New mod that will help EVERY RX-8 with flooding!
10-18-2010 | 01:16 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 161
Likes: 0
New mod that will help EVERY RX-8 with flooding!
So we all know we battle flooding problems in the 8 when we shut it off too soon (oil temps not getting high enough usually). I am currently making a mod for our cars that would prevent us from shutting off the car until the oil temp reached a certain limit. (kind of like how you can't lock your cars from the outside if the key is still in the ignition). This would prevent cold shut downs that would in turn prevent flooding that leads to bad CAT's etc.
What do you think? Well regardless of what you think, i'm making this for my 8, but I will post a DIY up on here if anybody wants to use it.
What do you think? Well regardless of what you think, i'm making this for my 8, but I will post a DIY up on here if anybody wants to use it.
Last edited by jdenman03; 10-20-2010 at 11:10 PM.
10-18-2010 | 01:43 PM
#3
I don't want to rain on your parade because in theory it sounds logical but flooding isn't really an issue anymore.
In 2005 Mazda made some improvements to address the then very problematic issue.
New spark plugs
Better battery
Better starter
Take all of that plus enhancements made through the aftermarket brands who have further improved on our ignition systems and flooding has been virtually reduced to a thing of the past.
In 5+ years of owning my car it has never flooded, even when I TRIED to flood it.
In 2005 Mazda made some improvements to address the then very problematic issue.
New spark plugs
Better battery
Better starter
Take all of that plus enhancements made through the aftermarket brands who have further improved on our ignition systems and flooding has been virtually reduced to a thing of the past.
In 5+ years of owning my car it has never flooded, even when I TRIED to flood it.
10-20-2010 | 12:11 PM
#8
I crank up and shutdown my 05 all the time for over 5 years and have never flooded.
IMO the only way to flood now is to have a bad engine in a cold climate, maybe also if you have an 04 with an early PCM flash that never got updated.
IMO the only way to flood now is to have a bad engine in a cold climate, maybe also if you have an 04 with an early PCM flash that never got updated.
10-20-2010 | 02:18 PM
#9
Administrator
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 21,958
Likes: 115
From: portland oregon
except in this case it prevents floods by never letting you start the car
brilliant ! if you never start the car it will never flood
10-20-2010 | 03:57 PM
#10
10-20-2010 | 04:41 PM
#11
10-20-2010 | 11:10 PM
#13
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 161
Likes: 0
10-21-2010 | 01:50 PM
#16
Administrator
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 21,958
Likes: 115
From: portland oregon
10-21-2010 | 02:06 PM
#17
10-21-2010 | 02:13 PM
#18
Mu ha.. ha...
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,361
Likes: 3
From: Cali
Oil tempertures causing flooding = fail
10-21-2010 | 03:25 PM
#19
Lubricious
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,425
Likes: 4
From: SF Bay Area, California
Regardless of whether or not he understands the causality (not clear from the post), his proposed modification would still work to prevent cold shut-down, and therefore flooding. So it is not a fail in that sense.
The problem comes in adding a device that prevents engine shutdown. Not much use for the car's owner who already knows about letting it warm up. That leaves the occasional driver, valet, etc... While it could prevent flooding in those situations, having the engine refuse to turn off with the key could be problematic and cause all kinds of unintended consequences.
The problem comes in adding a device that prevents engine shutdown. Not much use for the car's owner who already knows about letting it warm up. That leaves the occasional driver, valet, etc... While it could prevent flooding in those situations, having the engine refuse to turn off with the key could be problematic and cause all kinds of unintended consequences.
10-21-2010 | 05:12 PM
#20
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 161
Likes: 0
Regardless of whether or not he understands the causality (not clear from the post), his proposed modification would still work to prevent cold shut-down, and therefore flooding. So it is not a fail in that sense.
The problem comes in adding a device that prevents engine shutdown. Not much use for the car's owner who already knows about letting it warm up. That leaves the occasional driver, valet, etc... While it could prevent flooding in those situations, having the engine refuse to turn off with the key could be problematic and cause all kinds of unintended consequences.
The problem comes in adding a device that prevents engine shutdown. Not much use for the car's owner who already knows about letting it warm up. That leaves the occasional driver, valet, etc... While it could prevent flooding in those situations, having the engine refuse to turn off with the key could be problematic and cause all kinds of unintended consequences.
10-21-2010 | 05:57 PM
#21
Surf Hard, Drive Hard
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,840
Likes: 12
From: Indialantic, Florida
10-21-2010 | 06:10 PM
#22
A) Disregarding deliberately tuning it wrong, you can't increase fuel injection upon starting the engine. However, the ECU can, and does, richening up the mixture until the engine is warm, at which time it leans back.
B) Ignition weakens all the time. Battery, starter, coils, wires, plugs. All it takes is one of them to fail just far enough. And none of ours are particularly good at staying healthy without attention from the owner.
From my thread (so I don't keep retyping stuff)
Flooding:
Flooding is only a concern if you have a weak ignition system. The problem is, your ignition system usually fails very slowly, so it is a gradual decline. The alert and responsible owner will detect the drop in mileage, the drop in power, the rougher idle, the occasional misfire, and replace their coils, plugs, and wires before it gets bad enough where there is a chance at flooding.
Every single flood I have seen reported for quite a while ended up coming down to one of these failing: Battery, Starter, Coil(s), Plug Wire(s), Plug(s). But by then, they also generally have a fried cat that needs to get replaced as well, and possibly an O2 sensor or two. Stay on top of the maintenance (long term included!) and you will wonder what all the fuss was about. Coils ($160 for all 4, 20 minute swap), plugs ($80 for all 4, 10 minute swap), and wires ($60, 2 minute swap), should be replaced every 30,000 miles, possibly sooner if you detect something starting to fail, since people have had them fail as early as 8,000 miles or 15,000 miles, though that's rare.
You don't want to shut off while it's cold simply because when the engine is cold, the ECU dumps more fuel into engine to help it warm up, and it leans back once the engine is warm. This extra fuel can make it harder to start an ignition, which a healthy ignition system is perfectly capable of overcoming. Weaken the ignition with failing plugs, coils, wires, alternator, or battery, and you have a flood on your hands, and all the associated problems from that.
Flooding is only a concern if you have a weak ignition system. The problem is, your ignition system usually fails very slowly, so it is a gradual decline. The alert and responsible owner will detect the drop in mileage, the drop in power, the rougher idle, the occasional misfire, and replace their coils, plugs, and wires before it gets bad enough where there is a chance at flooding.
Every single flood I have seen reported for quite a while ended up coming down to one of these failing: Battery, Starter, Coil(s), Plug Wire(s), Plug(s). But by then, they also generally have a fried cat that needs to get replaced as well, and possibly an O2 sensor or two. Stay on top of the maintenance (long term included!) and you will wonder what all the fuss was about. Coils ($160 for all 4, 20 minute swap), plugs ($80 for all 4, 10 minute swap), and wires ($60, 2 minute swap), should be replaced every 30,000 miles, possibly sooner if you detect something starting to fail, since people have had them fail as early as 8,000 miles or 15,000 miles, though that's rare.
You don't want to shut off while it's cold simply because when the engine is cold, the ECU dumps more fuel into engine to help it warm up, and it leans back once the engine is warm. This extra fuel can make it harder to start an ignition, which a healthy ignition system is perfectly capable of overcoming. Weaken the ignition with failing plugs, coils, wires, alternator, or battery, and you have a flood on your hands, and all the associated problems from that.
So the "New mod that will help EVERY RX-8 with flooding!" is actually an old one... just keep your ignition healthy.
10-22-2010 | 08:14 AM
#25
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 161
Likes: 0
You don't want to shut off while it's cold simply because when the engine is cold, the ECU dumps more fuel into engine to help it warm up, and it leans back once the engine is warm. This extra fuel can make it harder to start an ignition, which a healthy ignition system is perfectly capable of overcoming. Weaken the ignition with failing plugs, coils, wires, alternator, or battery, and you have a flood on your hands, and all the associated problems from that.