Engine Dyno testing of Renesis
06-27-2006, 10:29 AM
#277
Good work here.
One ? -- would it be possible to make a run sans the waterpump? there has been some limited discussion about equiping this car with an electric waterpump and we are wondering if it would be worth the effort. I'm thinking even with underdrive pullies we still lose a fair amount of power spinning that thing. Dont mean to hijack this thread-but if there was a 10-15 hp gain sans waterpump--dont you think people would be interested?
again--good work here.
olddragger
One ? -- would it be possible to make a run sans the waterpump? there has been some limited discussion about equiping this car with an electric waterpump and we are wondering if it would be worth the effort. I'm thinking even with underdrive pullies we still lose a fair amount of power spinning that thing. Dont mean to hijack this thread-but if there was a 10-15 hp gain sans waterpump--dont you think people would be interested?
again--good work here.
olddragger
06-27-2006, 08:23 PM
#278
Originally Posted by olddragger
Good work here.
One ? -- would it be possible to make a run sans the waterpump? there has been some limited discussion about equiping this car with an electric waterpump and we are wondering if it would be worth the effort. I'm thinking even with underdrive pullies we still lose a fair amount of power spinning that thing. Dont mean to hijack this thread-but if there was a 10-15 hp gain sans waterpump--dont you think people would be interested?
again--good work here.
olddragger
One ? -- would it be possible to make a run sans the waterpump? there has been some limited discussion about equiping this car with an electric waterpump and we are wondering if it would be worth the effort. I'm thinking even with underdrive pullies we still lose a fair amount of power spinning that thing. Dont mean to hijack this thread-but if there was a 10-15 hp gain sans waterpump--dont you think people would be interested?
again--good work here.
olddragger
Cheers,
Hymee.
07-04-2006, 08:09 AM
#279
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Wait, so you tested the header without a cat, and the stock set up with one?
It's allready been dyno proven that the cat eats 8 HP? so your header actually makes 6 hp, which ironically is exactly what RE A and every other header to date has gotten. I'm not knocking your product as its going to be much more avaliable then the JDM headers, just dont mis-represent what your product is actually doing in comparison to everyone elses product.
Second, im pretty sure that the intake infront of the TB is a tuned section of the intake on the rx8, that might be where your missing power is comming from. Atleast a bellmouth or something on the TB might help, The Tb was never ment to be used as an intake and the straight cut off edge is going to be causing tons of turbulence and effectivly decreasing the diameter of the TB.
Last, about the electric water pump, even if it frees up 40 Hp running without the water pump, how exactly are you expecting to get that back with an electric one? Unless you run it solely off its own dedicated battery like they do on drag cars that power is just going to come from your alternator. Your going to be converting mechanical energy to electricty back into mechanical energy, and each conversion is at best 90% effecient, so insted of th water pump taking 40 HP your electric water pump will take 44+ Hp,...
It's allready been dyno proven that the cat eats 8 HP? so your header actually makes 6 hp, which ironically is exactly what RE A and every other header to date has gotten. I'm not knocking your product as its going to be much more avaliable then the JDM headers, just dont mis-represent what your product is actually doing in comparison to everyone elses product.
Second, im pretty sure that the intake infront of the TB is a tuned section of the intake on the rx8, that might be where your missing power is comming from. Atleast a bellmouth or something on the TB might help, The Tb was never ment to be used as an intake and the straight cut off edge is going to be causing tons of turbulence and effectivly decreasing the diameter of the TB.
Last, about the electric water pump, even if it frees up 40 Hp running without the water pump, how exactly are you expecting to get that back with an electric one? Unless you run it solely off its own dedicated battery like they do on drag cars that power is just going to come from your alternator. Your going to be converting mechanical energy to electricty back into mechanical energy, and each conversion is at best 90% effecient, so insted of th water pump taking 40 HP your electric water pump will take 44+ Hp,...
07-04-2006, 03:07 PM
#280
Until we test the stock exhaust manifold without a cat, nothing is proven in my eyes. It would be wrong to test the headers with the stock cat, as we will never run that combo anyway. Dyno time is scarce, and it would have been better to do one more test that day. Regardess, I am finding it hard to believe the cat eats 8 HP - but more testing will tell the real story.
As for the intake, well now there is something else people want me to test. If only engine dyno time was a free public service... LOL. Lets wait and see. I guess some turkey will then complain that we haven't got the front bumper in place, so that is making a difference. D'oh! Anyways, the ultimate goals of this testing is for forced induction. In this case, the engine really only sees the plenum - where the runners open in to.
I've been thinking more about the water pump thing, and of course it will drain some energy from the generator. But how many horses do you think it really would need to spin that water pump? I reckon on or two horses running on a treadmill would produce more than enough output to spin that little impeller around and pump that reasonably small flow of water. So it might be something to look at when we are chasing the last 1 or 2 HP, but I don't see us testing that as a high priority. We are looking for much more major gains than that.
So many things to test to keep everyone happy! So little dyno time. Some many $$$!
Cheers,
Hymee.
As for the intake, well now there is something else people want me to test. If only engine dyno time was a free public service... LOL. Lets wait and see. I guess some turkey will then complain that we haven't got the front bumper in place, so that is making a difference. D'oh! Anyways, the ultimate goals of this testing is for forced induction. In this case, the engine really only sees the plenum - where the runners open in to.
I've been thinking more about the water pump thing, and of course it will drain some energy from the generator. But how many horses do you think it really would need to spin that water pump? I reckon on or two horses running on a treadmill would produce more than enough output to spin that little impeller around and pump that reasonably small flow of water. So it might be something to look at when we are chasing the last 1 or 2 HP, but I don't see us testing that as a high priority. We are looking for much more major gains than that.
So many things to test to keep everyone happy! So little dyno time. Some many $$$!
Cheers,
Hymee.
07-04-2006, 04:36 PM
#281
Hymlee,
electric water pumps on small block fords and chevys have resulted in 15-20 hp increase in the upper rpm ranges (and their redlines where around 7.5K if I remember correctly). They draw anywhere fro 5 to 6.1 amps(like some stero systems). I certainly understand about paying for dyno time, and I am prepared to help with the cost of that run (since it was my suggestion). We are all into this together(well kinda)
olddragger
electric water pumps on small block fords and chevys have resulted in 15-20 hp increase in the upper rpm ranges (and their redlines where around 7.5K if I remember correctly). They draw anywhere fro 5 to 6.1 amps(like some stero systems). I certainly understand about paying for dyno time, and I am prepared to help with the cost of that run (since it was my suggestion). We are all into this together(well kinda)
olddragger
07-17-2006, 09:28 PM
#284
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Originally Posted by guitarjunkie28
dunno if i'd believe that without something backing it up besides one guy's hear-say, uneducated opinion. he was talking about the "right" seals to make the power... no seal will give you substantially more power than stock.
Again, sorry for the hi-jack but maybe it remotley pertains to the topic at hand.
07-18-2006, 12:05 AM
#290
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Originally Posted by Hymee
...................
We found 14. I know RB are God and cannot be questioned or challenged. Oh well. We have our figures... and Wildcard knows how his top speed was affected by the ram air duct.......................................
Hymee.
We found 14. I know RB are God and cannot be questioned or challenged. Oh well. We have our figures... and Wildcard knows how his top speed was affected by the ram air duct.......................................
Hymee.
Sorry, I edited your quote to save some space. Please tell me more about how wildcard's top speed was affected by the ram air duct, i have one and now am pissed.
07-18-2006, 01:48 AM
#292
Yep - it is a good peice of kit. Well engineered, and well made. Needed a slight mod to fit the aussie cars. There might be more to wildcards problem, but the act of removing it got him back his top speed. But since then he has found something else (only recently) which might explain the problem. Looking into it some more, so I guess we will post when we know exactly.
07-18-2006, 02:10 AM
#293
Originally Posted by Hymee
Yep - it is a good peice of kit. Well engineered, and well made. Needed a slight mod to fit the aussie cars. There might be more to wildcards problem, but the act of removing it got him back his top speed. But since then he has found something else (only recently) which might explain the problem. Looking into it some more, so I guess we will post when we know exactly.
chattyguy.
beers
07-18-2006, 02:24 AM
#294
Front plates are normally in the center of the main grill. More info when I know more. Something to do with LTFT's going rather rich over time. Resetting PCM fixes problem in the short term, until LFTF's are "learned" again. Like I said - more research needed.
Cheers,
Hymee.
Cheers,
Hymee.
07-18-2006, 02:26 AM
#295
Originally Posted by Hymee
Front plates are normally in the center of the main grill. More info when I know more. Something to do with LTFT's going rather rich over time. Resetting PCM fixes problem in the short term, until LFTF's are "learned" again. Like I said - more research needed.
Cheers,
Hymee.
Cheers,
Hymee.
beers
Last edited by swoope; 07-18-2006 at 02:29 AM.
07-19-2006, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Richard Paul
Make your bet, I'll cover it. But it better be enough to cover the costs and some left over. Better yet loser pays all expenses and the bet is additional.
07-19-2006, 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Brettus
great to see someone put their dangly bits on the line !
07-19-2006, 10:05 PM
#299
Whoo there buddy. RB is ok but the engine will be picked at random from their inventory. A Renesis is only a renesis when all the factory componants are intact.
You want to start modifying things where does it stop? Granted unlimited mods why not add a blower and run it on alki/nitro mixture? Not a Renesis then.
We can call a NASCAR engine a 350 Chevy by those rules. Gee I'll bet that I can get 800 HP from my Chevy!! Hell that's with restriction of a four barrel carb and a distributor. Add EFI and electronic managment it'll get 900 or more. With pushrods and poppet valves no less. And they run for 600 miles or more at WOT over 9000 RPM.
You seen any Renesis run full throttle at 9500 all day long? They don't even have parts that go up and down.
You want to start modifying things where does it stop? Granted unlimited mods why not add a blower and run it on alki/nitro mixture? Not a Renesis then.
We can call a NASCAR engine a 350 Chevy by those rules. Gee I'll bet that I can get 800 HP from my Chevy!! Hell that's with restriction of a four barrel carb and a distributor. Add EFI and electronic managment it'll get 900 or more. With pushrods and poppet valves no less. And they run for 600 miles or more at WOT over 9000 RPM.
You seen any Renesis run full throttle at 9500 all day long? They don't even have parts that go up and down.
07-19-2006, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Richard Paul
Whoo there buddy. RB is ok but the engine will be picked at random from their inventory. A Renesis is only a renesis when all the factory componants are intact.
You want to start modifying things where does it stop? Granted unlimited mods why not add a blower and run it on alki/nitro mixture? Not a Renesis then.
We can call a NASCAR engine a 350 Chevy by those rules. Gee I'll bet that I can get 800 HP from my Chevy!! Hell that's with restriction of a four barrel carb and a distributor. Add EFI and electronic managment it'll get 900 or more. With pushrods and poppet valves no less. And they run for 600 miles or more at WOT over 9000 RPM.
You seen any Renesis run full throttle at 9500 all day long? They don't even have parts that go up and down.
You want to start modifying things where does it stop? Granted unlimited mods why not add a blower and run it on alki/nitro mixture? Not a Renesis then.
We can call a NASCAR engine a 350 Chevy by those rules. Gee I'll bet that I can get 800 HP from my Chevy!! Hell that's with restriction of a four barrel carb and a distributor. Add EFI and electronic managment it'll get 900 or more. With pushrods and poppet valves no less. And they run for 600 miles or more at WOT over 9000 RPM.
You seen any Renesis run full throttle at 9500 all day long? They don't even have parts that go up and down.