Axial Flow Supercharger
03-02-2005, 11:20 PM
#1426
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Originally Posted by Ajax
you cant really call electronics girlie man stuff.. 90ma will kill the average human being.. that's nothing.. and w/o electronics your modern engine would be worthless..
anyway :b
back on topic.
anyway :b
back on topic.
And about electronics...like RP said before...give him a Weber...
BTW, little game for you Jon: http://www.oz.net/~coilgun/mark2/rlcsim.htm
03-02-2005, 11:37 PM
#1427
I wasn't refering to the electronics as girlie man stuff it was the flowers and clothes shopping. Without the modern electronics the engines wouldn't be making the power they are or as reliable. Yet they should have a limit. Who was it? RG who posted something about obdlll will allow "them" to shut your car off as you drive by if they don't like some of the reading your ecu is getting. They say the idea is stopping the bad guys that are running. Well I don't care it's their ocupational hazard if there are 25 high speed chases a year so what.
For that the rest of us are going to risk the freedom of driving how we want where we want. What happens when the bad guys hack into that system? Can they shut off the cop cars? Or how about if they just shut you down cause they liked your car or worse your wife.
Now that's when the resurgents of carbs will come. Right allong with distributors. And how many guys are there going to be around who can work on those things. My life will have value. Fred you and I can go into a very good buisness of conversions away from electronics. I'm not even adverse to building cars for the bad guys. Kinda like in the bootlegging days. I'm for sportsmanship.
Last year I stoped along the I-5 for lunch on the way to Tahoe. What was there but three CHP cars their drivers having lunch. When I got out I was walking my dog and the chp's were BS'n around the cars. which consisted of a regular Ford black and white. Then an all white Ford. Then, what the hell a Z-28 Camaro?? With the smallest light rack you have ever seen. If those lights were 2 inches I'd be supprised. So being the smart *** that I am I went over (Ihad my dog ) and asked them "What ever happened to sportsmanship?" knowing exactly what i ment the one guy say's "well it sure is fun".
"Ya for you guys" I still think it's cheating. Then he tells me their cars have a better engine package then the regular cars do. What's with that?
The General is building cars for that side, I'm up for building cars for the other team.
For that the rest of us are going to risk the freedom of driving how we want where we want. What happens when the bad guys hack into that system? Can they shut off the cop cars? Or how about if they just shut you down cause they liked your car or worse your wife.
Now that's when the resurgents of carbs will come. Right allong with distributors. And how many guys are there going to be around who can work on those things. My life will have value. Fred you and I can go into a very good buisness of conversions away from electronics. I'm not even adverse to building cars for the bad guys. Kinda like in the bootlegging days. I'm for sportsmanship.
Last year I stoped along the I-5 for lunch on the way to Tahoe. What was there but three CHP cars their drivers having lunch. When I got out I was walking my dog and the chp's were BS'n around the cars. which consisted of a regular Ford black and white. Then an all white Ford. Then, what the hell a Z-28 Camaro?? With the smallest light rack you have ever seen. If those lights were 2 inches I'd be supprised. So being the smart *** that I am I went over (Ihad my dog ) and asked them "What ever happened to sportsmanship?" knowing exactly what i ment the one guy say's "well it sure is fun".
"Ya for you guys" I still think it's cheating. Then he tells me their cars have a better engine package then the regular cars do. What's with that?
The General is building cars for that side, I'm up for building cars for the other team.
Last edited by Richard Paul; 03-02-2005 at 11:40 PM.
03-03-2005, 01:16 AM
#1430
First it's John Kenneth Galbraith's warnings of the Military Industrial Complex and now Rotarygod's warnings of a forth-coming Autosports/Law Enforcement Industrial Complex. Supplying both sides of a war is the quickest way to make a buck! Caller I.D. and caller I.D. blockers. From the same company. Hmmm.....
Rich, in my contemplation about acquiring my own turbo kit I began to wonder if my desires to do something off the beaten path should prevail and maybe I should combine my idea for the hydro-drive with your axial flow and solve each others' problems. Care to knock the industry dead at the next SEMA with a new FI for the RX-8? I am available to talk about it.
CRH
Rich, in my contemplation about acquiring my own turbo kit I began to wonder if my desires to do something off the beaten path should prevail and maybe I should combine my idea for the hydro-drive with your axial flow and solve each others' problems. Care to knock the industry dead at the next SEMA with a new FI for the RX-8? I am available to talk about it.
CRH
03-03-2005, 03:25 AM
#1431
Registered User
Originally Posted by Richard Paul
You, myself and Oldragger are the only one's here who know what you are talking about. 
THAT was drag racing! Weekly, Rivero,Fox,Holding,Crosby,Stills,Nash,Young,Sacco and Vanzetti were local heroes around here.
Hehe, back then they dumped raw fuel into the blower inlet and called it "fuel injection."
Anyone want to set up a Spalding Flamethrower?
03-03-2005, 03:29 AM
#1432
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Originally Posted by swoope
its a thread race, and this one just got a shot of nos.
beers
beers
03-03-2005, 07:52 AM
#1434
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If a sonic boom happens can we travel back to 1954?
Originally Posted by Richard Paul
Hey, hey, it's engines, I don't care if you put them in cars, planes or boats. But it's always about the engines. We don't do amplifiers and diodes or capasitors.
We don't do flowers or clothes. This ain't no girlie man thread.
As to the intake I don't know what you refer to. The manifold or the aircleaner?
At the moment I think we need some of the real estate that the air box now has.
Again we haven't even desided if the air will go in the back or front of the SC. It will depend on how it packages. We have the option of changing this althogh it takes a full redesign of the parts.
Since we are not in production yet it may change. All the prototypes have been axial rear inlet. This is the way I like it but most of the blowers I built in the past have been the other way 'round.
Rotarygod is worried thar I wouldn't leave him any headroom in the design. Now would I do that to you? I can't be sure of covering the range if there isn't something left. I am not going to max out every little bit that is in there right away. No matter what I do someone is going to force the thing to go faster. Now I can tell you where the theoretical point of going Mach is. I can design it so it runs well below it, yet there is going to be that one guy and you know who you are. That is going ballistic with it. I have no idea what will happen if you do.
I know it will not flow as much air and keep pushing less as more surfaces go sonic. It might get "blade stalls" little storms that stay in the blades and stop flow.
You might get one big bang when the air just stops. The damage may be limited to the blower but I doubt it. Supersonic waves are very strong, witness sonic booms. You don't have to actually go sonic to get some points on the blade to be supersonic. This is because air is going different speeds at different points on a wing. Remember how some WWll fighter pilots were having trouble controling thier planes when they got into high speed dives. Say a P-51 pilot go into a war emegency situation and his only way out is a dive at full power. He is climing on 500MPH plus. The wave pressure is already starting to move back on his control surfaces. When they get to thhe control surfavce he can't move them with his manual controls. Remember there was no power assist.
So are there little pockets around radius or such that go sonic before you are actuall sonic, yes there are. So use care, when you get ther you will have gone to far. Also the speed of sound is based on temp. It is slower when cooler. A car on the ground has to go faster then a plane at 30,000 ft to break the sound barrier.
Ok gotta go check my E mails now. You guys keep up the good fight.
We don't do flowers or clothes. This ain't no girlie man thread.
As to the intake I don't know what you refer to. The manifold or the aircleaner?
At the moment I think we need some of the real estate that the air box now has.
Again we haven't even desided if the air will go in the back or front of the SC. It will depend on how it packages. We have the option of changing this althogh it takes a full redesign of the parts.
Since we are not in production yet it may change. All the prototypes have been axial rear inlet. This is the way I like it but most of the blowers I built in the past have been the other way 'round.
Rotarygod is worried thar I wouldn't leave him any headroom in the design. Now would I do that to you? I can't be sure of covering the range if there isn't something left. I am not going to max out every little bit that is in there right away. No matter what I do someone is going to force the thing to go faster. Now I can tell you where the theoretical point of going Mach is. I can design it so it runs well below it, yet there is going to be that one guy and you know who you are. That is going ballistic with it. I have no idea what will happen if you do.
I know it will not flow as much air and keep pushing less as more surfaces go sonic. It might get "blade stalls" little storms that stay in the blades and stop flow.
You might get one big bang when the air just stops. The damage may be limited to the blower but I doubt it. Supersonic waves are very strong, witness sonic booms. You don't have to actually go sonic to get some points on the blade to be supersonic. This is because air is going different speeds at different points on a wing. Remember how some WWll fighter pilots were having trouble controling thier planes when they got into high speed dives. Say a P-51 pilot go into a war emegency situation and his only way out is a dive at full power. He is climing on 500MPH plus. The wave pressure is already starting to move back on his control surfaces. When they get to thhe control surfavce he can't move them with his manual controls. Remember there was no power assist.
So are there little pockets around radius or such that go sonic before you are actuall sonic, yes there are. So use care, when you get ther you will have gone to far. Also the speed of sound is based on temp. It is slower when cooler. A car on the ground has to go faster then a plane at 30,000 ft to break the sound barrier.
Ok gotta go check my E mails now. You guys keep up the good fight.
03-03-2005, 12:50 PM
#1436
Now you see I don't think that is correct. Air can't go supersonic through air now can it? That is exactly what the sound barrier is. I think I took a shot at this on this thread awhile back.
OK I'm still thinking if this could happen. Give me some time I'll get back to you.
It is possable if the partical wave not the sound wave were to go through. But I don't know if this happens in real life. I'll ask someone at lunch.
OK I'm still thinking if this could happen. Give me some time I'll get back to you.
It is possable if the partical wave not the sound wave were to go through. But I don't know if this happens in real life. I'll ask someone at lunch.
03-03-2005, 01:18 PM
#1437
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Originally Posted by Richard Paul
Zoom, (notice I didn't say 44) it must mean I' learning the right way to say the same thing I said before.
or you 'vw finally said it enough times that its actually sinking in. happy birthday to Terri( interesting my sister spells her name the same way) and get thee to the jewlery store!
03-03-2005, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by RP
Now you see I don't think that is correct. Air can't go supersonic through air now can it? That is exactly what the sound barrier is. I think I took a shot at this on this thread awhile back.
But let's assume you shoot on a truck tire with 8 atm, the air escaping the tire should definitely reach supersonic speed for a very short time.
Last edited by globi; 03-03-2005 at 03:05 PM.
03-03-2005, 03:53 PM
#1440
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Originally Posted by guy321
What about travelling to 1954 in our 8's. Can your Axial flow SC do that with that stalling air vortex dealy?
but can it produce the 1.21 gigawatts needed?
03-03-2005, 04:11 PM
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*** NEWS FLASH ***
Axial Flow Supercharged Engine Sets World Record
Today, an axial flow supercharged engine (in this case more commonly known as a jet engine), powered the Virgin Atlantic Global Flyer on a historic first ever non-stop, non-refueled solo flight around the complete whole entire world. Piloted by 60 year old Steve Fossett, also first to fly non-stop around the world in a balloon, the trip was accomplished in 67 hours. Takeoff weight was 22,000 lbs... landing weight about 4,000 lbs... the takeoff weight was 82% fuel! The flight was in danger of failure due to 2,600 lbs of fuel "disappearing" due to a leak early in the flight.
The GlobalFlyer was designed by Burt Rutan and built by Mr. Rutan's company, Scaled Composites, of Mojave, Calif. Scaled also built SpaceShip One, which took home the $10 million X Prize in October for the first private flight into space. He also built the Voyager, which Mr. Rutan's brother Dick flew, with another pilot, Jeana Yeager, around the world nonstop without refueling in 1986. That plane had a piston-driven engine, and the flight took nine days.
Axial Flow Supercharged Engine Sets World Record
Today, an axial flow supercharged engine (in this case more commonly known as a jet engine), powered the Virgin Atlantic Global Flyer on a historic first ever non-stop, non-refueled solo flight around the complete whole entire world. Piloted by 60 year old Steve Fossett, also first to fly non-stop around the world in a balloon, the trip was accomplished in 67 hours. Takeoff weight was 22,000 lbs... landing weight about 4,000 lbs... the takeoff weight was 82% fuel! The flight was in danger of failure due to 2,600 lbs of fuel "disappearing" due to a leak early in the flight.
The GlobalFlyer was designed by Burt Rutan and built by Mr. Rutan's company, Scaled Composites, of Mojave, Calif. Scaled also built SpaceShip One, which took home the $10 million X Prize in October for the first private flight into space. He also built the Voyager, which Mr. Rutan's brother Dick flew, with another pilot, Jeana Yeager, around the world nonstop without refueling in 1986. That plane had a piston-driven engine, and the flight took nine days.
03-03-2005, 04:27 PM
#1443
Globi, you are right and you explain it well. The excaping air is going to produce a "bump" of speed where it will reach max at the exit restriction. Due to the high delta the actual matter that comprise the molicules are forced to the low pressure area and can go sonic at the Bernoulli as you call it, where speed is highest. For those not remembering Bernoulli is the guy who gave us the venturi.
It is in essense a partical wave not the sound wave.
Now as to going back to 1954 or there abouts. I'm sorry, the only way this is done is by willingness to drive one of the biggest pieces of crap ever made. A Delorien, stainless steel body on a fiberglass frame! Kinda like a Vega, aluminum block with free standing aluminum bores and a cast iron head. Can anybody spell backwards.
Therefore as Rx8 drivers you must be content to stay here and now.
It is in essense a partical wave not the sound wave.
Now as to going back to 1954 or there abouts. I'm sorry, the only way this is done is by willingness to drive one of the biggest pieces of crap ever made. A Delorien, stainless steel body on a fiberglass frame! Kinda like a Vega, aluminum block with free standing aluminum bores and a cast iron head. Can anybody spell backwards.
Therefore as Rx8 drivers you must be content to stay here and now.
03-03-2005, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by RX8-TX
Related to Chucky?
But not an uncommon question... one she got very tired of answering, as I recall (can't believe that was almost 20 years ago
).
03-04-2005, 01:20 PM
#1447
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Top fuel dragsters are obviously very loud. Now the gases escaping the exhaust pipes probably reach super sonic speeds, since the pressure is still very high when the exhaust valves open (pressure transforms into speed).
If it's not the speed of the exhaust particles that make that extremely loud sound, what else would it be? If the top fuel dragsters had mufflers they wouldn't emit that sound or would they?
If it's not the speed of the exhaust particles that make that extremely loud sound, what else would it be? If the top fuel dragsters had mufflers they wouldn't emit that sound or would they?
03-04-2005, 01:52 PM
#1448
Globi, don't you think I have enough **** to ponder.
Somewhere deep in my head things come rising up all by themselves, There is a never ending stream of questions/problems/delema/debates/etc.
If you come up with something and I choose not to bother with answering it, yet somewhere, somehow I'll be in the shower months from now and it will surface.
It will never go away until I figure it out. So that is where this is going, filed.
Some day I will notify you that the answer came up.
Yet my internal hard drive is getting overloaded with trivia, I know it can't get full but it still slows down the everyday computations. A young mans mind is less cloged and it is easier to sit around the dorm on friday night with beer and pizza pondering all sorts of useless events. (I never lived in a dorm)
My father, who was not an educated man used to say; "My son is a wealth of useless information."
I still get into these stupid mental excersises with my partner Dana. He is a mech eng from of all places Berkley. The only conservitive ever to get his BSME from there.
Somewhere deep in my head things come rising up all by themselves, There is a never ending stream of questions/problems/delema/debates/etc.
If you come up with something and I choose not to bother with answering it, yet somewhere, somehow I'll be in the shower months from now and it will surface.
It will never go away until I figure it out. So that is where this is going, filed.
Some day I will notify you that the answer came up.
Yet my internal hard drive is getting overloaded with trivia, I know it can't get full but it still slows down the everyday computations. A young mans mind is less cloged and it is easier to sit around the dorm on friday night with beer and pizza pondering all sorts of useless events. (I never lived in a dorm)
My father, who was not an educated man used to say; "My son is a wealth of useless information."
I still get into these stupid mental excersises with my partner Dana. He is a mech eng from of all places Berkley. The only conservitive ever to get his BSME from there.
