Axial Flow Supercharger
01-17-2007, 01:43 PM
#4653
DaveCm
Join Date: Apr 2006
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I would not know what to do with 100 more hp. Will an intercooler of some type be available for cars that see track time or would it not be required? I know that roots and screw s/c produce a lot of heat. I am getting that this will not produce any where near that type of heat.
01-17-2007, 03:06 PM
#4655
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It’s a supercharger it produce boost as soon as you open the throttle…… 
I think your question is more along of what is the boost profile.
AFSC produce boost in a linear manner
For example
1 psi at 1krpm,
2 psi at 2kRPM
3psi at 3kRPM
...ect
But is not necessarily 1:1 linear
However pressure is not what you should be looking at.....
Its how much air mass you can get to flow into the combustion chamber (also out)
Pressure is just one way to get that mass flow; there comes a turning point where temperature rise due to compression decreases the amount of density increases you get from the added pressure; anything over that pressure causes an rapid increases in charge temperatures having a net effect of a diminishing density increases vs. pressure rise.
I think your question is more along of what is the boost profile.
AFSC produce boost in a linear manner
For example
1 psi at 1krpm,
2 psi at 2kRPM
3psi at 3kRPM
...ect
But is not necessarily 1:1 linear
However pressure is not what you should be looking at.....
Its how much air mass you can get to flow into the combustion chamber (also out)
Pressure is just one way to get that mass flow; there comes a turning point where temperature rise due to compression decreases the amount of density increases you get from the added pressure; anything over that pressure causes an rapid increases in charge temperatures having a net effect of a diminishing density increases vs. pressure rise.
Last edited by deppenma; 01-17-2007 at 03:12 PM.
01-17-2007, 09:06 PM
#4657
Registered
Boost comes online a bit later than most think it will and at a different rate than most think it does. I'm not going to say anymore until Richard finally shows us a plot of it. He is always changing things around and what works today may not necessarily apply tomorrow.
01-18-2007, 12:36 PM
#4661
Administrator
iTrader: (7)
Originally Posted by Nemesis8
Is Richard on vacation?
I'm holding my breath in anticipation!
01-18-2007, 09:57 PM
#4674
Guess I'd better step up here. 
We have been working on productionizing things and lining up vendors. Seems like forever to get others motivated, I mean just because I want it NOW and pay them later and they should do it for free. WTF
Next comes the real hang up, we are not getting our reflash from the source we wanted. It may happen but not right now. We are working with two other sources now but don't have their hardware on our car yet. We are doing tuning with a system that will not be coming with our kit.
Next we have a new test bench under construction. This has more power and variable frequency speed control. We also have some data aquisition hardware that if we can get it working will help alot.
There is another hang up that is winding it's way through the pipeline, legal pipeline that is. We can't sell anything until our patent applications are accepted. They don't have to be approved or anything like that, just accept the damn application. That means............ I don't know. Hell, I'm a pervert not a lawyer.
As to your question about the curve, I answered this before but RG is right, or close for as he says I change things alot. I can't break the laws of physics so it will be between the radial flow and positive displacement types. It's all explained somewhere at the beginning.
While I can't break the laws of physics I can bend the rules a little. I do this by moving the efficiency points. That's a small change in overall curves as you will see it. But it is not like a centrifugal (yes I'm talking to you MM) I can't make it do that just as I can't make it work like a PD. If will still be like textbooks say it will.... I mean close thereto.
We haven't taken it to a road course yet but we will. I'm going to drive it up to Lake Tahoe in a few weeks for some cold weather testing. Because of the tight tolerances and it being aluminum cold weather could do things we don't expect.
Hopefully we allowed for all that though. We've already done hot tests. It would be nice if we get to do these with the aluminum manifold that we don't have ready yet, but close.
Anyway a high speed drive up the 5 and up the mountain will be a good test. And a fun drive, I hope. Is there room for chains on these things? I don't plan on getting caught in a storm but it does happen. I think they make some real low clip on thingies for this sort of car. Any bad weather owners have tips for me? There's plenty of time to be prepared. What about the fog light thing? I heard there is a fix for this. What a luxury I have, never worrying about these things, you poor souls.
I'm going out and buying winter tires and wheels just for one trip, am I?
If I forgot anyones questions I'm sure you'll let me know.
We have been working on productionizing things and lining up vendors. Seems like forever to get others motivated, I mean just because I want it NOW and pay them later and they should do it for free. WTFNext comes the real hang up, we are not getting our reflash from the source we wanted. It may happen but not right now. We are working with two other sources now but don't have their hardware on our car yet. We are doing tuning with a system that will not be coming with our kit.
Next we have a new test bench under construction. This has more power and variable frequency speed control. We also have some data aquisition hardware that if we can get it working will help alot.
There is another hang up that is winding it's way through the pipeline, legal pipeline that is. We can't sell anything until our patent applications are accepted. They don't have to be approved or anything like that, just accept the damn application. That means............ I don't know. Hell, I'm a pervert not a lawyer.
As to your question about the curve, I answered this before but RG is right, or close for as he says I change things alot. I can't break the laws of physics so it will be between the radial flow and positive displacement types. It's all explained somewhere at the beginning.
While I can't break the laws of physics I can bend the rules a little. I do this by moving the efficiency points. That's a small change in overall curves as you will see it. But it is not like a centrifugal (yes I'm talking to you MM) I can't make it do that just as I can't make it work like a PD. If will still be like textbooks say it will.... I mean close thereto.
We haven't taken it to a road course yet but we will. I'm going to drive it up to Lake Tahoe in a few weeks for some cold weather testing. Because of the tight tolerances and it being aluminum cold weather could do things we don't expect.
Hopefully we allowed for all that though. We've already done hot tests. It would be nice if we get to do these with the aluminum manifold that we don't have ready yet, but close.
Anyway a high speed drive up the 5 and up the mountain will be a good test. And a fun drive, I hope. Is there room for chains on these things? I don't plan on getting caught in a storm but it does happen. I think they make some real low clip on thingies for this sort of car. Any bad weather owners have tips for me? There's plenty of time to be prepared. What about the fog light thing? I heard there is a fix for this. What a luxury I have, never worrying about these things, you poor souls.
I'm going out and buying winter tires and wheels just for one trip, am I?
If I forgot anyones questions I'm sure you'll let me know.
01-18-2007, 10:25 PM
#4675
Robert
Join Date: Mar 2005
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So what happens if the patents don’t get approved? The government is very slow and patents can take a long time to get approved. I know how long it takes, I have several patents for software, and a couple of them took years to get approved, so are you thinking this could be a year or two away?
I can hardly wait for this supercharger to be released, it’s going to make my RX-8 fun again. I moved from Dallas to Salt Lake City, 4000 feet makes a big difference.
I can hardly wait for this supercharger to be released, it’s going to make my RX-8 fun again. I moved from Dallas to Salt Lake City, 4000 feet makes a big difference.