges for a set amount of time for the computer to "learn".

I think I have read most of the various threads on this topic and the impression I get is that you need to drive for 30 seconds continuously at a constant RPM, at several different RPM ranges, stepping about 1500 RPM for each new 30 second run to cover the whole rpm range. After completing this, the new flash should have completed its base learning.

Having read the latest TSB, “Engine Cranks/No Start”:

http://www.finishlineperformance.com.../01-011-04.htm

It would appear that you only need to run the engine for 15 seconds? and that the initial learning should be done without any load, i.e. in neutral, not driven.

Does anyone fully understand/can recommend the best practice for relearning/training after the PCM is re-flashed? (Mine was done last Wednesday).

Is there a way to reset the PCM and re-perform the learning stage?

How much does the computer adaptively change after the initial learning stage, is it a problem if the car was not initially trained under the ideal learning conditions?

I know that you can reset the Eccentric shaft plate profile, by performing the 20 break taps in 8 seconds, as per the “Clearing the Eccentric Shaft Plate Profile Memory From PCM – Service Tip” TSB:

http://www.finishlineperformance.com...ocs/01-007.htm

Will this clear the PCM of all of it’s other learned characteristics?

In addition to this, I believe I read that the Canzoomers mod requires 15 minutes to learn. Is this correct? Is it important to let the stock ECU do it’s learning initially before connecting/activating the Canzoomer mod?

I realize some or all of this may have been covered elsewhere, I’m still searching and reading, there is a lot of great stuff here, but much has now been buried in amongst 20 something pages of a thread and I have not made it through all of the big threads yet; even with the help of the search function. Still I thought it worth asking as I have read different ideas on the matter and the latest TSB didn’t seem to match any of them (though perhaps it is only designed for a basic quick shop test, and not a complete training exercise).

Thanks,
Chris

islandsoon

Good Question Tigger...

I too wonder just what is needed to get back to full power. A disconnect of the battery is suppose to reset the computer. But just what is needed after that? I have a 2003 RV with this type of 'learning function. I dislike the thing. It causes the Allison to soften shifts after a long period of cruise, just about the time I am asking for a rapid shift to pass someone.

RX-8 friend

Maurice was telling me how you can now reset what the PCM has learned ("L" flash). As I recall, if you hold in the mileage reset button and then turn on the key (not start the car), then it will reset the learned data.

I don't think you have to perform any specific learn routine. At least I haven't read or heard anything about that. Also, it should "unlearn" bad habits when you give it more "experience" (driving more) thereby teaching it better habits.

IKnowNot'ing

I worked at Ford before and apparently Mazda being partly Ford-owned they seem to use the same format of ECU. Back then, with EEC-V, that's how it worked :

Characteristics of production parts, sensors and actuators do vary. Also, during the complete life span of your car, the intake leakage tends to increase and some components such as actuators (ABV, injectors) tends to wear. Their characteristics change. In the ECU's strategy, there is a module that cope with compensing for these changes. It was indeed called the 'learning'.

In close loop operations, the ECU is able to verify that the value in the fuel or other calibration tables are consistant with measurements. Indeed, if the fuel table says it needs, for a certain value of measured air flow and RPM, a given quantity of fuel in stoich close loop operation, the ECU can verify the accuracy of its air flow measurment and adjust it as necessary.

In open loop operations, it refers to close loop operating points having about the same airflow.

It usually does not learn at high load, low RPM as back flow usually completely screws up the MAFS reading. Although now bi-diectional systems do exist that can detect and substract back flow from the total air mass flow measurement.

The constant running at different RPM and loads are indeed a good way to learn. Before learnin, your car might suffer from rough idle or hesitations. It will go away.

If someone wants more details, I can scan and e-mail the part of the Ford EEC-V strategy manual referring to this module.

Hope it helps.

red_rx8_red_int

RX-8 friend,

What do you think of step 12 of the engine cranks no start TSBlink here

Could this be some type of training? Or does it appear to be some type of diagnostic tool?

Omicron

I find this very interesting, and potentially very useful. David, can you confirm that this is the procedure, or ask Maurice to jump in here and explain it? Thanks...

Tigger

iTrader: (3)

Thank you all, especially RX-8 friend and IKnowNot'ing.

As Omicron suggested, confirmation on this procedure and any additional information on how our car learns and actively adapts it's learning would be great! Perhaps Maurice has some additional pointers after all his time and experience

RX-8 friend

Section 12 of the TSB is to make sure they fixed the problem, I think. The car should have no problem learning without help, because you never know when a computer will flush its' memory, and without a tech. sitting beside you, how could the owner know how to make it relearn?

I'll ask Maurice tomorrow when I see him and post his response on the reset. I didn't pay too much attention when he told me two weeks ago because I don't have an RX-8 (yet). I just absorb the basic info., not the details .

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Hold the odometer reset button in and turn the key to "on", but don't start the car.
Continue to hold the button until the trip odometer reads "test".
At this point, you can step through a whole series of diagnostic modes (by pressing the odometer button) that are pretty useless unless you have the WDS, but it is still amusing.
Anyway, turn the key "off" and then repeat the above.
Turn it "off" again.

You have now completely reset the PCM. Pretty cool, huh?

mikeb

If I reset the pcm is that beneficial to the car at all?

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Beneficial? Well, not particularly.
However, it may make it run more smoothly.
I have found that my E-Manage fuel maps are more effective if I reset the PCM when I turn the unit on.

Tamas

iTrader: (1)

Pardon my ignorance... but what exactly is "the WDS"?
I hate acronyms... :p

islandsoon

http://www.finishlineperformance.com.../01-011-04.htm

The system Mazda uses to interface with your car.

Omicron

Exactly my question.

Speed Racer

Worldwide Diagnostic Systems (aka WDS)