Fanman

Actually I was premixing. I've gone through 2 boxes of Pettit Racing's Protek-R (about 40 tankfuls).

swoope

iTrader: (5)

i would bet that motor was doomed before the turbo...

imho..

beers

Fanman

Have to send it back to the place where I got the replacement engine, as I am being charged a core charge of $1000.

rkostolni

Do you think your blown engine could be related to the weather change? If your tuner didn't add enough fuel enrichment into your air temp map your AFR's could have leaned out causing ping.

Fanman

I really don't think so. The AFR's were plenty rich. As a matter of fact we were planning to lean it out the next time I was going to bring my car in, as the car had a conservative tune.

dastallion951

honestly fanman took my car in for the blinking CEL n lack of power...........IGNITION COILS!!!!!!!!!! u said before ur car had the blinkin cel at high RPMS n HIGH boost, then gradually started occuring at LOW BOOST........ ignition coils couldve very well been the culprit...... u said ur EGT's spiked when u misfired......well since u have the motor at ur house, check ur ignition coils.......theres a thread on here, about how to check the coils to see if they still work properly..........just my $0.02.........if so u mightve found the culprit........

Fanman

Nah, it's the engine. Definitely the engine. I wish it was the coils, but Mazda told me it was the engine, and now my mechanic (this week when removing it) has told me it's the engine. Drove it onto the tow truck (to take from dealer to mechanic last week. Lot of stuff coming out of the tailpipe, lot of vibration, lot of gas smells.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Damn Fanman, miss this post till ...

Sorry about your lost man. I think you're one of the longest Greddy Kit owner, and now u're motor is gone ....

To some of the people in this thread. I dont have Turbo myself. Im planning to get one. I fully understands the risk of FI.

From what I've read for a year something on this and other Rx8 forums. Greddy kit itself is a half-assed product. Rush out the door just to try to get some quick cash. By just looking at the kit most can tell its a really untested product. Im 1000000% sure Greddy knows that their kit has serious problems, but they just choose to ignore it. Lets not forget about Greddy's *exceptional* customer service.

Why did Fanman's engine died we will never know, but it has something to do with the Turbo thats for sure. No no Im not talking about the usual *oh Turboing a car would shorten the engine's life* kind of crap. I mean Greddy kit itself will bring some *extra damage/wear* to the engine. Turbo is undersize, Cheap hose, crappy EMU(even Ultimate is not that great), no customer service at all.

Oh well. good luck with your new engine, Welcome back to the NA group !

Oh yeah, forgot to ask, what are you going to do with your V F-Con Pro ?

rkostolni

First, it may or may not be due to the turbo. There is a recall for premature engine failures on NA engines for a reason. Who's to say it's not related to that.

Second, as MD has already pointed out, Fanman was already running a better EMS, the other details of the turbo system are irrelevant at the boost level he was running. It would have happened with PTP's kit, SFR's, or Mazsport's.

It could have been just a bad tank of gas.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

It might have something to do with the recall/Mazda/engine, but lets not forget the actual rate for *engine replacements* are quite low.

Or maybe just his luck. who knows ?

We have to wait and see if other turbo kits would cause the same *premature dead engine* problem, but I have a feeling kits out there now (other than Greddy) would last longer. Just have to wait and see.

MadDog

Yeah, those high-quality silicone couplers are sure to add thousands of miles of trouble-free driving...

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

But Im still pretty sure its better than the cheap crap came with the *incomplete kit* that might crack in a few hundred if not few thousand miles ...

I guess we're already done with the Greddy game. Now we have to play another wait and see game, which is the PTP/SFR/Mazsport game.

MadDog

You still don't get it...

CCarlisi

You said a lot of time was spent tuning the car. What AFR was it tuned to? What were you running for timing? Sorry to hear about your loss

Fanman

Let me look around for my dyno chart and see if it has the A/F chart below it. I posted one on the board a long time ago but the AFR were pretty much in line with what everyone was recommending. Wasn't a timing issue. Like I said one of the coutries foremost authorities on the EMU & rotaries, at one of the best shops in the country did the tuning. I'll look for the dynochart.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

I know what you meant.

sigh, since now theres almost no way for us to tell what exactly gone wrong for Fanman's engine ... might have nothing to do with the Turbo ...... its gonna be a mystery

mysql101

How would the turbo cause damage? If it fails to function, he gets less pressure and the car would adjust for that. If it gets too much pressure and overboosts, that would be the wastegate's fault for not opening.

rkostolni

So you didn't even have an AFR gauge?

It blows my mind that people would even consider consider adding FI without proper instrumentation.

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

There are plenty of speed-heads running around out there without even a boost gauge.
Some people just don't have any mechanical empathy at all. They just want to go faster and don't care how they get there. When it blows, they blame the car.
I've done installs over the years for people that absolutely refuse to spend the extra money on instrumentation. Half the time, they don't even want to pay the $7 for the welded-in O2 sensor bung for tuning!

Fanman

Are you talking to me ? I had a boost gauge, and an EGT, so I did have instrumentation. And I did know what was going on. During the tune they had a AFR gauge stuck to my windshield the whole time making sure the tune was correct. I never let the EGT ever get too high (usually let off of it when it got to 1200-1300 degrees farenheit.

Here is a pictue of my setup :

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

you can't rely on EGT alone, EGT decreases as AFR exceeds 15:1

you need accurate AFR and anti-detonation control

Fanman

Never really pushed my car that hard. Whenever EGT's got to 1200-1300 degrees I would back off the car. Never saw it to point where I would be see my EGT's go down in boost (EGT's dropping during prolonged boost/high AFR's). Again during the tuning they did have an AFR's gauge on my car.

If somebody thinks that I drove my car particularly hard, they would be wrong. Never tracked it, never did the 1/4 mile with it. Just drove it on the street regularly, and because of a defective wastegate spring never even went above 6 psi of boost. Never stood on it for prolonged periods, as the relitively low EGT's would attest to.

Maybe I'm not understanding the question. When the person origianlly asked about AFR's I was assuming during the tuning phase, what AFR's were they tuning it for at specific RPM's vs. what AFR's I was seeing getting driving.

rotorocks

1200-1300 under boost?
were you reading it after the muffler or something?
when my car is moving, the EGT is 1400 min. 1000 in idles. Highway 1500 -1800. And according to GTAW EGT temps tread, others are at about the same temp ranges.
How did you do that? This alone already looks really suspicious.

Fanman

I'm picking up my car from my mechanic (who installed the turbo & the gauges) early this coming week. I'll ask him where he located the sensor. When my car was at idle I was usually around 700-800 when idle, and on the freeway in between 1000-1300 degrees. Again, I never really stood on the engine, to get the EGT's way up. Sounds odd (the temperature difference) but I'll follow up.

I do know my plugs (I changed them out 3X while I had my turbo on, but they were always 1 heat range colder than stock) would get fouled up a bit because I was running pretty rich (at least that is what my 2 mechanics told me) and the outfit that did my tuning told me that they did a very conservative tune on my car, and it was rich. Never got to re-tune my car to lean it out as I was supposed to go back at the beginning of next year.

BTW Rotorocks that picture in your avatar looks like some of my Greddy hoses. Ha ha.

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Yeah, 1800°F would not be abnormal for a rotary. I've seen temps as high as 2200°F on some RX-7s. On a piston motor that would be curtains for the exhaust valves. Since we don't have any, it is only the inserts that suffer.
However, as noted above, EGT tells you absolutely nothing unless you use it as a reference for a known tune.
EGT will drop on both sides of BLT.