velociti

iTrader: (1)

I'm something of an audiophile, at home at least, and am getting a little tired of the Bose system in my '05 GT. I'd like to upgrade the speaker drivers and amp with high quality stuff, while also not spending too much. Problem is, I have no idea what an install entails, and whether what I'm considering is worth the upgrade, so any advice is much appreciated.

I'm thinking of going the route of a simple two channel amp, like a Focal Solid 2, at 75w/channel, and a Dynaudio System 242 GT. I have zero desire for a more extensive upgrade including subs. I'm going for quality, not necessarily deafening volume or chassis-rattling bass. That said, a lot of my music is electronic, and I want a quality amp that can provide enough power to not distort at volume.

My questions: (1) are a pair of tweeters and a pair of 7" woofers enough to fill the car with loud, clear sound, or would it be best to spring for another 242 GT system for the rear as well? 95% of my driving is solo, so I could care less about how it sounds from the back seat. (2) is there another amp that offers the same or more power, cleanly, that would be better suited in such an application? (3) Should I consider going another route altogether?

Many thanks in advance!

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

As an audiophile, I shouldn't have to tell you the presence of a subwoofer doesn't automatically give you chassis-rattling bass or make you into a 16 year old kid waking up the neighbors. A subwoofer is an integral piece of a solid sound system. And in my opinion, even more so in the car audio realm. In home audio, an 8" subwoofer in a vented design is common place and can provide a ton of low-end to assist in rounding the music. Heck, many higher-end floorstanding tower systems simply use a pair of 6.5" speakers to perform this function. But in a vehicle we're limited in space and placement, and therefore, limited on application. There's no way you could have your 6.5" door speaker in a vented design (therefore sacrificing low frequency extension). The fact end result is simply you can't allow 6.5" speakers be our single workhorse. You can't expect them to deliver adequate bass while simultaneously producing a crystal clear mid-range (or even upper-mid range). High quality equipment with clean power will, without a doubt, help... but in the end you're throwing money at a losing battle. So at least reconsider your opinion on a subwoofer.

It sounds as though you've already done a little research in the car audio world. Dynaudio and Focal both produce very high end equipment. As for whether you should move to a front stage only setup (we just recently discussed this on here lol), it's really something you, and you alone, should decide. I've met people on both radical ends of the argument. So to each their own. Maybe purchase the Solid 4, run just fronts, and see what you think? If you want to add a rear pair, the extra power is there. If you're happy with it, bridge the 4 channels into 2 and goose the hell out of the fronts. :D

To add another branch to the tree.... you plan on installing all this high-end equipment... and using the factory headunit???

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

Take a look at the posted frequency response spec for the Dynaudio 242GT. And you and I both know frequency response specs are ALWAYS overstated in reference to real-world applications. I certainly wouldn't expect clean reproduction of anything below ~100-125Hz. This is the norm for car audio. It's even worse with cheap equipment.

velociti

iTrader: (1)

Certainly I have little to no knowledge about car audio, but with high(er) end home stereo equipment from reputable companies, frequency response is usually not overstated. This is backed up by magazines like Stereophile who review high-end speakers like Dynaudios and actually thoroughly test them as a further measure of their performance. You mention tower speakers with a pair of 6.5 inch woofers...I used to have a pair of Dynaudio floorstanding speakers with just that driver arrangement. They couldn't break 30hz, but they could certainly reach down to 35hz. Also, I would probably take issue with your saying that an 8" subwoofer, or a subwoofer of any kind is common place. For another time though.

Admittedly, I'd like to have Dynaudio's 3-way system in the car, or would even consider a Dynaudio sub if I had the money, but I don't. I am only considering this because that Focal amp is $300, and a used set of the Dynaudio 242s will run me $400. Do you think these components, connected to the stock head unit, is not worth the money? Surely changing an amp and adding component speakers will better the sound of the stock Bose system (though not in low frequency extension), even if the preamp is stock, yes? I suppose my question is, for $1000 out the door with installation, is it worth the trouble? Or would replacing the Bose drivers with something from Infinity or Alpine be an easier/cheaper alternative, even if the sound quality would not be up to the level of the Dynaudios?

Thanks for the help.

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

I was more referencing real-world performance applications (installed in car and playing full range music vs. test tones in a lab). A 6.5" speaker simply cannot produce the low-end tones cleanly. 35Hz in home audio is impressive for a 6.5", but surely in a ported cabinet? Regardless, this type of frequency extension for a 6.5" is just something not seen in car audio.

As for my 8" subwoofer comment, I'm simply saying they are not a rare item to see.

My honest opinion.... no. I simply don't think it will be worth the money. You would be removing the Bose 9" woofers, which Bose uses for a substantial amount of the system's low frequency reproduction. In it's place, a 6.5" speaker. Albeit a quality speaker driven by a quality amp, it's still going to lack low end punch. Will the mid range and high-end be improved? Sure. Without a doubt.

In addition, you're using platinum quality equipment powered by cheap source unit. What would Dynaudio think about this? I'm just saying, if you're going to spend the money, do those puppies some justice.

What do I think you should do? If you just want an improvement without having to rip everything out.... I'd say... replace the rear 6x9"s with a decent mainstream brand ($150/pair online) and replace the front Bose tweeters with a decent mainstream brand (~$75/pair online). Hold with that. See how you like it. If you want more, add in a small powered 8" subwoofer (~$225). Obviously this will give you additional low-end punch. However, this will allow you to remove these tones from the Bose speakers, thereby, allowing them to play the remaining frequencies more clearly. An improvement for sure, for 500 bucks.

velociti

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the advice. And yes, my old speakers were ported (Dynaudio Contour 1.8 Mk IIs).

I'll look into replacing some of the speakers. Would you recommend certain brands? Infinity, Alpine? Is it worth replacing the 9" Bose bass drivers with aftermarket 8" drivers? I appreciate the help.

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

The Bose 9" woofers are 1/2 ohm impedance. So replacing with aftermarket would yield the necessity of an aftermarket amp too. I'd just keep them until... and if... you're ready to rip the whole system out and go all aftermarket. Don't leave other weak links in the chain. I'd just hate to see you spend $1k and not be thrilled with the results.

Infinity and Alpine are both quality mid-range brands. Brands to avoid would be Sony, Boss, Jenson, Audiobahn, Crunch, Dual and most of Pioneer. (For speakers at least. A couple of those brands might make another product of midrange quality. They're speakers just suck.) There are many other knock-off brands to avoid. But those are a few you'll see at Best Buy and the like. Other than that, if you haven't heard of it and the deal seems a little too good to be true, avoid it. I'd also encourage you to sample some speakers locally. Even though the source unit/track will be different than you'll be using... you can still pick the junk out of the mix. Or at least listen to Alpine and Infinity's product. Couple other midrange brands to possibly look at would be Polk, Boston, JL audio or CDT Audio.

Coty Melancon

I apologize for jumping in on this thread. But firebirdude, you seem to know a lot about car audio. While I don't really know that much at all. Anyway, I was wanting a complete aftermarket audio upgrade. I was wanting to go with two 12" kicker L7's, a Kicker DX series amp. Either a 500 or 1000watt amp. I'm not sure what would be best? Could I get you advice on that please? Also, kicker ks693 6x9's for the rears, and some kicker ks25 tweeters. Basically kicker because I love there performance. Last but not least would be my HU which would be a Pioneer FH-P8000BT. I'm not sure the differences between 2 ohm and 4 ohm and would it blow my speakers? Thank you in advance!

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

Two 12" L7's is going to be a... disgusting amount of bass in the RX8. lol I'm not one to hate on big bass though. I rolled around with two 15" L7's and 3kWRMS in my previous car, just for fun.

If you want to go down that road, you're going to want the 1000.1 amp. The L7 is rated at 1000WRMS each. So please do them some justice and put at least 1000WRMS to the pair. If it gets to be too much money, step down to the L5's, or the newer L3's. Whichever sub you choose to use, you'll want the dual 2 ohm version and to wire them like this to the amp:

This will present the sub amp with the 2 ohm load needed for stable full power out.

You have the Bose system? You're going to replace the rear 6x9's, front tweeters and keep the front 9" woofers? If so, that will work fine. Just trying to get the facts straight. But I'm not sure those speakers are going to be able to keep up with a pair of high powered 12"s in the trunk. We'll see.

As for the headunit, the 2/4 ohm load will not matter. The Bose system utilizes an outboard amp for the speakers. Or if you're referring to your subwoofers, the headunit just supplies the low-level signal via RCA. Doesn't matter what the load is. So use whatever headunit you'd like. Also, the Pioneer AVH-P3300BT can be had for ~$330 shipped brand new or a touch less open box. DVD playback and a sweet display.

Coty Melancon

I don't have the Bose setup, I have the sport package 8. The front speakers in the door are 9" woofers? I was unaware of that. Thank you for clarifying the amp issue. I was wondering about that as well as the ohm issue. So the only other thing I have to add to this list is front 9" woofers right? Thanks again for everything, and also the wiring diagram!!

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

Your front speakers are NOT 9". I figured you had the Bose system because you're posting in a thread with someone who has the Bose system and you're following my same recommendations.

The non-Bose RX8's have 6x8's in the front (5x7's will also fit), a smaller tweeter than the Bose guys and 6x9's in the rear. All speakers are 4 ohm. Lucky for you 99.9% of aftermarket speakers are 4 ohm (subwoofers aside). Just swap whatever you want in. But, make sure you stick with 4 ohm. Your speakers ARE powered off the headunit. No headunit is rated to push loads lower than 4 ohms.

All and all, you don't have anything to worry about. Swap the headunit out with anything you wish. Swap any of the speakers out for anything you wish. Add whatever subs/amp you finally settle on.

Coty Melancon

Also, I love the setup in your trunk! Do you think it would be better to have that type of setup? Or just kicker's side by side. Because it looks like you still have a lot space left over with that setup.

Coty Melancon

Like I said, I don't know much about this. My apologizes. Thanks for clarifying all that. Also, I'm sure I will keep the current setup I was going for. Just gonna find a 6x8 kicker for the front.

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

Thanks. I actually really like my current setup. PLENTY of bass for my taste (this coming from someone who previously had two 15"s) and the Kicker 5-channel amp pumps out quite a bit of power for a 5-channel. It's rated at 420WRMS to the subs and ... 80?WRMS to each speaker, but actually puts out about 20% more power than that according to the birth sheet it came with.

You know, I'm ..... sadly..... thinking of selling my 8 soon. Figured the whole system needs to come out because I'll never get anything for it if it's sold with the car. I'll probably keep the amp for my next car, but the subs and boxes will be up for sale. So if you're interested in them, let me know. Fair warning, these fiberglass boxes are much more expensive than the MDF back wall enclosures you see on eBay.

Coty Melancon

I want her to rattle just perfect, but to have the extra bass is ALWAYS nice! I would LOVE to take those boxes from you. But they won't fit the L7's? Because there square? Or can they be modified?

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

Nope. Round subs only. They're also 10".

Coty Melancon

Do you know where I can find those type of boxes that can fit L7's? I really would buy them from you if they did. Its a damn shame...

firebirdude

iTrader: (3)

I got mine from 4080enclosures.com , but they stopped making them for some reason. Wickedcas.com makes something similar for the same price, but I've heard mixed reviews from users on here. As for the square subs, haven't seen anything like that. And they've always been 10"s.

It's obviously your decision, but I personally think two great 10"s properly powered will be plenty. I have ZERO issues rattling my trunk....and I've taken measures to stop that as much as possible. If you find yourself in central florida anytime soon, I'd be happy to demo it for you. :D

Coty Melancon

I will check both of them out. I'm sure they can build the boxes to fit the subs. For the right price of course. I would love to be near central Florida. Haha, unfortunately I'm overseas at the moment.