zoom44

thy're not? have you read this WHOLE thread?

shelleys_man_06

Nope :D. J/K.

Omicron

[sidetrack]

It's especially fun in normal conversations with non-engineering types. Watch their eyes cross. :D

In a related note, I have a BCD clock on my desk at work. It's pretty funny to see the engineers come into my office and say "Hey, nice BCD clock!" while the business folks come in and say "Hey, what's that blinky thing?" :D

We now return your to your normally scheduled Axial Flow programming.

[/sidetrack]

arr ex eight

so without reading the entire thread....whats the word on the supercharger? is it a go on the rx8 yet? or still "in progress"?

shelleys_man_06

No.

Hymee

iTrader: (1)

Bad boy.

Go back to the start and do not collect $200. Take note of one post talking about the construction of the city of rome. Hehehe.

Cheers,
Hymee.

Richard Paul

iTrader: (5)

Today I assembled a Rx style 4 stage blower. Sometime next week I can do some A/B testing. There are some people on the site who are helping with the theoretical flow of the Rx 8 engine and with this data we may get a good idea of what to expect.

Then there are all those theorys floating around about the different manor of reaction vs the standard piston engine. I cannot opine to this. We can only know when they are put together. Blower and engine that is.

Thank you, Richard

shelleys_man_06

Sorry to have hijacked your thread Richard. Do you think there would be a difference in pressurizing a rotary engine compared to a piston engine?

Richard Paul

iTrader: (5)

Well Shelly in my opinion NO. I treat them both as positive displacment receivers.
Yet that question seems to be flying around all the time. I do not have the practical experiance to answer.

I believe the one to ask is RotoryGod. How about it RG are you out there?

RAP

RXhusker

I have an undergrad in Aero E. (CU-Boulder) and remember doing some project work on axial flow compressors -- but I also know enough to leave the technical aspects to the guru (you in this case) -- we don't know enough (and shouldn't expect to know) about the proprietary aspects of your design. As a business owner myself -- my suggestion to you would be to just keep focused on the outcomes and needs of the market -- if you can deliver on the promising potential of the axial s/c at a reasonable price -- the market will respond!

Keep up the good work! And no vacation for you this summer -- I want my axial s/c ASAP :D

magixpuma

keep up the good work

r0tor

iTrader: (1)

How do you deal with compressor surge on your units?

I'm pretty familiar with our gas turbines at our power plant (which have gigantic 17 stage axial compressors) and dramatic changes in load/speed are something they do not appreciate. Thus they have a carefully controlled intake system and 3 blowoff ports at different stages to handle this - which in our case is fine to bypass the compressor since we are only saving the equipment (only get speed/load changes in startup or shutdowns)but in a car I's think a similar system would create large periods of hesitation.

...or maybe this isn't a problem because your units only produce 6-10psi while ours is producing 135psi??

mqandil

Richard keep the good work, we all here want you to succeed. If there is anything you need please let me know

Mark

Omicron

What IS it about this thread that everyone keeps getting pissed off at each other? Jeesh, folks.

I have once again gone back and cleaned up all the bad will and negative comments. Let's stick to the topic.

Some people are here trying to learn, and there is no reason because of past (now deleted) negativity to continue in with that feeling.

AND, to those people who are feeling attacked, there's no reason to keep responding. And there's no reason to get sidetracked at this point... if the question is not DIRECTLY related to the Axial Flow unit at this point, don't ask it.

We're all here for the same reason - to learn and participate. Since the past comments are gone, it never happened. Let's procede with that in mind.

Richard Paul

iTrader: (5)

Thank you, RAP

Hymee

iTrader: (1)

Omicron,

Great Modding! Thankfully I missed the last round. Otherwise I might have been turned off this thread.

Cheers,
Hymee.

rotarygod

They both take in air, compress it, combust it, then expel it. From a functionality standpoint, what's different? A 4 cycle engine is a 4 cycle engine whether it spins, moves up and down, or has valves or not. The main consideration is how to calculate the theoretical airflow numbers based on displacement. Although you can work it out on paper fairly easily, it has often proven to be different in practice.

tokenbrit

Love the animation Hymee. :D

SurreyPuma

Dont know if anyone mentioned the pros and cons of axial flow? Personally id go for a centrifugal compressor, its smalled has a higher boost of upto 10:1. Axial flow would surge and stall big time unlike its centrifugal counterpart, either u would have a bleed valve on the casing or variable pitch stators, plus u would need many stages to gain the same kind of pressures as a single centrifugal compressor.Added intertia from rotating parts in axial flow would slow engine acceleration. Ever watched a 777 take off? How long does it take for the engine to spool up???? Airflow through the engine is very precise, to much and youll have a surge.
KEEP IT SIMPLE!!

martin

Licenced aircraft engineer!!!

IKnowNot'ing

How much time would it take to spool up a 777 engine if it had a centrifugal compressor, you think? How much does it take to spool up an early RR Nene engine?
For the rest (surge, stall, inertia...) we'll see in due time when Richard releases some data.

Richard Paul

iTrader: (5)

Isn't it fully spooled when the pilot lifts on the brakes???
What parts have you engineered??

SurreyPuma

If u use axial flow on a car engine it would only be good at constant speed, constant accelerate and deaccelerate would be no good it would never attain pressure, Because as the axle accelerates you will be starving the engine of air because either u will be bleeding air off or your variable pitch stator vanes will be restricting air flow to prevent surge!!!If its a single spooled engine it will accelerate quicker than a RR 3 spool design. An old RR nene engine was centrifugal engine, again a single spool engine.
Some engines such as the pt6 use axial and a centrifugal compressors, but im led to believe it runs at about 56000 rpm!!!! Obviously an engine like this isnt accelerated and deaccelarated in short spurts because if u did not much would happen!
Ive worked on rolls royce , cfm , v2500, pratts and light aviation engines!
Personnally!!! Im interested in making an exhaust recovery turbine, whereby the exhaust is passed through a turbine which is directly connected to the prop shaft or gearbox. Think how much energy is wasted in gas!
The more stages u add the more problems u will have with surge, which will probably make the engine stall! Id imagine u would need a fairly large compressor as the 8's engine draws 3.9 litres of air a revoultion! multiply that by 9000 thats quite a bit of air!

SurreyPuma

My mistake the nene had 2 shafts!!!

Richard Paul

iTrader: (5)

Puma, Let me see if I understand this.
All 1000 plus axial flow superchargers out there that I have built do not work???
Their owners have failed to report this to me.
Axial flow superchargers marketed as Latham (my company) have been out since 1956. Read the June 1956 Hot Rod magazine.
Also check out several other magazine articals that tested my blowers. Do a search. In particular find the Car Craft artical of 1986 (I think and I'll look it up) that tested my blower compared to three roots blowers. All limited to 7 psi. My blower made 467 hp no one else made even 400. Independent test. Done by Airflow Research.

Some of the things you talk about make no sense to me. But I have a finite knowlage of gas turbines. I think you should talk to Turbine_pwr. He can address any questions you may have as to spooling up or down. I'm just a dumb hot rodder who builds things because no one told him he couldn't do it.

Just think, if I'd of had been blessed with your wisdom I never would have built all those blowers. I admit one thing, you would have saved me millions. And a marriage.

I'm going to go out and buy a scanner so I can put in some of the past documentation of my work.

Thank you for your input.

Richard

Richard Paul

iTrader: (5)

AH!!!! you better tell Rotory god about that rx airflow. He had to tell me the right way to figure it. But your way out on that shaft to rotor ratio. It's the other way. Now what say you?? 3.9ltr how about 7 ltrs, that would make it run.

And that exhaust recovery thing. You might try inventing the turbocharger.