Gauge problem
06-18-2011, 07:02 AM
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Never answered my question about the fuse where the red power wire is in your pic.
And..............this same red wire(in the pic) is used to feed all the power for all the gauges right? I know the illumination is tied elsewhere.
And just for the sake or argument. The red wire in the pic below is not the same wire as above correct? You know that you used a red wire here for a ground.......right?
You'd see some major issues if this was wrong......meaning it wasn't really a ground wire but you had tied it to ground, but I have to ask the silly question.
And..............this same red wire(in the pic) is used to feed all the power for all the gauges right? I know the illumination is tied elsewhere.
And just for the sake or argument. The red wire in the pic below is not the same wire as above correct? You know that you used a red wire here for a ground.......right?
You'd see some major issues if this was wrong......meaning it wasn't really a ground wire but you had tied it to ground, but I have to ask the silly question.
Last edited by Mazurfer; 06-18-2011 at 03:59 PM.
06-18-2011, 01:32 PM
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Correct grounds, one for each sensor and one for each gauge. I dont believe I had to take a fuse out. I believe it was already unoccupied. And yes that power wire is used for all the gauges and illumination is else where. And no the red ground wire is not the power wire. I will check into placing a fuse in there and seeing if it makes a difference though. thanks
06-18-2011, 03:17 PM
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Nevermind about the fuse in that position, and I apologize for the wild goose chase!
I looked at both the service manual and my 05 owners manual, and they both state that there is a fuse in that position for what is labeled "P.WIND", which I thought was power windows.
I also see that there is also a "power window" fuse in the cabin box(where I would expect it), so I ran downstairs and check my engine bay box and I have no fuse there either.................so I don't know what "P.Wind" at one time was supposed to be.
Both the factory service manual and owners manuals must be wrong in that regard!
So....we are almost back to square one.
Now, what made you choose that location and did you actually measure the voltage there before deciding to put the power wire there?
I guess at this point, I would suggest taking that power wire out from where it is.......................then just carefully and temporarily move it over to one of those two bolts/nuts on the upper right side of this picture. Either jumper it over with jumper clips, or attach it there short term.
These bolts/nuts are on either side of the 120A main fuse, so they have 12v on them all the time and come directly from the battery. You can use one of these..................just for test purposes, or run it over to the battery itself. You wouldn't want it either place all the time, but it will help eliminate a lot of things by testing it here.
When you do this, of course the gauges and sensders will have power all the time, but then go start the car and see if everything is normal, including flashers etc.
If the manuals are wrong about that fuse position(and apparently they are).......then who the hell knows what is really on that side of the fuse terminal you are using and where it comes from! You could be loading down something with all the gauges and causing the issues seen.
I looked at both the service manual and my 05 owners manual, and they both state that there is a fuse in that position for what is labeled "P.WIND", which I thought was power windows.
I also see that there is also a "power window" fuse in the cabin box(where I would expect it), so I ran downstairs and check my engine bay box and I have no fuse there either.................so I don't know what "P.Wind" at one time was supposed to be.
Both the factory service manual and owners manuals must be wrong in that regard!
So....we are almost back to square one.
Now, what made you choose that location and did you actually measure the voltage there before deciding to put the power wire there?
I guess at this point, I would suggest taking that power wire out from where it is.......................then just carefully and temporarily move it over to one of those two bolts/nuts on the upper right side of this picture. Either jumper it over with jumper clips, or attach it there short term.
These bolts/nuts are on either side of the 120A main fuse, so they have 12v on them all the time and come directly from the battery. You can use one of these..................just for test purposes, or run it over to the battery itself. You wouldn't want it either place all the time, but it will help eliminate a lot of things by testing it here.
When you do this, of course the gauges and sensders will have power all the time, but then go start the car and see if everything is normal, including flashers etc.
If the manuals are wrong about that fuse position(and apparently they are).......then who the hell knows what is really on that side of the fuse terminal you are using and where it comes from! You could be loading down something with all the gauges and causing the issues seen.
Last edited by Mazurfer; 06-18-2011 at 05:59 PM.
06-18-2011, 05:01 PM
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alright, well heres a video of me trying it. My car happened to have a hard time sarting now also. which makes me think maybe my battery is going. So im going to check into that. maybe ignition? thanks
http://s1137.photobucket.com/albums/...t=IMG_0639.mp4
http://s1137.photobucket.com/albums/...t=IMG_0639.mp4
06-19-2011, 06:37 AM
#30
Did you test out the alternator. I am getting a high pitched whine and some bumps and drops at idle that are new to me, after logging I noticed my voltage drops to 12's every time the idle bumps.... so alternator is definitely on it's way out.
06-19-2011, 06:58 AM
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This would be a good idea as this had crossed my mind last night.
Have to consider it as a possibility especially with all the electronics he has running in this car and the strange behavior at this point.
Have to consider it as a possibility especially with all the electronics he has running in this car and the strange behavior at this point.
06-19-2011, 07:11 PM
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Checked the battery, seemed to be fine. According to my volt meter the alternator seemed fine. Kicked in as it should. Like i said maybe there is a better way to check that through accessport? Will defiantly be willing to do so, if so. I'm thinking it might be better off at this point to leave everything in place and just desconnect it all and tape it off. and start from there? Any better ideas? maybe to drastic but I really need to figure this out.
06-20-2011, 07:10 AM
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I will tell you what I would do, and you may not like it.
I would disconnect all gauges and sensors, both the power, grounds, and illumination wires. Disconnect it all.
I would then start and drive the car(maybe even a day or two) and make sure all is back to normal.
If normal, then I would proceed to add one gauge/sendor at a time and verify each one before adding another. I know this might be a pain based on how you may have tied them, but it's the only way to really do it.............step by step.
Answer these questions unless you can make us a drawing.
Now, having said that.............I assume you have all the gauge powers tied together right?
Anything else but the gauges connected on that single red power line you are using to power the gauges?
How about the gauge illumination wires......how are they tied together? I know these go to a seperate place than the above(and these go to the cig lighter right?), but how are they tied.
Now................tell us about the grounds and how they are all tied. Which ones tie together and were do they go?
I know we are re-hashing some old data here, but we need to have a clear picture of what you have going on. Especially since it appears to have other aftermerket things going on.
This is an example and shows my present gauge setup. Even if you hand scrbble yours and scan it in, it would help us to see what you have.
It's a little strange, but it's almost like you have a weird ground loop going on or something, not really sure, so that's why I asked for a drawing.....no matter how it may look. Just try to be sure it's accurate to what you have and what ties where.
I do not expect your drawing to look like mine or be tied the same way, but need to know if you want help......the video's aren't really helping at all. Meanwhile, I will go back and re-read the entire thread.
Oh..................what was alternator putting out when you checked it with meter?
Regardless, this number will be unloaded(per say), but still good to know what it read.
I would disconnect all gauges and sensors, both the power, grounds, and illumination wires. Disconnect it all.
I would then start and drive the car(maybe even a day or two) and make sure all is back to normal.
If normal, then I would proceed to add one gauge/sendor at a time and verify each one before adding another. I know this might be a pain based on how you may have tied them, but it's the only way to really do it.............step by step.
Answer these questions unless you can make us a drawing.
Now, having said that.............I assume you have all the gauge powers tied together right?
Anything else but the gauges connected on that single red power line you are using to power the gauges?
How about the gauge illumination wires......how are they tied together? I know these go to a seperate place than the above(and these go to the cig lighter right?), but how are they tied.
Now................tell us about the grounds and how they are all tied. Which ones tie together and were do they go?
I know we are re-hashing some old data here, but we need to have a clear picture of what you have going on. Especially since it appears to have other aftermerket things going on.
This is an example and shows my present gauge setup. Even if you hand scrbble yours and scan it in, it would help us to see what you have.
It's a little strange, but it's almost like you have a weird ground loop going on or something, not really sure, so that's why I asked for a drawing.....no matter how it may look. Just try to be sure it's accurate to what you have and what ties where.
I do not expect your drawing to look like mine or be tied the same way, but need to know if you want help......the video's aren't really helping at all. Meanwhile, I will go back and re-read the entire thread.
Oh..................what was alternator putting out when you checked it with meter?
Regardless, this number will be unloaded(per say), but still good to know what it read.
Last edited by Mazurfer; 06-20-2011 at 07:39 AM.
06-20-2011, 02:33 PM
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alright, well heres how everything is wired. I will also take pictures. I will go ahead and disconnect everything and tape it off in place, today. But power: I have the power running from the fuse box through the firewall into the car. there i have 4 gauges constants hooked up and BC( water temp, boost, fuel pressure, oil press). Also 3 illumination wires (white) (water,fuel,Oil) all too the power. these are all together using a wire nut(all with the power from the fuse box). the Grounds: each senor is running to the ground under the hood (3) (oil,water,fuel) then one extra wire running into the car through the firewall to ground (oil, Fuel, Water and BC) all together with another wire nut. Then each sensor has a sender wire running into the car and crimped together with it's matching green wire using a "beenie". Last the (3) red illumination wires (oil, Fuel,water) is running to cig light (red/yellow) wire. All together with a crimped "beenie" also. The boost gauge is manual. thanks
06-20-2011, 02:47 PM
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Okay, I'm trying to visualize and I don't see anything majorily wrong.
Speaking of the grounding scheme though.
So I know you have 3 sensor grounds tied inside the engine bay in that location in your pic.
Then you have stated you have a wire running through the firewall(and I assume that is the red one on that ground point...right?).
Just for clarification, I want others that may read this to know that this red wire is NOT a power and that we both know it.
Now.............in the cabin, you have all grounds(oil, fuel, water, and BC) connected to that red wire(again.......ground only in this case).
Here's my question.........in the cabin, these gauge grounds and that red wire....are they tied to the chassis anywhere inside the cabin, or do they count on running the through the red wire back to the engine bay for the chassis tie(ground) point? That question make sense?
Speaking of the grounding scheme though.
So I know you have 3 sensor grounds tied inside the engine bay in that location in your pic.
Then you have stated you have a wire running through the firewall(and I assume that is the red one on that ground point...right?).
Just for clarification, I want others that may read this to know that this red wire is NOT a power and that we both know it.
Now.............in the cabin, you have all grounds(oil, fuel, water, and BC) connected to that red wire(again.......ground only in this case).
Here's my question.........in the cabin, these gauge grounds and that red wire....are they tied to the chassis anywhere inside the cabin, or do they count on running the through the red wire back to the engine bay for the chassis tie(ground) point? That question make sense?
Last edited by Mazurfer; 06-20-2011 at 02:52 PM.
06-20-2011, 04:49 PM
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Yes you are correct, the red wire is the ground running through the firewall and into the cabin for a ground for (oil,fuel,water,and BC) and yes they are expected to ground all the way back under the hood in that grounding spot.. Is this too far? They are not grounded anywhere else. thanks
06-20-2011, 06:32 PM
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alright, all the wires are disconnected and tapped off with electrical tape. (BC, Gauges). no illumination, sensor, ground or power connected. I took 2 videos of the first start after doing this. Nothing changed. The video is trying to show all the effects and such. I did disconnect the battery and reconnect it after.
http://s1137.photobucket.com/albums/...t=IMG_0646.mp4
http://s1137.photobucket.com/albums/...t=IMG_0646.mp4
06-21-2011, 08:02 PM
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So......problem lies elsewhere.
That's actually kind of good to know.
Videos aren't helping at least me in this case, so now that gauges are disconnected 100%, describe what is and isn't working. I see lots of stuff I could question, but tell me what the car is/isn't doing now when you start it and afterward. What works and what doesn't.
And what the hell is that clicking noise?
That's actually kind of good to know.
Videos aren't helping at least me in this case, so now that gauges are disconnected 100%, describe what is and isn't working. I see lots of stuff I could question, but tell me what the car is/isn't doing now when you start it and afterward. What works and what doesn't.
And what the hell is that clicking noise?
06-21-2011, 08:47 PM
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the noise is what i was talking about. It's coming from here
http://i973.photobucket.com/albums/a...1/IMG_0601.jpg
this right above the truck opener. It has something to do with the blinkers. Guessing a rely? probably one of the problems. So the problems are blinkers are not working at all. when car is on with no lights i get the noise.. once i turn lights on either fog or headlights it stops. Now on another subject my air condition controls do not work. (the electronical ones) A/C button and that whole circle. the lights for them aren't working either.
http://i973.photobucket.com/albums/a...1/IMG_0601.jpg
this right above the truck opener. It has something to do with the blinkers. Guessing a rely? probably one of the problems. So the problems are blinkers are not working at all. when car is on with no lights i get the noise.. once i turn lights on either fog or headlights it stops. Now on another subject my air condition controls do not work. (the electronical ones) A/C button and that whole circle. the lights for them aren't working either.
06-22-2011, 08:30 PM
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Hmm... too much going on here, perhaps get an auto electrician to look at it? Since when/what mod you have added and this problem started to occur? I would recommend to go back to square 1 by de-modding everything or at least disconnect everything including the stereo etc just for the sake of trouble shooting, this way at least you'll find out whether it's the car or your added accessory is causing this.
06-22-2011, 11:38 PM
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I added the gauges, when i got this problem. It slowly got worse. Now i am back to square one. Have everything back to how "it was" before. No gauges connected in any way. and am still having the same problem. Its been about 2 days now too, and still nothing.
06-23-2011, 10:24 AM
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Yeah, I'll write more later, but I think you have at least a relay issue. I have to read and reserach more before giving you something specific to look at.
Keep it at square one for now......if at all possible.
Keep it at square one for now......if at all possible.
06-23-2011, 07:55 PM
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I'll get back with you tomorrow, I promise.
Can't do it tonight, but I want to re-read what your exact issues are without the new gauges wired any where at all.
So let's be clear....take each question below and answer them, it will help me, help you. Take'em by the numbers if you like....would make it easier.
1.) You have no car starting or running issues and drives fine right?
2.) Blinkers are not working at all. When the car is on(with no lights) you get that chatter noise and it comes from that location you showed in the pic....under the dash on the left side correct?
3.) Once you turn the lights on(either fog or headlights) it stops chattering..............right? But do your blinkers work at this time?
4.) Your air condition controls do not work...right?
5.) Did the a/c buttons work before any of this latest re-wiring?
I'm not going to ask about any other electronics you've added(and I can see you have) but you have stated that everything was okay before this last round of wiring..................right?
Right now, I'm tempted to say that at least you flasher control module is malfunctioning, and I believe that is the black thing in this pic.
You've made sure that all the connection here are okay right and that all pins in all the connectors are okay as well?
By the way, why do you have this unplugged?
Can't do it tonight, but I want to re-read what your exact issues are without the new gauges wired any where at all.
So let's be clear....take each question below and answer them, it will help me, help you. Take'em by the numbers if you like....would make it easier.
1.) You have no car starting or running issues and drives fine right?
2.) Blinkers are not working at all. When the car is on(with no lights) you get that chatter noise and it comes from that location you showed in the pic....under the dash on the left side correct?
3.) Once you turn the lights on(either fog or headlights) it stops chattering..............right? But do your blinkers work at this time?
4.) Your air condition controls do not work...right?
5.) Did the a/c buttons work before any of this latest re-wiring?
I'm not going to ask about any other electronics you've added(and I can see you have) but you have stated that everything was okay before this last round of wiring..................right?
Right now, I'm tempted to say that at least you flasher control module is malfunctioning, and I believe that is the black thing in this pic.
You've made sure that all the connection here are okay right and that all pins in all the connectors are okay as well?
By the way, why do you have this unplugged?
Last edited by Mazurfer; 06-23-2011 at 08:34 PM.
06-24-2011, 12:13 AM
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1) Car starting is a little slow. seems to take a little longer now but thats it. nothing else besides that when car is not running or just starting.
2) yes correct.
3)correct, but blinkers do not work at all.
4) correct but only the electrical ones. meaning the whole circular thing that turn a/c on or off, or defrost soo forth. the manual ones work ( the *****)
5)yes everything worked as should. all these problems just showed up (since gauges)
The other electronics are head unit and Boost controller. And as i and you stated, there was no problems with these before hand.
thats what i was thinking about the "flasher module" (I'm guessing is the name for it). And thats why in the picture it is disconnected. To make sure the noise was coming from there. I disconnected it to see if it'd stop when so, and it did. I could also feel it and hear coming from there.
And i will double check the module but pretty sure all is connected well. thanks
2) yes correct.
3)correct, but blinkers do not work at all.
4) correct but only the electrical ones. meaning the whole circular thing that turn a/c on or off, or defrost soo forth. the manual ones work ( the *****)
5)yes everything worked as should. all these problems just showed up (since gauges)
The other electronics are head unit and Boost controller. And as i and you stated, there was no problems with these before hand.
thats what i was thinking about the "flasher module" (I'm guessing is the name for it). And thats why in the picture it is disconnected. To make sure the noise was coming from there. I disconnected it to see if it'd stop when so, and it did. I could also feel it and hear coming from there.
And i will double check the module but pretty sure all is connected well. thanks
06-24-2011, 07:50 AM
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^...alright, well I'm at work this morning, but I did read your responses.
Think you're flasher module is bad for sure. http://www.onlinemazdaparts.com/part...layCatalogid=0
The above is one place to get one, or check someone parting out a car or possibly a junk yard if you don't want to buy a new one.
Will respond to more later, but in terms of the A/C.............well, my guess is that the connectors on the back of the A/C unit came loose or something when you were in there wiring the gauges. You can look in your manual and check all related A/C fuses first for the hell of it, especially the A/C 7.5A.......but if it's okay, then my guess is still that you knocked a connector loose on the back of the A/C unit.
Think you're flasher module is bad for sure. http://www.onlinemazdaparts.com/part...layCatalogid=0
The above is one place to get one, or check someone parting out a car or possibly a junk yard if you don't want to buy a new one.
Will respond to more later, but in terms of the A/C.............well, my guess is that the connectors on the back of the A/C unit came loose or something when you were in there wiring the gauges. You can look in your manual and check all related A/C fuses first for the hell of it, especially the A/C 7.5A.......but if it's okay, then my guess is still that you knocked a connector loose on the back of the A/C unit.